Kitty Posted January 11, 2011 Share Posted January 11, 2011 So what do you think about Obama's comment that France is a bigger ally than the UK? Mmmm. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Russethouse Posted January 11, 2011 Share Posted January 11, 2011 That he needs to remember recent history. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Coeur de Lion Posted January 11, 2011 Share Posted January 11, 2011 Well, Obama is about as close as you're going to get in terms of socialism in America, so perhaps he's talking from that point of view? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quillan Posted January 11, 2011 Share Posted January 11, 2011 Personally looking back at post WW2 history I wouldn't like to be friends with the US. Some of their 'crusades against terrorism and communism' makes me wonder who the real antagonists really are. My advise, should I ever be asked which is probably never, to France is keep at arms (probably not the best word to use) length. If you 'punt' around the web it seems that a lot of Americans don't like France, not that they have ever visited nor probably stepped foot outside the US. I even read somewhere not that long ago that in the War of Independence France now played a very inconsequential roll in the winning, in fact they claimed they would have won without them. Mind you the Americans are quit good at rewriting history, think Robin Hood etc. If it we me they said it about I would nip back and collect my present (Statue of Liberty). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pachapapa Posted January 11, 2011 Share Posted January 11, 2011 A discrete reference to Lafayette and the Hermione. I leave you too google but would note that the exact relica of the Hermione being built in the old cordage buildings at Rochefort is well worth the visit if visiting the La Rochelle area.http://www.hermione.com/en/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gluestick Posted January 11, 2011 Share Posted January 11, 2011 [quote user="Cathy"]So what do you think about Obama's comment that France is a bigger ally than the UK? Mmmm.[/quote]That's probably why De Gaulle pulled France out of NATO then in 1966..............[Www] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DerekJ Posted January 11, 2011 Share Posted January 11, 2011 If that's what he really said and meant let's put it to the test. Pull all British military out and let France provide the backfill. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quillan Posted January 11, 2011 Share Posted January 11, 2011 [quote user="DerekJ"]If that's what he really said and meant let's put it to the test. Pull all British military out and let France provide the backfill.[/quote]Couldn't agree with you more but then why should there be a need for a backfill? Europe needs to stop being involved in American 'wars'. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DerekJ Posted January 11, 2011 Share Posted January 11, 2011 [quote user="Quillan"]........but then why should there be a need for a backfill? Europe needs to stop being involved in American 'wars'.[/quote]Q, agreed but just commenting on the current situation where we are still the US puppet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sprogster Posted January 11, 2011 Share Posted January 11, 2011 Not sure he would be supported by the average US person on the street, as there is still a lot of mistrust of the French by US Joe public, since the Iraq war, as captioned by the famous US name of 'Cheese eating surrender monkies'!!Anyway, President Obama, is so unpopular in the USA it looks likely he will become a lame duck President, having been routed in the mid term elections and his chances of re-election look increasingly unlikely. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kitty Posted January 11, 2011 Author Share Posted January 11, 2011 I am quite incensed by Obama's remarks, which are so untrue. Think Nato? Think Iraq? I would be particularly angry if I was a mother of a British soldier. It really is time to pull out our troops from Afghanistan. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woolybanana Posted January 11, 2011 Share Posted January 11, 2011 Well, Obama has always had a down on the British. Apparently his father got into some trouble in Kenya prior to independence.However, this will teach the Brits to go on whining about the 'Special Relationship' which has always been a one way street as far as I can see. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pachapapa Posted January 11, 2011 Share Posted January 11, 2011 [quote user="Cathy"]I am quite incensed by Obama's remarks, which are so untrue. Think Nato? Think Iraq? I would be particularly angry if I was a mother of a British soldier. It really is time to pull out our troops from Afghanistan.[/quote]Pulling the troops out of Afghanistan could be a productive measure.The latest US diplomatic documents released by Wikileaks contain harsh criticism of the UK military effort in Afghanistan from 2007 to 2009.The cables say US officials and Afghan President Hamid Karzai believed UK forces were not up to the task of securing Helmand province on their own.The president reportedly said he was relieved when US Marines were sent to the province.The details have been published in the Guardian newspaper.In one cable, a US general, Dan McNeill, was said to be “particularly dismayed by the British effort” in fighting the drugs trade in Afghanistan.He is quoted as saying that British forces had “made a mess” of counter-narcotics operations in Helmand by employing the “wrong” tactics.http://news.sky.com/skynews/Home/UK-News/WikiLeaks-Afghan-Criticism-Of-UK-Military-Revealed-In-Leaked-Cables/Article/201012115845510 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gluestick Posted January 11, 2011 Share Posted January 11, 2011 [quote user="Cathy"]I am quite incensed by Obama's remarks, which are so untrue. Think Nato? Think Iraq? I would be particularly angry if I was a mother of a British soldier. It really is time to pull out our troops from Afghanistan.[/quote]Indeed.Must be remembered that France did participate, willingly, in Desert Storm.The Afghanistan conflict is simply about the UNOCOL (Originally) planned Oil and Gas pipeline from the Caspian Sea.See Here:Iraq Two was simply about oil: to favour the US monopoly of the majors and to feed America's insatiable profligate over-consumption in order to allow their flawed economy to continue as is.No fluke, naturally, that Papa Bush, Cheney and Rumsfield are deeply involved in the oil and gas biz.Blair simply became G W Bush's malleable poodle: and thereafter lied through his shiny teeth about WMDs, Moral Causes, Regime Changes and all the other guff.Meantime, young men and women who had joined Britain's armed forces to serve their country and Queen with honour, loyalty and commitment were used simply as cannon fodder in the wholly venal cause of corrupt lying politicians and behind-the-scenes corporate power brokers: and Britain's idiot taxpayers continue to pay for the wholesale slaughter of their sons and daughters.America have been so successful at managing these two conflicts, they could not even manufacture sufficient ball to meet demand!See Here:This has been the most totally disgraceful and heinous period in Britain's proud military history.Just shows what happens when one allows lying cheating political monkeys to control a rocket.[:@] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crossy67 Posted January 11, 2011 Share Posted January 11, 2011 Edited for fear of deportation for some crime not yet identified lol. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kitty Posted January 11, 2011 Author Share Posted January 11, 2011 Despite living in France, I have been an 'Atlantist', probably because a number of my relatives fought in WW2 along side Americans.I was brought up to believe that you stood behind, beside, underneath friends - i.e. supporting them through thick and thin. I believed Blair when he said that we should stand 'shoulder to shoulder' with our American cousins. That was a time when I think that Blair looked at history and tried to understand its lessons. I had believed from time to time, New Labour had failed to look at history but after '9/11', Blair was solid as a friend should be.So it is galling that despite supporting the US in their wars and losing many of our soldiers, they should court their new "best friend", France.I am saddened and disappointed at Obama's remarks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Russethouse Posted January 11, 2011 Share Posted January 11, 2011 But there was never any proof that Iraq was anything to do with 9/11: http://www.seattlepi.com/national/140133_bushiraq18.htmlIts a shame Blair wasn't a friend to the British electorate who clearly did not want to support the war in Iraq.Still as you say it is disapointing that our input seems not to have been appreciated. Perhaps next time we'll hasten more slowly Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Simon Posted January 11, 2011 Share Posted January 11, 2011 There is no special relationship, the US uses whoever for whatever serves its purpose at the time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thibault Posted January 12, 2011 Share Posted January 12, 2011 [quote user="pachapapa"] [quote user="Cathy"]I am quite incensed by Obama's remarks, which are so untrue. Think Nato? Think Iraq? I would be particularly angry if I was a mother of a British soldier. It really is time to pull out our troops from Afghanistan.[/quote]Pulling the troops out of Afghanistan could be a productive measure.The latest US diplomatic documents released by Wikileaks contain harsh criticism of the UK military effort in Afghanistan from 2007 to 2009.The cables say US officials and Afghan President Hamid Karzai believed UK forces were not up to the task of securing Helmand province on their own.The president reportedly said he was relieved when US Marines were sent to the province.The details have been published in the Guardian newspaper.In one cable, a US general, Dan McNeill, was said to be “particularly dismayed by the British effort” in fighting the drugs trade in Afghanistan.He is quoted as saying that British forces had “made a mess” of counter-narcotics operations in Helmand by employing the “wrong” tactics.http://news.sky.com/skynews/Home/UK-News/WikiLeaks-Afghan-Criticism-Of-UK-Military-Revealed-In-Leaked-Cables/Article/201012115845510[/quote] Well there was an interesting report in the paper a week or so ago which said that the US military had suffered heavier losses in Helmand than the British in a similar period of time and that US generals were beginning to think that perhaps the British had not been so "weak" and "cowardly" as previously thought. The US, it seems, abandoned the UK strategy of capturing and holding areas in a circle around the main town (whose name for the moment escapes me) to protect the citizens of that town and allow "normal" life to continue and, as a result, the town was now coming under attack by the Taliban and "normal" life was becoming impossible again.The tone of the article seemed to imply that perhaps the US had been rather too harsh in its assessment of the British effort. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gluestick Posted January 12, 2011 Share Posted January 12, 2011 [quote user="Russethouse"]But there was never any proof that Iraq was anything to do with 9/11: http://www.seattlepi.com/national/140133_bushiraq18.html[/quote]Bang on the nail, Russet.Furthermore, Cheney and Rumsfield had tabled a sequestration of Iraqi oil assets well before the window dressing of WMD and the rest of the nonsense trying to justify an illegal invasion was publicised: Bush's government had even let contracts, (including Bechtel and Halliburton) in secret, prior to Bush even seeking Congress and Senate support for his plans!Indeed State Department and Treasury had already calculated how much money would accrue to the USA to offset the estimated cost: both horrendously erroneous as it happens: revenue far too optimistic and cost far too small.This information was all in the public domain: published in the World's leading business magazine, as one example: Businessweek International, amongst others.When the invasion was under way, Mrs Gluey and I were at a BBQ in France with French friends: one of their guests was a young English woman whom we gave a lift to: she had just bought herself out of her army commission: an officer with "Green Slime". i.e. Intelligence. And she and I had a long interesting discussion, as she had been serving in Iraq.Controversially, I asked her how she and her fellows felt about being used as tools of American big business interests, rather than serving genuine British national interest!"That's why I resigned!" she said, "Many of us have had enough." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kitty Posted January 12, 2011 Author Share Posted January 12, 2011 Do you think that the average French person on the equivalent of the Clapham Omnibus would think that he/she has a special relationship with the US? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Russethouse Posted January 12, 2011 Share Posted January 12, 2011 No, they are probably very happy not to have a special relationship Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gluestick Posted January 12, 2011 Share Posted January 12, 2011 [quote user="Cathy"]Do you think that the average French person on the equivalent of the Clapham Omnibus would think that he/she has a special relationship with the US?[/quote]The close French friends with whom I discuss politics (both recently retired lecturers) considered G W Bush was a "Cowboy": and Obama is a clown.They have little time for American imperialism, arrogance and constant destabilising interference in global affairs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WJT Posted January 12, 2011 Share Posted January 12, 2011 [quote user="Gluestick"][quote user="Cathy"]Do you think that the average French person on the equivalent of the Clapham Omnibus would think that he/she has a special relationship with the US?[/quote]The close French friends with whom I discuss politics (both recently retired lecturers) considered G W Bush was a "Cowboy": and Obama is a clown.They have little time for American imperialism, arrogance and constant destabilising interference in global affairs.[/quote] Thats a shame because I hear they quite like your "friends" [:D]Sadly the person in charge seems to lead the way. It is strange how Obama has taken an extreme polar opposite of Bush but then again it could be said that if Royal was the current leader of France versus Sarkozy it would be the same. I personally don't judge all of the people of France on the beliefs and policy of that particular leader at the time. There are some that support and have the exact same views and some that don't. But then again I do get out some.[:)]It is a shame that the field for running for president is so open in America and just about anyone can run versus having the person put up for election chosen by a few. There are definitely drawbacks to both in my opinion but perhaps with a little less democracy there would be less Bozos running. But then again there are many that think that of Sarkozy already, not to mention Nick Clegg.Shame some that are so detested don't have the time to respond to such clever anti-American pundits that appear to have a lot of time to express such extreme views and not to mention very clever in the know friends on this forum. Perhaps a personal invitation by some of those very clever friends may do the trick. I will watch with baited breath. [:)] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Coeur de Lion Posted January 12, 2011 Share Posted January 12, 2011 So what has the French government actually done to achieve this honour anyway? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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