Nationality

[Mr Coeur de Lion]

Seeing as most of you live in France now, how do you feel about your nationality? Do you still feel you are English (or whatever you originally are)? Or do you feel French and have more of an alleigance to France.

Just been thinking hard lately about my stand. Officially I am English (although I am also an Australian citizen), but I no longer care about England itself. I never want to live in the place again and don't support England in any sports tournaments. As I've never voted (never been in the right place at the right time to do so), I feel even less comitted to a nation and really it seems to make no difference whoevers in power, the buggers still take my money!

I don't really feel I have a nationality anymore, although I do feel closest alliegance to France out of the three nations I've lived in. Mainly because this is the country I want to be in I think.

Just wondering how other people feel about this. Do you feel stronger towards your native country because you are away from it or are you closer to France?

[Bob T]

Very difficult question. I consider myself a European, that way life is easy. I do support France in sporting events. If I missed the UK then I would move back again, but that would mean having to work for a living!

[Tony F Dordogne]

I feel more European than anything else and have done for some years, long before I moved to France.

To me nationality is, like parentage, an accident of birth.  After I've been here five years I will apply for French citizenship as I believe in the fundamental right of people to vote for their government and whilst I can have a say in the local/European elections, I also want to vote in the nationals.  I'm also joining the French Vert Party.

As for sport, I've long supported France and as a second choice Italy in rugby, England in cricket - football, don't give a toss who wins what there but France usually gets my attention. 

[Mr Coeur de Lion]

"To me nationality is, like parentage, an accident of birth."

I feel like that. Good way of putting it. Like being able to choose your friends and not your family. And the way you take sides when war happens is never based on right or wrong, but where you were born. Daft really.

Do you have to give up your English nationality if you become French? When I became Australian I was allowed to keep my UK nationality too. Is that the case with France?

[Clair]

I became a nationalised British citizen a few years ago and kept my French nationality. I don't think you can renounce it.

I usually support England, except when they're playing France...

[:'(][img]http://www.websmileys.com/sm/sad/014.gif[/img][img]http://www.websmileys.com/sm/sad/239.gif[/img][img]http://www.websmileys.com/sm/sad/1361.gif[/img][img]http://www.clicksmilies.com/s1106/traurig/sad-smiley-046.gif[/img]

[Poppy]

Like Clair said in many ways we have after 17 years renounced our British nationality but for some eternal reason in sports terms this doesn't apply. I usually support France, except when they're playing England.

[Clair]

I never would renounce French nationality anyway, it's part of who I am, part of my culture, my thinking, my being...

I chose to become a British citizen because I wanted to have a voice when I was living there.

I also wanted to acknowledge the massive impact that living in England has had on who I have become.

[Poppy]

Oh dear its getting a bit deep. I'm not sure that nationaliy is a part of who I am etc. Is the problem that we have soooo many ideas to choose from global compared to just a couple of years ago!!!

[Clair]

Having lived as long in France as in England, I have been immersed in both cultures. There is a duality in my thinking that I cannot deny. It goes deeper than "choosing an idea..."

[Tresco]

[quote user="LyndaandRichard"]Seeing as most of you live in France now, how do you feel about your nationality? Do you still feel you are English (or whatever you originally are)?
[/quote]

I describe myself as British (or British European) depending on who I'm talking to.

I feel just the same about England (where I was born and grew up) as I have always done. I'm familiar with it, and its people. The fact that I don't know what's going on in Eastenders is problematic, at times, but I still 'know' England, and even Ireland, in ways I will never 'know' France.

Having said that, I think it's possible I know slightly more about current French politics than English, and I'd expect that trend to continue. I still know slightly more about English football than French though.[:)]

 

[Lesley1952]

well although I have lived in England for quite a while and now france i still say that I am Welsh

[Teamedup]

I think I feel about being english as the french do about being french. It is what I am and I wouldn't have 'become' french even if I had taken french nationality. Simply mes moeurs are english.

I am not european. I have never wanted to be european and I do not believe or want a federal europe.

[dogwood]

Hi

 Interesting post this.

I have been asked this question before by friends and family in England. It's usualy comes along with " Why have you moved to France?I hate the French" Altough most of them don't even know any French!![:@]

I would never pressume to call myself French. I regard myself as English by birth and European by choice. I live in France because I like the French way of life. I did look at other countries in Europe but found they did not offer me what I was looking for. Now 10 years on and I still happy with my choice.

Dogwood  [8-|]

 

[LanguedocGal]

Bof!

Try being born on one continent, growing up on another completely different, having siblings and nieces with different nationalities and living in a few countries before you hit 25.

For me, place of birth is about as relevant as this tedious programme on TV at the moment  – not at all.  Most of my close friends in the UK have at least 2 or are entitled to 2, 3 or more nationalities. Hence nationality is just practical paperasserie (voting rights, facilitate travel etc) as I have a couple myself.

OK, having said all that, what do I feel I am?  I feel like a culturally rich human being, hopefully not too blinkered by any particular one[:)]…

However, I tend to support any of the Brit Isles football teams when playing other countries – strange that! [8-)]

[Turnip]

[quote user="Poppy"]

Like Clair said in many ways we have after 17 years renounced our British nationality but for some eternal reason in sports terms this doesn't apply. I usually support France, except when they're playing England.

[/quote]

 

As in Le Rugby...........[B][:D]

[Gardian]

[quote user="LyndaandRichard"] Do you feel stronger towards your native country because you are away from it or are you closer to France?
[/quote]

In terms of our day to day life, without question, closer to France - but if you live here, that wouldn't be terribly surprising. If it was, then you probably shouldn't be here.

As for allegiance - in sporting terms, then ............. say no more.  The yells at our great victory this pm would say it all.

As for politics, then we are hypocrites: we moan about the UK and the way we think it's going, yet love many aspects of it. At the end of the proverbial day, we have no legitimate say, because we are no longer resident and no longer tax payers (there).

Actually,  in many ways, we're stateless.   

[Teamedup]

Gardian, if you left the UK within the last 15 years then you can still vote in general elections there.

[Mistral]

[quote user="Clair"]I never would renounce French nationality anyway, it's part of who I am, part of my culture, my thinking, my being...
I chose to become a British citizen because I wanted to have a voice when I was living there.
I also wanted to acknowledge the massive impact that living in England has had on who I have become.
[/quote]

If you swap "British" and "French" around, then that is exactly what I would say (only not as clearly, probably)

I may have lived in France for 16 years and have French nationality, it doesn't actually make me totally French. I still react differently to some things, chose to do things differently and I will always be "l'anglaise" tothe French people I know (and it's not just because of the accent) But nor am I totally British either. I have 16 years of different experience.

I'm much more interested in French elections than British ones; they have a more immediate effect on my life. But I will support England in sporting events and if they aren't playing Scotland and then France. (this doesn't mean I support all English teams- to my pupils' confusion; if Man U are playing Lyon, I'll support Lyon)

[5-element]

I am both French (by birth, and living in France for the first 20 years of my life) and British-English, the country I chose to live in, and spent all my adult life in. Like Clair I have both nationalities French and British. I would describe myself as a contrary hybrid, i.e. usually feeling French when in the company of British people, and feeling  British when with French. In sports, I support both even when they play each other[:D]. I say I am a European as it is for me a shortcut, but I find that I often have to explain myself to people who want to put me in a slot, i.e. am I English, am I French?

Having said that, to the French I will always be French. To the British I could never be truly British, even if I was still living in Britain. When I went to live in England, it took 10 years until I could tolerate letting in a bit of my French heritage, as I had been so keen to immerse myself totally into "becoming English", which is an impossibility....So, back to how I feel in my heart: a true hybrid, even in terms of language: I still favour my acquired language (English) over French, which I am told, is a bit odd.

And I love being able to vote both in the UK and in France.[:)]

[Clair]

[quote user="5-element"]I would describe myself as a contrary hybrid, i.e. usually feeling French when in the company of British people, and feeling  British when with French... 

Having said that, to the French I will always be French. To the British I could never be truly British

I still favour my acquired language (English) over French, which I am told, is a bit odd.

And I love being able to vote both in the UK and in France.[:)][/quote]

Very well put 5-E! That makes 2 of us [:)]

[Chief]

A few here seem to be dwelling on the support for sport aspect of this question.  Perhaps another way to look at this would be:

If you had to (note the words 'had to') bear arms for either your country of birth or country of residence, which would it be?

Might be a strange way of putting it, but i often find that true feelings come out when the proposed situation becomes a little to the extremities

[Clair]

isn't sport a milder kind of war?

[Mr Coeur de Lion]

I personally wouldn't bear arms for any country (again that goes back to taking sides of where you were born, rather than who is right and who is wrong). Think the politicians who create these wars should do the fighting. They normally start the things.

If England went to war with France, I'd probably go back to Australia until the idiots sorted their problems out.

I think sport is a reasonable analogy of how a person feels towards their nationality, which is probably why it has been brought up.

Just to clarify, is it possible for someone to have both a British passport and a French one too?

[samdebretagne]

[quote user="LyndaandRichard"]Just to clarify, is it possible for someone to have both a British passport and a French one too?

[/quote]

Yes, it is.  Several people on this thread have even stated they had dual citizenship - do you not believe them?

[Georgina]

If you call a Scot, Welsh or Irish. person English, they usually put you right. If you called an English person any of those, they would not flinch[:)], they mostly see themselves as British. We are not allowed to put up flags in England for fear of offending others, we are not encouraged to be English.  That's why IMHO it's easier for the English to come to France, because they feel like an outsider in England anyway.

Georgina