DSK, can we believe this?

[Frenchie]

I don't know what your sources are, but on French TV,   I-TV, I heard about an hour ago that DSK denied any sexual intercourse.

As somebody wrote, NOBODY knows but them two, so we should just wait .

I don't have the feeling at all that everybody on here is trying to back him !! [blink]

I don't back anyone, if he's guilty he must pay, but until he's proven guilty, I hate this chasse à l homme.

 

[Lori]

[quote user="Frenchie"]

I don't know what your sources are, but on French TV,   I-TV, I heard about an hour ago that DSK denied any sexual intercourse.

As somebody wrote, NOBODY knows but them two, so we should just wait .

I don't have the feeling at all that everybody on here is trying to back him !! [blink]

I don't back anyone, if he's guilty he must pay, but until he's proven guilty, I hate this chasse à l homme.

 

[/quote]

Frenchie, forgive me if I am wrong, but you seem very very angry about this subject.  I feel a bit threatened just posting here.  I DO get the impression only one side of the story is being considered here.  Does it matter what I think?  NO

[cooperlola]

[quote user="Frenchie"]

 

DSK denied any sexual intercourse.

 

[/quote]Looking at the charges, then I guess he could be right there.  If he defines sexual intercourse in the way in which I usually indulge in it.

 

IF he's guilty of this or any of the other sexual harrasment in which he is alleged to be involved then he should not be in politics and represent his country as he will have diplayed a lack of integrity and respect for his fellow human being which should be a pre-requisite of public office.  WHETHER he is guilty or not - I don't know yet.  The evidence appears to be mounting up against him but I'm not sure that this is the way in which trials should be conducted (ie in advance and in the media).

[Clair]

[quote user="Frenchie"]I don't know what your sources are, but on French TV,   I-TV, I heard about an hour ago that DSK denied any sexual intercourse.[/quote]

During the audience in court, his attorney said ""The evidence, we

believe, will not be consistent with a forcible encounter".

This is taken to imply that the encounter was consensual.

[Clair]

[quote user="cooperlola"]IF he's guilty of this or any of the other sexual harrasment in which he is alleged to be involved then he should not be in politics and represent his country as he will have diplayed a lack of integrity and respect for his fellow human being which should be a pre-requisite of public office.[/quote]

Thank you for saying it so clearly.

[Frederick]

http://abcnews.go.com/US/dominique-strauss-kahn-sex-case-alleged-victims-lawyer/story?id=13627104

USA TV

[Lori]

"Dominique Strauss-Kahn, 62, has been placed on suicide watch

in his New York City jail cell and has been made to wear a special

jumpsuit, after he was arrested and charged with sodomizing a chamber

maid in his Manhattan hotel suite."

As far as I know, the crime of rape involves vaginal penetration.  Anal penetration or the attempt thereof would be considered sodomy or attempted sodomy.  So not intercourse in the dictionary version.

 

[Clair]

[quote user="Lori"]"Dominique Strauss-Kahn, 62, has been placed on suicide watch

in his New York City jail cell and has been made to wear a special

jumpsuit, after he was arrested and charged with sodomizing a chamber

maid in his Manhattan hotel suite."

As far as I know, the crime of rape involves vaginal penetration.  Anal penetration or the attempt thereof would be considered sodomy or attempted sodomy.  So not intercourse in the dictionary version.

[/quote]

If this is the thinking behind the comment, this comes from the Clinton "what constitutes sexual relations" school of thought, surely...?

[Russethouse]

[:$] OMG - too much information !!! [:$]

[Lori]

[quote user="Clair"][quote user="Lori"]"Dominique Strauss-Kahn, 62, has been placed on suicide watch

in his New York City jail cell and has been made to wear a special

jumpsuit, after he was arrested and charged with sodomizing a chamber

maid in his Manhattan hotel suite."

As far as I know, the crime of rape involves vaginal penetration.  Anal penetration or the attempt thereof would be considered sodomy or attempted sodomy.  So not intercourse in the dictionary version.

[/quote]

If this is the thinking behind the comment, this comes from the Clinton "what constitutes sexual relations" school of thought, surely...?

[/quote]

Yep, my thoughts exactly.

Sorry Russet.  You must not have read the full description of the charges.  Article below does not outline them, just another update.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/imf_head_assault

[Frederick]

And he picks a devout Muslim woman with a 15 year old daughter.

How worse can it get ?

[Lori]

Worse I'm certain.

[Jay]

Perhaps Ken Clarke can clarify what constitutes sexual relations!

[Clair]

iTélé points out that electronic keycards are used at the Sofitel NY. Their use through the locks are logged and it should be possible to ascertain who was where and at what time.

There is to be a debate shortly in the same news channel about the way the French press is seen in the Anglo-Saxon press as conniving with the political class.

Watch live: http://www.itele.fr/direct (in French).

[5-element]

itélé - very good, Clair, thank you.

[Simon-the-censored]

Wow - just managed to catch up on this post....

For goodness sake - what about the poor room maid? I just hope she has the support, courage and protection to take this low life down!

The poor woman quite obviously does have a real and understandable view of what is and is not acceptable 'human' behaviour - no matter where you come from!

Simon :-)

[Lori]

[quote user="Simon-come-lately"].

For goodness sake - what about the poor room maid? [/quote]

I know, she doesn't appear to get much support here huh.

[woolybanana]

Oh dear, I am afraid she has worse to come:

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/dominique-strauss-kahn/8521881/Dominique-Strauss-Kahn-maid-lives-in-apartment-block-for-HIV-sufferers.html

[Lori]

What a twist Wooly.

And from that same article:

"Earlier this week the maid was taken back by investigators to the suite, on

the hotel's 28th floor, and is said to have pointed to two places where she

claims she remembered spitting during the alleged assault.

An 11'-by-4' section of rug is said to have been removed from the suite for

testing, while a sink in one of the two bathrooms is being examined for

possible DNA evidence"

Yuck.

[cooperlola]

Well, in answer to the question posed by the original post - I think one is always more inclined to believe the victim because why would any woman put herself through all this?  Thankfully there are still those with enough courage to report their attackers.  Not that we yet know that DSK is one of the latter but it's easy to see why one would be inclined to believe the alleged attackee.

[idun]

[quote user="woolybanana"]

Oh dear, I am afraid she has worse to come:

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/dominique-strauss-kahn/8521881/Dominique-Strauss-Kahn-maid-lives-in-apartment-block-for-HIV-sufferers.html

[/quote]

 

She is from Africa and a widow, so I'll draw no conclusions about this lady's morals. I have read too much in the recent past about women in Africa catching HIV/AIDS from wayward husbands. And worse still, that married women who know that their spouses are ill have no right to 'refuse' to have intercourse with them and these men will not wear condoms. What a wonderful world![:@]

[fisherman]

Rape is a heinous crime and certainly in the UK I think the sentencing policy does not take it seriously enough.

It is also one of the most difficult crimes for a man to prove his innocence. Once an allegation has been made the man is guilty in many eyes and the stigma sticks even if he is found innocent.

Originally in what I gleaned from the little I have read I thought that perhaps he had behaved inappropriately (not condoning that) but the US police authorities over egged the charge with the intent of plea bargaining down to a misdemeanour.

However the last section of the article is telling.

‘’His lawyers say he denies the charges and that forensic evidence will "not be consistent with a forcible encounter".’’

‘’forcible encounter’’ the implication of this is that they may latter be claiming a consensual encounter.

I think this will get very messy. I hope the poor woman is well looked after.

[Chancer]

Well if he did sodomize her (against her will of course) maybe thats why he is on suicide watch. What goes around comes around hein?

I am watching/listening to a discussion on the TV about this as I speak "Faut-il moraliser la vie publique?", earlier on FIP they said that the majority of French people didnt believe the allegations and thought it was a complot, I have no idea where they got their figures from but it shocked me.

[Christine Animal]

Why did it shock you?

Have you ever watched any of the programmes on life dans un grand hôtel where a whole team go in and clean the rooms and have a certain time to do it in?  There are always several of them in case of theft, etc.  I think it was mentioned that this suite was something like 250 sq meters.  One maid on her own certainly had a lot of work ahead of her!

 

[Frederick]

From ABC nerws USA

Strauss-Kahn, 62, is accused of forcing the housekeeper to perform oral sex and submit to anal sex. He is also accused of sexual assault and attempted rape.

Prosecutors plan to introduce evidence that, they say, corroborates the housekeeper's story.

NYPD investigators say they brought the maid back to the room where, she says, Strauss-Kahn emerged naked from the bathroom and assaulted her. They say she pointed them to the place where she says she spat after the French politician forced her to perform oral sex.

Those fluid samples are being tested for Strauss-Kahn's DNA.

Investigators also say information downloaded from the suite door's electronic card reader indicate the maid entered the room and never closed the door. The hotel policy requires maids to leave the door open when cleaning. The open door, they say, is proof that the women entered the room to work, not to engage in consensual sex.

"There was nothing that took place in that hotel room which in any way could be construed as consensual," the woman's personal attorney, Jeffrey Shapiro, said. "This woman was absolutely the victim of a physical and sexual assault."