Miki Posted November 9, 2005 Share Posted November 9, 2005 "....Nah . . . . some people just resort to anything when they have lost an argument is all."They sure do Ray, shall we go through the sheer number of wars the USA have been involved in since the end of the 2nd World War ? No sense in talking or negotiating eh ????????????? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ron Avery Posted November 9, 2005 Share Posted November 9, 2005 [quote]Hello Are Muslims a race or are they members of a religious group? If they are the former then it would be classed as offensive to say unkind things about them but surely if it is the latter then its...[/quote]The muslim "nation" and community seems to be a media creation. Surely it just a religion in the same way as Hindus and Catholics. I don't remember the UK Government rushing to consult and reassure the "Catholic community" during the IRA troubles, do you? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Viv Posted November 9, 2005 Share Posted November 9, 2005 I don't think it is a media creation at all.I think that many Muslims ( perhaps the poorer/ less educated ) do tend to define themselves by their religion first and nationality second. I think that this was why some British born muslims acted the way they did in July. Don't get me wrong, I am not and never would say that all muslims are terrorists etc but I met many young muslims in Britain, who would align themselves more closely to a muslim country than their country of birth.I think this is a real barrier to full integration and one that is difficult for the uk to overcome. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony F Dordogne Posted November 9, 2005 Share Posted November 9, 2005 "but when did religious hatred become a crime?"Like it or not, religious hatred is a crime in some countries especially when linked to race. Perhaps if religious hatred was a crime in the UK then some of the rubbish in Northern Ireland might not have happened on BOTH sides - big might though.2000 years AD and religious hatred is still 'informing' decisions we make about other people rather than find out what really makes them think the way that they do, not much change there then. Just change the religions as you want to, all interchangable, Catholics, Protestants, Jews, Muslims, Hindus, Sikhs, and most, at one time or another, tearing each other to bits, really or figuratively. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
le bouffon Posted November 9, 2005 Share Posted November 9, 2005 The point being the muslims you are talking about where not from a poor background one was a teacher no less.Sorry, the same murderers did not learn how to make bombs in the UK they got it from outside the UK.Some while ago I heard an interview with a leading Muslim scholar,the interviewer asked what is the ultimate goal of the muslims in the UK,and he answered to see the UK under sharia law!!!!!and that was on the bbc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mutts Posted November 9, 2005 Share Posted November 9, 2005 The muslim faith is surely one which encompasses a whole way of life. Because of this religious culture, can they ever fully integrate and/or do they want to?It's often been asked on these forums, to what extent is it necessary to integrate with the French way of life? After some debate on the meaning of "integrate", it's generally been agreed that provided you try to mix to some extent, live peaceable and within the law, it's very much up to the individual. But within how many faiths would "family honour" dictate ordering your sons to murder their sister's boyfriend? http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/oxfordshire/4407728.stm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Viv Posted November 9, 2005 Share Posted November 9, 2005 The one was a teaching assistant, which is considerably different than being a fully qualified teacher.I don't think you can tar the wishes of all Muslims on the basis of what one extremist 'scholar/ cleric' says. But I agree it is worrying that some people do think that way.Religion through the ages has and continues to have, an awful lot to answer for! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Val_2 Posted November 11, 2005 Share Posted November 11, 2005 My daughter came home from studies in St.Brieuc last night and said there had been two nights of burning cars and rioting but not on the scale of Paris. This was down near the unversity sector alongside the N12. Her classmate who lodges down there came back sozzled in the evening and was asked to drive her car some distance away even though she was legally unfit to drive. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RayB Posted November 11, 2005 Share Posted November 11, 2005 [quote]"....Nah . . . . some people just resort to anything when they have lost an argument is all."They sure do Ray, shall we go through the sheer number of wars the USA have been involved in since the end ...[/quote]Well, let's see . . . . it was 12 years of talks with Saddam . . . . how many more years would you think was adequate? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alcazar Posted November 11, 2005 Share Posted November 11, 2005 [quote]Well, let's see . . . . it was 12 years of talks with Saddam . . . . how many more years would you think was adequate?[/quote]Ah, come on Ray.........we're not that naive, (sp?)BTW: I read recently that the US have bombed 68 different countries since the end of WW2. Is that a fact, or something the media have made up again?Alcazar Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Miki Posted November 11, 2005 Share Posted November 11, 2005 "...Well, let's see . . . . it was 12 years of talks with Saddam . . . . how many more years would you think was adequate?"Nicely side stepped but not good enough, the main question was just how many wars had the USA been involved in since World War 2. I believe it will go a long way proving that "discussing" is not an Americans best point but putting their will on other countries is.As far as talks, let's think a while also as to who helped to put Saddam in power ? And 12 years of talks, oh yes of course. So how strange then that after 12 years, it all fell down on the weapon issue, even when the inspectors found nothing. Oh I know, they were not allowed proper access, that was a beauty. So that was the talking out of the way and what then, oh yes, well he has them so well hidden we will just have to go in and find them. As has been proved that was not very clever either now, was it. One main question comes from this, either the US have the most pathetic intelligence network on the planet or Bush couldn't give a toss and went in with or without their advice, what's your choice ? Either way, there is something not quite right about it all...(that's this weekends big understatement for you !)Why can I smell oil ?????????? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony F Dordogne Posted November 11, 2005 Share Posted November 11, 2005 Hi RayNot to mention the fact that when Asama ben Ladin was on our side in Afghanistan and Saddam Hussein was on our side against the Iranians, the USA was only too pleased to arm and fund that little lot, it's in the Congressional records of all the payments and they US government was open about the funding/arms deals.Chile, Contra scandal etc ......... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deimos Posted November 11, 2005 Share Posted November 11, 2005 Not strictly relevant to the original post in the thread but in relation to "...Well, let's see . . . . it was 12 years of talks with Saddam . . . . how many more years would you think was adequate?" it is worth noting that when the US/UK invaded Iraq, Iraq may have broken many UN Security council resolutions, but Israel have broken quite a few more (numerically speaking). When it comes to using a veto in the UN security council the country that has used most vetoes is, yes the US (followed by the UK).Also, Not to mention the fact that when Asama ben Ladin was on our side in Afghanistan - not only did the US fund al Quieda but they also sent CIA operatives to train them !!Ian Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RayB Posted November 13, 2005 Share Posted November 13, 2005 [quote]Ah, come on Ray.........we're not that naive, (sp?) BTW: I read recently that the US have bombed 68 different countries since the end of WW2. Is that a fact, or something the media have made up again...[/quote]**BTW: I read recently that the US have bombed 68 different countries since the end of WW2. Is that a fact, or something the media have made up again?**No I didn't. Did they say why or were we just being cranky or showing off? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RayB Posted November 13, 2005 Share Posted November 13, 2005 [quote]Not strictly relevant to the original post in the thread but in relation to "...Well, let's see . . . . it was 12 years of talks with Saddam . . . . how many more years would you think was adequate?"...[/quote]Gosh, people, you would think you just didn't like us anymore . . . . or is it just me? In either case, I really don't care about your opinions. You are welcome to them, of course. As you folk are fond of saying - 'Sorry!'. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
le bouffon Posted November 13, 2005 Share Posted November 13, 2005 I for one do not know why certain "sorts" always berate the USA,maybe it`s the green eyed monster. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Turnip Posted November 13, 2005 Share Posted November 13, 2005 Will these riots cause a reduction in house prices? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Turnip Posted November 13, 2005 Share Posted November 13, 2005 Will these riots cause a reduction in house prices? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alcazar Posted November 13, 2005 Share Posted November 13, 2005 [quote]Will these riots cause a reduction in house prices?[/quote]Is there an echo? I doubt it, does anything?Le Bouffon: Why do some folk berate the USA? Well, it could have something to do with pots that call kettles black?Alcazar Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alcazar Posted November 13, 2005 Share Posted November 13, 2005 [quote]Will these riots cause a reduction in house prices?[/quote]Is there an echo? I doubt it, does anything?Le Bouffon: Why do some folk berate the USA? Well, it could have something to do with pots that call kettles black?Alcazar Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alcazar Posted November 13, 2005 Share Posted November 13, 2005 [quote]Will these riots cause a reduction in house prices?[/quote]Is there an echo? I doubt it, does anything?Le Bouffon: Why do some folk berate the USA? Well, it could have something to do with pots that call kettles black?Alcazar Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alcazar Posted November 13, 2005 Share Posted November 13, 2005 [quote]Will these riots cause a reduction in house prices?[/quote]Is there an echo? I doubt it, does anything?Le Bouffon: Why do some folk berate the USA? Well, it could have something to do with pots that call kettles black?Alcazar Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
le bouffon Posted November 13, 2005 Share Posted November 13, 2005 And so it goes...... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Miki Posted November 13, 2005 Share Posted November 13, 2005 "..... or is it just me? In either case, I really don't care about your opinions"Mmmmm can't see why Americans who speak like this are dumbed down myself. If I didn't know better, I might be mistaken for thinking that dear Ray is either an Army General or GWB himself................And perhaps old bouffon can tell us exactly why, we should be jealous of the USA ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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