Please help.......insurance quandry

[opas]

I really hope that the court listens in the morning.

He has not been staying at an address, how many more times do I have to say that! He has visited my dad a couple of times and may have stayed the odd night. If he was staying in a formula 1 or the UK equivalent, that would not be classed as his home either would it?

he is a trucker, he has been doing what is known in the trade as tramping.......meaning he is out all week sleeping in his wagon. No he cannot work 7 sur 7 but if the waggon is not being used , or is waiting to be loaded, there is no reason why he cannot sleep in it!

[Russethouse]

Which court is it Opas ? PM me if you like.

[Ole Git]

[quote user="Boiling a frog"]

My sympathy for the OP has now somewhat diminished following the revalation that the husband appears to have resisted arrest and that an assistance call by the original officer resulted in 6 police cars turning up.

I am afraid that I can never find any justification for resisting arrest and neither can the courts

[/quote]

Resisted Arrest!! For What???

Opas's Husband on the given Facts has done what wrong?

He was returning to his home in France, which is his fixed address so if he had committed a RT Offence a summons would have been adequate.

His Temporary address would have been  the  Cab of  Tractor unit XXXXXX in various lay byes or Lorry  Parks, he most probably told Plod this this, but Plods like call centre staff  only understand what is on their  check list, outside the Box is out side their Plod world.

He would quite rightly be P off if a Jobsworth TD Copper started telling him he was wrong when clearly he was not.

Resisting Arrest will always be used to justify a bad  stop.

As he had not been resident within the UK for six months plus he would not need UK Registration / Insurance/ Car Tax on his Car irrespective of his reasons for being in the UK.

The UK is now the most repressive police state within most of the World, even the States and Ex Soviet states have more freedom than the UK.

To all the posters who were in the Job, Forget your past  UK Police experience, It does not matter whether your were Deputy Commissioner/ DCI a Skipper or a lowly PC  Today Police are not the same as you were Today it is Politically and points driven.

.

Opus's husband is worth more points than a Rapist, Murderer or Civil dispute;  they are the realities in Todays Britain.

Many posters have given Opas Good advice and Moral support but a few !!!!!!!!

Let them not criticise next time it could well be your Student Son/ Grandson/ Niece who has gone over the the UK to earn  some  money, or even your wife or husband  like Opas then we will see all the Pious  comments in that case.

[AnOther]

Leaving aside any talk of resisting arrest or non co-operation it seems to me that what has occured is simply the result of ignorance and overzealousness on the part of the UK police. I can't imagine that your average UK traffic cop has any greater knowledge or understanding of these issues than his equivalent flic in France.

From what you've said it seems that the question (in the police's eyes that is) of Mr O's residency is what's got him into this situation and is what will get him out and I think there might be a very simple way of establishing this.

If he is in receipt of an E106 a phone call either to DWP or HMRC (depending on which department issued it) quoting his NI number should give an instant and definitive answer. Coming from the police or a solicitor should be enought to bypass the dreaded and much abused Data Protection Act.

Good luck and keep your spirits up. I know it's natural to worry but Mr O is not in an danger and I'm sure will soon be liberated and you'll both be having a good laugh about it.

[kiss][kiss]

 

 

[Boiling a frog]

I bet you feel better after that rant based not on law but on your obvious lack of knowledge.

If the police officer believed that the person was driving without insurance then that officer has the power to seize the vehicle.

1. (Serious Organised Crime and Police Act 2005 (c. 15) Section 152)

After all it would not make much sense to allow someone to continue to drive if it was believed  they have no insurance.

The person does not have an address in the UK so a summons could hardy be sent.

If the person refuses to cooperate then the police have no other option but to arrest and therefore if he resists it is an offence.

[AnOther]

[quote user="Ole Git"]He was returning to his home in France, which is his fixed address so if he had committed a RT Offence a summons would have been adequate.

His Temporary address would have been  the  Cab of  Tractor unit XXXXXX in various lay byes or Lorry  Parks, he most probably told Plod this this, but Plods like call centre staff  only understand what is on their  check list, outside the Box is out side their Plod world.[/quote]I think you're way off base here OG

If the police suspect an offence has been commited (traffic or otherwise) then if the suspect, be he/she of British or whatever nationality, cannot provide a verifiable UK address then he/she is liable to immediate arrest and detention to be brought before a court at the earliest opportunity. It happens all the time when for instance foreign lorry drivers are involved in accident etc.

Having said that I watched one of those Road Wars programmes on TV just last night where a French registered car (coincidence) was pulled up for having too many occupants and it turned out the driver was Rumanian yet all the officers who stopped him were interested in was preventing him from continung to drive with so many people in the car !

[RicandJo]

I know of a stock of 'free Dierdre' T-shirts.

Shouldn't be too hard to doctor them........

[RicandJo]

Joking aside I wish your OH good luck for the morning.  I'm sure a magistrate with half a clue will sort this out.

 

[opas]

can I thank all the people who have sent me their best wishes and some very good advice.

I shall post the true outcome when it happens, a lot of it is hearsay, ie the duty seargent tells me he is there for insurance related matters, so I have to beleive the police don`t I?[8-)]

[opas]

[quote user="ErnieY"]

Leaving aside any talk of resisting arrest or non co-operation it seems to me that what has occured is simply the result of ignorance and overzealousness on the part of the UK police. I can't imagine that your average UK traffic cop has any greater knowledge or understanding of these issues than his equivalent flic in France.

From what you've said it seems that the question (in the police's eyes that is) of Mr O's residency is what's got him into this situation and is what will get him out and I think there might be a very simple way of establishing this.

If he is in receipt of an E106 a phone call either to DWP or HMRC (depending on which department issued it) quoting his NI number should give an instant and definitive answer. Coming from the police or a solicitor should be enought to bypass the dreaded and much abused Data Protection Act.

Good luck and keep your spirits up. I know it's natural to worry but Mr O is not in an danger and I'm sure will soon be liberated and you'll both be having a good laugh about it.

[kiss][kiss][/quote]

Do you know you are so right on that first point, we have a brit holiday home en face, he is a copper...not a beat bobby but a plain clothes one, he has not got a clue what is right and wrong as far as bringing a car to France( permanently_) so I assume he does not know the law in vice versa. And if our police in France knew the regs there would be a few less brit cars permanently driving around wouldn`t there!

No E106 that ran out a couple of years ago, he would be able to quote his NI number, as he obviously pays tax on the dosh he went to earn.....bank accounts would also quantify where he lives ..........as would our neighbours, they comment often enough that he has a great life only going away to work for a month a few times per year!!!!!!!!!!

[AnOther]

[quote user="opas"]if our police in France knew the regs there would be a few less brit cars permanently driving around wouldn`t there![/quote]Amen to that [:'(]

Even though his E106 has run out I still think it might be worth the phone call. The fact that he was demonstrably non resident plus stuff like his French driving licence and anything else he can produce to support the fact will all go down well in court, if it even get's that far, let's hope it doesn't.

Chin up and try and get a good night's sleep, you may have a long day tomorrow, here's hoping it's a successful one.

[kiss][kiss]

 

[opas]

Well talk about being caught betweena brick and a hard place!

I have honed the British Embassy in Paris....they cannot help because the incident is in UK

Ihave phoned the French Embassy in London, they cannot help because We are not French Citizens.

The MIB line is not even open yet.

My insurer was like a chocolate fireguard and said maybe this is the law in UK.

Now I am going to try the RAC to see if they can come up with anything

[Iceni]

Serious questions - If I take my French reg car to the UK am I obliged to carry CG, CT, insurance papers and evidence of identity with me at all times ? Or did I lose the right not to do this when I left ?

I am very confused as to the real reason for O being locked up - insurance seems to be valid but only if Plod reads French and is familiar with EU law, having no fixed abode possibly ? or was he less than adequately servile ?

Hopefully it will be resolved today and opas can cut down on the gin and valium.

There but for for the grace etc

[woolybananasbrother]

Did the insurance people at least say he was covered as far as they are concerned? That should be enough for a basic problem of not having insurance cover.

[cooperlola]

[quote user="Iceni"]

Serious questions - If I take my French reg car to the UK am I obliged to carry CG, CT, insurance papers and evidence of identity with me at all times ? Or did I lose the right not to do this when I left ?

I am very confused as to the real reason for O being locked up - insurance seems to be valid but only if Plod reads French and is familiar with EU law, having no fixed abode possibly ? or was he less than adequately servile ?

Hopefully it will be resolved today and opas can cut down on the gin and valium.

There but for for the grace etc

[/quote]I have taken to carrying a copy of the piece of legislation which confirms that it is not necessay to have a French driving license, whilst living in France.  Maybe I should be carrying a copy of the EU law on insurance and taxation, when I go back to the UK for holidays now!

I see that we are now approaching the time of Mr O's court appearance, so hopefully sanity will prevail shortly.  Did you manage to talk to the solicitor, Opas?

[opas]

I finaly managed to get through to the MIB and the green card bureau, who said that everyting was OK. I asked if she could fax something through to the court, which she couldn`t but said I should ring the police(too late as he was due to go in court) so I rang the court,after a quick explanation with the receptionist she put me throught to the prossecution(she should have put me to defence aparently) but the lady who answered asked me what info I did have, s I explained out who I had spoken to , she got his file and then all hell broke loose! They asked me where he was going when he was stopped, I said he had told me he had had enough and was coming home, wheres Home? south of france. Then a disussion continued in the background that his insurance was french, I explained then the principle of green card cover(and gave her the number of the green card help desk) she asked when he had left UK < I told her and roughly the time of the ferry and the ferry company, by this time I was practically sreaming down the phone because I said I had tried to explain all that to the police , I said he has a french driving licence, id card(did not mention the term TDS as it probably would not mean anything. she took my number and dashed off to the court!

 

Waiting on a phone call now!

[Will]

If it is an insurance/residence matter and nothing more sinister then the words 'wrongful arrest' spring to mind, and this link might prove interesting: http://www.wikicrimeline.co.uk/index.php?title=Wrongful_arrest

[AnOther]

We're with you Opas !

Di: no real mystery or confusion as I see it, plod decided, or at least strongly suspected that Mr O was uninsured (or worse), and without a verifable UK abode had little option but to arrest and detain him.

The question of his resisting arrest, or not, is something else subsiduary to that.

I see that Will has beaten me to the topic of unlawful arrest [;-)]

[opas]

I have just rung the court, he has not even been `dealt with` yet!

[Russethouse]

Don't they get everyone there for the same time then work through them ?

 

[AnOther]

In legal speak 10:30 in the forenoon means anytime between then and whatever time they packup for the day, typically 3:30 or 4:00 ish so you will just have to be patient.

Look on the bright side though, the longer the delay in getting into court the more chance there is of somebody coming to their senses and realising the dreadful mistake plod have made and possibly he'll never have go in front of the Beaks at all ! 

[opas]

Just the loss of liberty and dignity for nearly 3 days.

[Chancer]

Do you know what he has been charged with Opas?

If it is only for not having insurance, given that he has his vignette and green card I believe you have nothing at all to worry about, I do realise that this is a stressfull time for you but as others have said he will not come to any harm in the custody of the Police.

I do hope while he was being arrested he didnt jokingly use the cliché "you'll never take me alive copper!" - in my experience they tend to lose their sense of humour having decided themselves to make an arrest as they have at that stage decided that you are, to use their words, "a bad guy".

[opas]

According to the person I spoke with  the green card is not valid as he has been working in the UK...work that one out.

[oscar]

I've been following this story with interest.  I know that most insurances are invalidated if you use your car for work but he uses his truck doesn't he?  So, so what if he's working in the UK, he's not using his car to do that.  Hope it all resolves itself and he's soon on his way home.