AnOther Posted October 3, 2009 Share Posted October 3, 2009 I think it should be best out of 3 [:D] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigears Posted October 4, 2009 Share Posted October 4, 2009 I agree, best out of 3, as who is to say the current vote is more valid than the first. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jazzer Posted October 4, 2009 Share Posted October 4, 2009 I think the Treaty is so complex a matter,before voting, the electors should sit a comprehension test. Voting figures would I think be very low. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigears Posted October 4, 2009 Share Posted October 4, 2009 voters should not be asked to vote on such an issue as it becomes more of a vote on how people feel about the EU itself. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bubbles Posted October 4, 2009 Share Posted October 4, 2009 Excellent idea, Jazzer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spectateur Posted October 4, 2009 Share Posted October 4, 2009 [quote user="bigears"]voters should not be asked to vote on such an issue as it becomes more of a vote on how people feel about the EU itself. [/quote]I agree, people use a referendum to express displeasure at a whole range of things not necessarily connected with the question posed.The UK government were quite right in making their decision on the Lisbon Treaty without a referendum.How on earth can a referendum in the UK, on any EU issue, produce a result based on the due consideration of the people after they have been subjected to 30 years of europhobe propaganda and misinformation by a predominantly right wing press. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mint Posted October 4, 2009 Share Posted October 4, 2009 Spectateur, you have got it in one! I congratulate you on your perspicacity![:D] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jonzjob Posted October 4, 2009 Share Posted October 4, 2009 I guess that you're not totally in the 'blue' camp Spectateur?Newspapers in UK are divided in different ways. There are the broad sheets such as The Telegraph (RW), The Guardian (LW), The Sunday Times (RW), The Observer (LW); and then there are the tabloids such as The Daily Mail (RW), The Times (RW), The Daily Express (RW) and The Independent (middle). There are also what we call the 'red top' tabloids which are generally regarded as working class rags, such as The Sun (RW), The Mirror (LW), The Star (LW) and The Daily Sport (who knows). The Daily Mail and The Sun are the most popular but the Mail is often regarded as the 'housewives' newspaper and The Sun as the illiterate's answer to a comic book. The intellectuals would prefer to read The Telegraph, The Guardian or The Times. The Guardian is very left wing and is hugely preferred in some areas of the public sector like education and health services. It got the nickname The Grauniad at one time because of so many tryping (not a speeling mastike) errors.Looks like there are a certain amount of lefties too me-thinks? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
suein56 Posted October 4, 2009 Share Posted October 4, 2009 [quote user="Jonzjob"]Newspapers in UK are divided in different ways. There are the broad sheets such as The Telegraph (RW), The Guardian (LW), The Sunday Times (RW), The Observer (LW); and then there are the tabloids such as The Daily Mail (RW), The Times (RW), The Daily Express (RW) and The Independent (middle). There are also what we call the 'red top' tabloids which are generally regarded as working class rags, such as The Sun (RW), The Mirror (LW), The Star (LW) and The Daily Sport (who knows). The Daily Mail and The Sun are the most popular but the Mail is often regarded as the 'housewives' newspaper and The Sun as the illiterate's answer to a comic book. The intellectuals would prefer to read The Telegraph, The Guardian or The Times. The Guardian is very left wing and is hugely preferred in some areas of the public sector like education and health services. It got the nickname The Grauniad at one time because of so many tryping (not a speeling mastike) errors.[/quote]Hey, what happened to ... The Independent ... in your thinking?That is the one I turn to first, followed by some of the others you mention.Sue Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jonzjob Posted October 4, 2009 Share Posted October 4, 2009 Duno Sue 'cause we normally take the Midi Libre? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jako Posted October 5, 2009 Share Posted October 5, 2009 It is not (only) the newspapers, it is the incompetent politicians themselves that cause the eurofobic sentiment. With every unpopular European law they say "it is Brussels, don't blame us" What they don't tell you is that they ensorsed those laws. Europe only forces UK politicians to stick to their promises, that is all. And the man-in-the street is mislead to believe "Europe is to blame" All the EU benefits to the UK are simply not mentioned, not by the press and not by the politicians, as this is not a popular issue right now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NormanH Posted October 6, 2009 Share Posted October 6, 2009 I doubt that this will help:http://www.independent.co.uk/news/business/news/the-demise-of-the-dollar-1798175.htmlI noted in particular "The Chinese believe, for example, that the Americans persuaded Britain to stay out of the euro in order to prevent an earlier move away from the dollar." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jako Posted October 6, 2009 Share Posted October 6, 2009 This report had an immediate impact on the pound today:U.K. Factory Production Slumps to Lowest Since 1992 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chessfou Posted October 6, 2009 Share Posted October 6, 2009 There are still factories in the UK?Incidentally, on the previous thread about the Irish referendums (or referenda if you prefer), the No vote in the first seemed to be largely influenced by a lack of knowledge about the treaty, greatly exacerbated when, in the run-up to the first referndum, the Taoiseach Brian Cowen admitted he hadn't actually read the treaty, which ranked far higher in honesty than common sense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
velcorin Posted October 6, 2009 Share Posted October 6, 2009 Spoken like a man who's never been north of the M4[:)]I've just been visiting customers in the UK, as we have problems with our credit insurers. The levels of activity in the Cheshire industrial area and Teeside shocked me, when I compare it to our corporate headquarters in Rhine-Westphalia. The places are absolutely buzzing. So much so that we can't get cover on the levels of business. Industrial chemicals, still one of the UK's strongest performers.The strong EUR is REALLY starting to hurt against a weaker USD YEN and GBP. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JMB Posted October 9, 2009 Share Posted October 9, 2009 Could this be another nail in the great british coffin http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=20601087&sid=a72zaFNruWKM [:D] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NormanH Posted October 9, 2009 Share Posted October 9, 2009 And this:http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/personalfinance/borrowing/mortgages/6271517/House-prices-have-further-17pc-to-fall.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scooby Posted October 9, 2009 Share Posted October 9, 2009 Even if house prices were to drop by the forecast 17% it would still make sense to use the no deposit scheme if you were looking to by a home rather than an investment. Monthly rental for a terraced house (i.e.one that would currently market at the £135k mark cited in the feature) would be about £500. This represents a total cost over the 5 year interest free period in the plan of £30k. This contrasts with a potential fall in value (at 17%) of ~£22k. So, even in a 'worst case' scenario, the buyers would be better off by £8k. Further you would be fixing your annual property cost for the next few years.The real problem borrowers were those buying for investment (buy to let) and using the 'equity' from the 'increase' in value on one property to finance further property purchases. I heard of one individual who acquired 40 properties over a 24 month period from an initial single deposit. The individual is now bankrupt and so will never repay the outstanding debt. Oddly, I can't recall seeing much blame being accorded to this group of greedy parasites nor to those borrowers who lied on their mortgage applications... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jako Posted October 9, 2009 Share Posted October 9, 2009 Here's another nail:Pound Declines on Interest-Rate Outlook Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigears Posted October 13, 2009 Share Posted October 13, 2009 Its going down, down, down .....Media is talking about the euro becoming the hard currency, rather than the dollar. Also said that sterling may endup trading less than a euro. In the past some posters on this forum were talking about the demise of the euro. What now mi lads? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillN_33 Posted October 13, 2009 Share Posted October 13, 2009 The way it has fallenhttp://www.fxware.com/forex-currency/fx_chart.asp?f=GBP&t=EUR&d=p&l=en"not a pretty sight" for manyIs it time to buy Sterling? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quillan Posted October 13, 2009 Share Posted October 13, 2009 Well all I can say is sorry if I raised peoples hopes by predicting it would stabilise around 1.16 some time back, I never thought it would get this low. Mind you it was lower in Jan 2009 and like many I thought it was a glitch.The other prediction I made, based on information at that time, was the strong movement to move away from the dollar as a world currency. Of course those in the business poo pooed the idea but I see the issue has been raised again and more strongly so now. The general advantage for us normal people would be the price stabilisation of goods bought outside the Euro Zone but we could also loose the money saving advantage of buying goods from the UK.As far as buying Sterling is concerned, well the professionals would probably encourage you to do so in the hope it will improve the exchange rate. Personally I think there are far to many unknowns at the moment. If you are really keen to have a go I would wait until the Lisbon Treaty is signed by the last member and then comes in to effect. I don't know what effect it will have on the pound, the European monetarists may decide to force the pound down even more to force the UK in to taking the Euro but who knows, its only wild speculation. Back to reading the tea leaves, well at least they seem to prove more accurate (only being slightly out instead of way out) than the experts [;-)] . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillN_33 Posted October 13, 2009 Share Posted October 13, 2009 Just my simple views: I have never been a great supporter of the £ as, in my view,it has always been an untrustworthy currency, (a strange word to use – but myfeelings). I have been around since theearly 60s and have seen it’s extreme ups and downs. I would not think that the UKwill swop the £ for the Euro “anytime soon”, as the USwould say, or “anytime ever” as the majority of the UK population would say. As for the current value of the £ versus the Euro, the UK link to the US is stronger than any othercountry in the Euro zone……IF the $ ceases to be “the world” currency, (beingreplaced by the Euro?), and weakens further, maybe the £ will follow, BUT thisis really “crystal ball” territory and a very big IF. To my mind, the questions are; has negative sentimenttowards the £ ceased?, has the UK stopped printing money?, has all the UK “bad”news been revealed?………..has the pendulum swung too far against sterling? The present UK Government has done little recently tosupport the £, (not sure whether this was intentional or not), in words ordeeds, BUT if it gets to parity with the Euro I would think that they will havereview their position. What has happenedto sterling versus the Euro, in such a short period of time, has been one ofthe biggest devaluations in recent UK history, but the Government hasshown very little concern……..Surely this cannot continue? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Braco Posted October 13, 2009 Share Posted October 13, 2009 The economy in the UK will get a lot worse before we see any real improvement. I work for a PLC that is in the process of 'negotiating' 45 hour week contracts to replace the current 37.5. Time for a Bachman–Turner Overdrive revival. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chancer Posted October 13, 2009 Author Share Posted October 13, 2009 On he contrary I thin the government are concerned that it does continue.In GB's speech yesterday whilst he held back from using the word "devaluation" he said that all of their measures were aimed at facilitating a "manufacturing and export led recovery".My question is what are these products that Britain manufactures and exports? - Reality television?- Binge drinking?No seriously if someone were to ask me the question I would not have a clue what to say apart from a few companies that rely on their brand names to sell Chinese tat at marque prices.What are the UK's great manufactured exports? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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