Will Posted March 30, 2010 Share Posted March 30, 2010 Use of the terms 'rose coloured glasses' and 'idyllic utopia' imply a view from afar. Many of us accused of such an outlook about Britain actually live there. I can't speak for others but I am certainly aware that Utopia does not exist, and my view of Britain (and France) is based on what I see through my own eyes unencumbered by specs of any tint. There's plenty wrong with Britain, but I don't beat myself up about it from across the Channel.As I said before, some of us are prepared to accept immigrants with a positive mind; others have an inbuilt mistrust of anybody not the same as themselves.Perhaps Huguenot descent gives rise to liberal outlooks? I too am directly descended from such, as well as those other serial immigrants the Irish, but a good half of my genetic makeup is about as pure English as you can find, with all the illegitimacy, incest and suicidal tendencies that contains. For so few people those Huguenots must have been prolific breeders to have so many descendants. Anyway, the Huguenots were chucked out of France for daring to practice a religion that was not approved by the state and the silent majority - the Moslems of the 17th century maybe? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
velcorin Posted March 30, 2010 Share Posted March 30, 2010 Original question was, could this happen in France? Answer from a number of people was an absolute yes.Any chance of such an indepth analysis of France? [:D] It would be interesting (particularly the Magrebi and Slav immigration). Call me Mr Thick, but I am still confused. Please correct me if I am wrong, YOU perceive immigration is a problem, n'est pas? You've obviously spent a conciderable time looking for evidence to support your arguement. Presumeably there was absolutely no evidence that supported immigration as a good thing? I'll trust your integrity on that point. However,what is the solution? Send all immigrants home? Full stop on immigration? An interview panel with appointees approved by Gluestick? Does it become as simple as, white South African OK, black South African not OK? This where I, as wooly minded liberal socialist have a problem. I don't see where you are providing an answer to a problem you are seeing, a problem which I don't see.PS (and to keep it simple) you can apply for the French equivalent of Family Credit from Day 1. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NormanH Posted March 30, 2010 Share Posted March 30, 2010 "I find this thread hugely amusing from a certain perspective: the very posters who are amongst the first to try and dispel misconceptions from newbies to France and wannabees as “Rose Coloured Glasses Syndrome”, suffer the identical same myopic difficulty when they write so passionately about life in the UK now!"I for one am not writing about 'life in the UK now'.You persist in being irrelevant to the topic 'Do they try this on in France ?'Irrelevance, generalisation, conflation and ad hominem abuse are the tools of those who are too intellectually feeble to mount an argued case.I obviously do not share your politics, but if you must vent your spleen at least try to keep to the point.Your most recent post mentions neither Romanians (thankfully, since your lack of intellectual finesses prevents you from distinguishing individual abuses from general behaviour) nor France . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
velcorin Posted March 30, 2010 Share Posted March 30, 2010 Forgot to further point out that if Romanians did try this in France, it would be nigh on impossible to remove them within 6 months. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pachapapa Posted March 30, 2010 Share Posted March 30, 2010 .....“I did business many years ago with a Nigerian lady: educated at Benendon and Oxford: a barrister: she spoke just like the Princess Royal on the ‘phone.”....http://www.benenden.kent.sch.uk/Pages/Index.aspxAnd did she miscegenate with a nice white lad from Cranbrook?[:D] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Russethouse Posted March 30, 2010 Share Posted March 30, 2010 [quote user="Will"] For so few people those Huguenots must have been prolific breeders to have so many descendants. Anyway, the Huguenots were chucked out of France for daring to practice a religion that was not approved by the state and the silent majority - the Moslems of the 17th century maybe? [/quote]Very prolific, Martha de Gilbert, one of my husbands ancestors had 20 children. Perhaps there is something about being an immigrant that pre disposes women of child bearing age to have large numbers of children ?Gluey, Its true that said ancestors went to Ireland but in MH ancestors case this was because he was given land at Port Arlington by the King - I doubt he was the only one..Maybe I'm wrong,but I understood there were and still are Hugeonot churches in London ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Will Posted March 30, 2010 Share Posted March 30, 2010 [quote user="velcorin"]Original question was, could this happen in France? Answer from a number of people was an absolute yes.However,what is the solution? Send all immigrants home? [/quote]It would appear that the French solution is to dump their illegal immigrants in another EU country [:P]http://www.pbo.co.uk/news/448438/frenchmen-jailed-for-smuggling-illegal-immigrants-on-yacht Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quillan Posted March 30, 2010 Share Posted March 30, 2010 [quote user="Russethouse"][quote user="Will"] For so few people those Huguenots must have been prolific breeders to have so many descendants. Anyway, the Huguenots were chucked out of France for daring to practice a religion that was not approved by the state and the silent majority - the Moslems of the 17th century maybe? [/quote]Very prolific, Martha de Gilbert, one of my husbands ancestors had 20 children. Perhaps there is something about being an immigrant that pre disposes women of child bearing age to have large numbers of children ?Gluey, Its true that said ancestors went to Ireland but in MH ancestors case this was because he was given land at Port Arlington by the King - I doubt he was the only one..Maybe I'm wrong,but I understood there were and still are Hugeonot churches in London ? [/quote]Try Googling "Hugeonot churches in London" and "Hugeonot churches in the UK", basically yes there are. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Benjamin Posted March 30, 2010 Share Posted March 30, 2010 Just a minute,Will.[:-))]A Frenchman called Nelson!!!!!! [:P] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Will Posted March 30, 2010 Share Posted March 30, 2010 He must have had a difficult childhood (don't mention Trafalgar)... [:)]Here's a Huguenot church in London. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quillan Posted March 30, 2010 Share Posted March 30, 2010 Loved the post Gluestick but it does contain some misleading information.Lets start with the Huguenots and you said "Thus their acceptance into Britain was conditional. And they had to undertake to be self-supporting.", well I guess that's pretty understandable because there was no state welfare system back then.Of course there are more immigrants in London because most of them work in the service industries, clean offices etc and its where the money is. Claiming housing benefit does not always mean that they are unemployed, it can also mean they are on a lower income.According to The Independent and Channel 4 there's around 250,000 failed asylum seekers living illegally in Britain, not 1M. Many of those have launched appeals of which only 20% on average are successful the rest are deported after appeal and normally within 48hrs (UKBA).Prison statistics that you quoted show a steady increase in the prison population but the breakdown by ethnicity as a percentage is only varying a little. This can be explained quite easily. It is, as you said a fact that the prison population is currently exploding but that because of the recession and as more people loose their jobs they are turning to crime. Immigrants are usually the first to be hit and find it more difficult that whites to find new jobs which is why percentage wise the number is increasing.If as many have said Labour have deliberately allowed immigrants in to basically vote for them and there are millions of them I guess we can expect a Labour victory at the next election.As for the Chinese raping the shoreline of shell fish I believe they work as 'gangs' for English companies.History has repeatedly shown that when the economists get it wrong and the economy goes tits up the people hit first are the working class. It seems to me that what we are seeing is a group of people being picked upon because they are an easy target. This whole immigrant thing in my mind is just a way of deflecting blame away from those that have really caused the problems in the UK namely the financial institutions and the government. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
5-element Posted March 30, 2010 Share Posted March 30, 2010 For those who might still be interested, here is an article about the Romanian gouvernment mounting a campaign of information for countries like Spain and Italy, to dispel some of the myths and misinformation about Romanians.http://observers.france24.com/en/content/20080930-romanian-roma-spain-italy-advertising-campaign-reputation-immigrantsApologies for being unable to use the live link function - my software refuses to do it! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NormanH Posted March 30, 2010 Share Posted March 30, 2010 [quote user="5-element"]For those who might still be interested, here is an article about the Romanian gouvernment mounting a campaign of information for countries like Spain and Italy, to dispel some of the myths and misinformation about Romanians.http://observers.france24.com/en/content/20080930-romanian-roma-spain-italy-advertising-campaign-reputation-immigrantsApologies for being unable to use the live link function - my software refuses to do it![/quote]http://observers.france24.com/en/content/20080930-romanian-roma-spain-italy-advertising-campaign-reputation-immigrants Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gluestick Posted March 30, 2010 Share Posted March 30, 2010 Quillan said:[quote]Loved the post Gluestick but it does contain some misleading information.Lets start with the Huguenots and you said "Thus their acceptance into Britain was conditional. And they had to undertake to be self-supporting.", well I guess that's pretty understandable because there was no state welfare system back then.[/quote]Structural problem here, Q.Benefit systems internationally, usually work on the basis of majority paying in for N years to create eligibility.Perhaps all these posts on this forum going back to 2005 are therefore total BS and apocryphal?http://www.completefrance.com/cs/forums/1/1191912/ShowPost.aspx#1191912http://www.completefrance.com/cs/forums/1/497559/ShowPost.aspx#497559http://www.completefrance.com/cs/forums/562819/ShowPost.aspx [quote]Of course there are more immigrants in London because most of them work in the service industries, clean offices etc and its where the money is. Claiming housing benefit does not always mean that they are unemployed, it can also mean they are on a lower income.[/quote]Agreed: however, allowing say, Westminster to have in excess of 50% of persons not born in UK indicates a trend, surely?[quote]According to The Independent and Channel 4 there's around 250,000 failed asylum seekers living illegally in Britain, not 1M. Many of those have launched appeals of which only 20% on average are successful the rest are deported after appeal and normally within 48hrs (UKBA). [/quote]Fact is, no one actually knows: since the Home Office rapidly became an adminstrative failure which is precisely why NuLab boosted the Hard Man, John Reid to be Home Sec: and he split the organ in two.[quote]Prison statistics that you quoted show a steady increase in the prison population but the breakdown by ethnicity as a percentage is only varying a little. This can be explained quite easily. It is, as you said a fact that the prison population is currently exploding but that because of the recession and as more people loose their jobs they are turning to crime. Immigrants are usually the first to be hit and find it more difficult that whites to find new jobs which is why percentage wise the number is increasing.[/quote]The stats are stale (All I could obtain which were credible): lots has changed since 2001/02: however, there is an undeniable correlation between, say one group of ethnic identities and their proportion of total population.Google "Muslim Population of British Prisons" for more info.[quote]If as many have said Labour have deliberately allowed immigrants in to basically vote for them and there are millions of them I guess we can expect a Labour victory at the next election.[/quote]Fact; not anecdotal: Andrew Neather blew the whistle on this last year. And he was one of the architects of the covert strategy. Don't trsut my statement: Google it. It is all in the mainstream media.[quote]As for the Chinese raping the shoreline of shell fish I believe they work as 'gangs' for English companies.[/quote]Not in this case: they are all opportunists. The point here is that for hundreds of years, people living in UK have developed a shall we say, respectful culture.Those coming from abroad have grown up in a "Dog Eat Dog" culture; which contradicts British social mores.Thus herein is one of the instant confrontational difficulties.[quote]History has repeatedly shown that when the economists get it wrong and the economy goes tits up the people hit first are the working class. It seems to me that what we are seeing is a group of people being picked upon because they are an easy target. This whole immigrant thing in my mind is just a way of deflecting blame away from those that have really caused the problems in the UK namely the financial institutions and the government.[/quote]The Sub Prime Crisis and economic disaster did not hit until early 2008: NuLab's covert policy on immigration commenced soon after Blair came to power in 1997.Thus sadly, Q, that one doesn't play in Peoria.[:)] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NormanH Posted March 30, 2010 Share Posted March 30, 2010 "Those coming from abroad have grown up in a "Dog Eat Dog" culture; which contradicts British social mores."Yet another fine example of a logical fallacy to add to the list : ignorant unsubstantiated assertionLet me help you with some examples.Here are some of the Romanians (I believe they are the topic [8-)]) whom we must fear: note their 'Dog eat Dog culture.http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T_BUo3eJMGEThen there are the ones who are so primitive they don't understand that they shouldn't kill he chickens that have been giving them eggs [:D]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K2c5hLJQrz8&feature=relatedThese are just two videos from a town in Eastern Romania, almost into the Ukraine, which still has active shipbuilding and steel-making, just like Britain before the Conservativeswatch out for this couple though: they look as if they are planning to emigrate and squat in a house belonging to an 'indigenous' Britonhttp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tZOQ1dy-pNk&feature=related Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ebaynut Posted March 30, 2010 Share Posted March 30, 2010 I am sorry, you are correct, immigrant do make a positive contribution to the UK. They have just provided me with an hour or more of entertainment in a jolly little program called "cops with cameras" on ITV3. What a pleasure it was to watch this multicultural experience as they helped our brave boys in blue with their enquires.No less then SIX cases were featured, and not one was of anybody who was "White English". No doubt the lazy white scum were all laying in their beds, drawing dole and receiving housing benefit, while these brave young immigrants worked hard to provide us with our nights entertainment. After this wonderful display of their lifestyle in the UK was over, the News at Ten started, yet again they provided the main story, it told how Leroy ( name changed to protect his rights) had murdered his two young children to teach their mother a lesson. O' how we laughed as the interpreter struggled to communicate with him, and the joy it brought me and my family to know she must be charging £100 plus per hour for this valuable service.I think this multicultural thing may catch on. [geek] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Russethouse Posted March 30, 2010 Share Posted March 30, 2010 Careful - if we have a group in society offending and making a problem like this what does it say about us ( you know, the White English ) and how we dealt with these lads (or lasses come to that ) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NormanH Posted March 30, 2010 Share Posted March 30, 2010 " No doubt the lazy white scum were all laying in their beds" What were they laying do you think? Eggs ?Fortunately Trevor McDonald has a better command of English than this. Perhaps he could give you lessons as part of his contribution ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ebaynut Posted March 30, 2010 Share Posted March 30, 2010 [quote user="NormanH"]" No doubt the lazy white scum were all laying in their beds" What were they laying do you think? Eggs ?Fortunately Trevor McDonald speaks better English.[/quote]Theys laying their WOmen !!!!!! innit M8 [+o(]And its SIR Trevor BTW. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NormanH Posted March 31, 2010 Share Posted March 31, 2010 [quote user="ebaynut"][quote user="NormanH"]" No doubt the lazy white scum were all laying in their beds" What were they laying do you think? Eggs ?Fortunately Trevor McDonald speaks better English.[/quote]Theys laying their WOmen !!!!!! innit M8 [+o(]And its SIR Trevor BTW.[/quote]Somebody must think he has made a positive contribution then [:)] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gluestick Posted March 31, 2010 Share Posted March 31, 2010 [quote user="NormanH"]"Those coming from abroad have grown up in a "Dog Eat Dog" culture; which contradicts British social mores."Yet another fine example of a logical fallacy to add to the list : ignorant unsubstantiated assertion[/quote]Now, if anyone is ignorant in this context, then it is you, Norm!Try, some time, researching the realities of all COMECON states and the Soviet Blok: also evaluate the realities of Romanian life under Nicolae Ceauşescu. However, and as always, you have taken my statement totally out of context: I was writing about Chinese shellfish bed destroyers as opportunists: and if you had any actual knowledge about Hong Kong etc, then you would realise how apt my statement was: and how foolish your response.Now Norm, I trust you will castigate all those posters who have erred in failing to diligently ensure their posts have not strayed from the core premise of the OP's thread.This would include yourself![quote]Romania and Bulgaria became members of the EU in 2007, so travel became easier.Poland was already in, so Poles had already begun to go to the UK in search of workRomanian is a Latin language, close to Italian so Italy and Spain (and to a lesser extent Portugal) have been natural destinations for Romanians looking to work abroad.Work in these countries has dried up.[/quote]So; what's Spain, Italy and Portugal have to do with the OP's topic please?[:P] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Swissie Posted March 31, 2010 Share Posted March 31, 2010 Can any of you clever clogs put here Dan&Dan the Daily Mail song - please. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pachapapa Posted March 31, 2010 Share Posted March 31, 2010 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5eBT6OSr1TI Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Russethouse Posted March 31, 2010 Share Posted March 31, 2010 This ?http://videosift.com/video/Dan-Dan-The-Daily-Mail-Song Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mint Posted March 31, 2010 Share Posted March 31, 2010 [quote user="ebaynut"][quote user="NormanH"]" No doubt the lazy white scum were all laying in their beds" What were they laying do you think? Eggs ?Fortunately Trevor McDonald speaks better English.[/quote]Theys laying their WOmen !!!!!! innit M8 [+o(]And its SIR Trevor BTW.[/quote]Ah, misogynist tendencies as well.............Anyway, talking about Roumanians, I for one am glad to be on the same planet as this glorious Roumanian. Let's see if her singing might not soothe a couple of savage breasts on here (is that Shakespeare I have to apologise to?[:D]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_OIExoUb8jk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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