Plumbing - water supply - GdS

[chessie]

Need help, again, from you wonderful, clever people.

On top of everything else that's going wrong for me, I think we now have a water leak.

I can hear a hissing sound of a water leak.  I can hear it outside, close to the water meter, and up the road 100 yards away, I can hear the hissing sound everywhere in the garden, and in the house.  It sounds very much like the hissing sound one hears when turning on the knob for the gas hob.

I've had our friendly local farmer remove the slabs on top of the water meter; the concrete cavity was flooded with water.  (This was after several weeks of almost continuous heavy rain).  He scooped all the water out, and watched the water meter.  He said he 'doesn't think' the leak is on our side of the water pipe.  (NB - it was dusk when he looked !).  Which would be good;  but I'm still not happy.

We had some friends come round, and as they've built a new house from scratch I reckoned he'd have a good idea about the water supply.   He also lifted the slabs, couldn't hear the hissing sound (though his wife could) - but again he said he didn't think it was on our side of the water pipe, because the dial wasn't going round.  I don't think he looked at it for long enough - and I'm still not convinced - because I can hear this sound, everywhere in the house, and late at night it's starting to get to me !!!

I've been checking on the thread about GdS under another heading on this forum.  I'm becoming convinced (in my silly little mind) that what I can hear is the sound of a leak, under pressure, from the GdS which would be close to the chauffage-eau - yes ?

Having looked at one of the freebie DIY catalogues I can see, I think, how the water supply is supposed to work - but I'd be grateful if someone would just read through and confirm or put me right.

The water meter outside, with the dial, has a lever.  If that lever is closed it means there is no supply of water to the house - yes ?

Now the GdS system; looking at that it would seem that there is a red knob on every one I've looked at, which seems to operate like a stop-cock.  

If I closed off that control knob would that affect the water supply to the rest of the house; or does it cut off the water supply to the Chauffage-eau only ?   At the moment, because I've been so worried about this leak I have turned off the main electricity supply (at the fuse board) to the chauffage-eau - so we have no hot water - called economising and saving electricity - and our money !!

The water pressure to the taps doesn't seem to be as high as it used to be; also when I've turned the electricity on to the chauffauge-eau (for about 12 hours)  - and we've had hot water - the tank seems to run cold very quickly.   Which is why I think the problem is at the GdS.

Yes, I accept - we need to call in a plumber, but I'm one of those people who likes to 'know' things anyway.

I hope I've explained the problem so it is understandable.... I'm just concerned about the cost of the loss of water - and the fact we're living 'rough' because we've no hot water  !!!

As ever any advice, help, info would be greatly appreciated from you lovely people.

Chessie

[alittlebitfrench]

1) Turn all taps off in the house. Don't use the toilet or washing machine.

2) Record the numbers on the dial of the water meter.

3) Go back in 1-2 hours time and see if they have changed.

If they have not moved then you are safe your side.

There is an emergency number to call on your water bill. CALL IT !

If you can hear a hissing sound that loudly it would be quite a big leak. If that was the case you would not have wtaer pressure in the house.

Don't sound like a water leak to me.

CALL THE EMERGENCY NUMBER ON YOUR WATER BILL.

[idun]

 Yes, do as said by ALBF, as you could get a bill for 1000's.

We had a water leak once and thankfully the water company was very good about it and only charged us slightly more than the previous year. At the time, it was a good job as it would have bankrupted us to pay the amount they were asking for[:(]

[Lehaut]

I doubt you would have enough water pressure in the house to cause a "sound" for so long without the leak being apparent by now.

Couple of thoughts outside of the box. Have you started with a mild case of tinnitus? It can manifest itself as a hissing noise.

Do you have any high voltage pylons near you? If it is damp and wet they can produce a high frequency noise when you are close to them.

Is the water heater on the equivalent of French "white meter" i.e. it only comes on during the periods of cheaper electricity. If your 12 hrs on does not include this period, there will not be much hot water. This is normally controlled at the main electric board. You might want to listen in there as, rarely, shorting components can make a noise. Try turning all the electricity off to the house to see if there is any difference.

If there is a problem with the Groupe de Security, it usually manifests itself by water by passing the valve/stop c*** you have been closing. If you live in a hard water area, or its an old tank, calcium or rust collects in the tank and when you test the GdS (which the instructions would have you doing on a regular basis!) crud gets into the internals of the safety valve and stops it shutting properly, then it drips or if wider open, hiss.(this is outside the heating cycle when it should drip anyway as the water expands).

As has also been suggested, turn off the water at the meter. Before you do this, make sure all taps etc are turned off. Leave everything for a good hour or so (fill up the kettle before hand for a cup of tea. After a good period of time, open one of the upstairs taps. If there is no leak in the house, some water should come out of the tap due to the system still having residual pressure. It won't be much. If nothing comes out, that could be an indication of a leak in the house and the hissing should have ceased as the system flattens.

Is one of your internal /external toilets running on?

Difficult to see if you have had a lot of rain but have you noticed any new wet spots in your garden or external. Friends had a new "source" open up in front of their house. When we dug down it was the joint on the plastic supply pipe which had given way.

[Lori]

All great advice above.  We too had a leak at the main valve (by the street).  Water was leaking from the main meter.  We reached in to turn off the main valve and called the water company.  They came out within about 4 hours and said the leak was on our side of the meter. Therefore, the water company employee did NOT repair the leak.  He told us it was up to us to hire a plumber. We got a bill for 900 euros. 

I called the plumber/electrician (immediately) who had renovated our entire home and he took photos of the meter that showed the crack was NOT on our side.  He wrote up a detailed report, included the photos, I sent it all in to the SDEI (water company).  It took them weeks and a few more contacts to finally agree to replace the old meter. 

Our plumber repaired the leaking part of the meter so we could have water.  But, he concluded that the meter (as was confirmed by SDEI) was very old and probably started leaking a long while back, but with time the leak grew until it was a major problem.

This is when I was told to always place styrofoam around the main meter to protect it from extreme freezing weather in winter.  I did that and for the first year or so, I checked the new meter on a regular basis.

The experience will not be forgotten !  I was told by SDEI that a customer is only allowed ONE dégrèvement on their account.  I have no idea if that is true to all water suppliers.  But, they did something like what happened to Idun.  In the end, they charged the same amount we used the previous year.  However, we had to pay the 900 euros while they 'processed' our dossier.

[alittlebitfrench]

Following on from what Lehaut said..

We have a street light adjacent to our house.

When it comes on, it constantly makes a kinda 'hissing' sound.

[Hectorsdad]

Lots of sensible advice for you to follow. The main thing is to ensure you are not going to be sent huge water bill. Look at the meter and take a reading. Do not use any water and After a few hours check the new reading. If the difference is only slight you probably do not have a big leak on your side although a minor leak could be present. If any leak is substantial the meter would show a noticeable change.

Even just a change of 0.1 in an hour is a bad sign.

Hope it is just in your ears. I have a steady, continuous hissing in my ears that could be interpreted as an external noise just as you describe.

Alistair

[chessie]

Thanks everyone for good advice.

Hadn't really left the water meter for 1 - 2 hours to get a more accurate reading - so that's one step I'll try.   Did e-mail water company - have had no response, and no visit !!  If it turns out to be leak at water meter think I'll ask our Mairie for help.

As for the GdS - never touched it, which was why I was asking about it.  If I turned the red knob to close it, will that close off any hot water to the taps ?  If I close that, and can still hear the sound, does that mean we have water moving from the hot tank into the drain because there's a leak at the stop-tap ?

I've checked behind all the kitchen cupboards, the bathroom cupboards, round by the hot water tank - there is absolutely no sign of any water anywhere...  newish house on concrete slab so if we had a leak indoors it should be obvious, shouldn't it ?

It isn't tinnitus (thanks lehaut ! - and I'm sorry you have hearing problems - that must be miserable for you);  the sound varies.  A couple of visitors said they could hear the noise - strangely she could hear better than he could !! - but both confirmed hearing it.  

It's louder outside than in the house; strangely enough it gets louder if I walk away from the house, away from the meter, and up the road !!  Is it possible there is a leak further up from us and the sound is travelling down the pipes to our place ?   (I've been accused of having hearing like a bat !)    It isn't the humming of pylons - I've stood under high-power pylons so I'm aware of that kind of 'humming'.

No, this is just a high pitched - but not loud -  'hissing' sound - and at night I can hear it more clearly, and maybe I've just become more sensitised to it.

Think the idea of taking photos at the water meter is a good one - if that's where the leak is coming from.

I now need to grab hold of a passing hunky chunky farmer driving one of the big boys toys, and ask him to remove concrete slabs over the water meter, so I can do a more accurate watch on the meter.   I can't do this myself (and those who may have read previous posts will understand why I can no longer ask OH to do such things - basically I feel I'm on my own now....- which is an additional hiccup for me).

I knew you wonderful people on here would give me proper, practical advice -

I'll let you know the outcome.

Many thanks - Chessie  

[ukebrain]

Hey Chessie, glad to hear that you've been getting some good advice! I've been in a similar situation before, and it can definitely be frustrating. If you're still having trouble, it might be worth asking a plumber to come to take a look. Sometimes leaks can be really tricky to find, and it's best to have a professional take a look.

[ssomon]

I think it may be a bit late to offer advice on a problem encountered over 2 years ago😀

[Hectorsdad]

It is so easy to make such a slip. I catch myself trying to answer threads many years old but now I have trained myself to look at the dates. At least the information may help some other desperate member.

Edited June 23, 2023 by Hectorsdad
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