Lobbying !

[ebaynut]

Somewhere else to make the point, all publicity for the cause.

http://www.conservativesabroad.org/blog/?p=222

Blog for Gary Streeter MP, re his parliamentary question!

[Chassaing]

More coverage.....    Well done Cooperlola and the whole team!

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/pages/live/articles/news/worldnews.html?in_article_id=493382&in_page_id=1811&ito=1490

[cooperlola]

AND Jim Murphy's coming to Paris to discuss the problem with the French authorities which is a real step in the right direction and just proves what a concerted effort can achieve.  Not just well done to me (who is that Deborah Dudley woman anyway?[Www]) but to all the guys and gals at FHI , as well as Makfai plus everybody on here who's written to their representatives, posted on blogs etc. etc.

KEEP IT UP - IT WORKS (although my o/h is convinced I'm going to get us deported....)

[Deimos]

[quote user="cooperlola"]

KEEP IT UP - IT WORKS (although my o/h is convinced I'm going to get us deported....)

[/quote]

Well I'll be joining you as I have now decided I will not be taking out Private Health Insurance that complies with the levels of cover required by the French.  Thus, early Jan I can no longer be legally resident in France - as I will not be complying with residency laws so I will also not be liable for income tax, Contribution Sociales, etc., etc.  As I understand it if you are not resident in France you are not obliged to declare for income tax, etc.

They cannot on one hand say I am resident but then on the other say I'm not resident.

I'll also probably beat you to it as I lose my health cover in early Jan.

Ian

[makfai]

Here is a copy of the Petition I sent to EU Parliament.  Feel free to use it or change it.  You could easily send it in as a complaint by changing words in last para.

 

 

Application of Article 24 of EU Directive 2004/38EC to French healthcare provisions for EU Citizens from other Member States

 

LOI no 2006-911 du 24 juillet 2006 and Décret no 2007-371 du 21 mars 2007 issued by the French Government have made changes to rules of residence for, among others, existing and potential residents of France who are 'inactive' ['inactif].   This term, though not defined, is taken to refer to those who are not employed, self-employed or seeking employment. 

 Clarification of the application of this legislation to healthcare in France is contained in a statement from the French Government ‘Point d'information: Affiliation à la CMU pour les ressortissants britanniques inactifs’. This statement was issued on 19 September 2007 and amended on 24 September 2007 and is available at http://www.securite-sociale.fr/comprendre/europe/europe/cmu_inactifs.htm).

 Existing and future 'Inactif' EU Citizens from other Member Sates will no longer be able to obtain health insurance through the French ‘Couverture Maladie Universelle’ [CMU] even though such cover would allow them to meet with the requirement to obtain 'une assurance maladie' contained in the above quoted French legislation.

 At this time, this appears to be a policy decision and not one reflected in any change to the legislation governing access to the CMU.  However, even if the decision was transposed into law it would not affect the substance of this petition.

 The exclusion of inactive EU Citizens from other Member States is not an exclusion which has been applied to French nationals.  Indeed, somewhat ironically, it is not even an exclusion which is applied to foreign nationals from non-EU Member States who are resident in France.  Once they have a Carte de Sejour they are able to join the CMU. This legislation has created a situation whereby not only French nationals but foreign nationals receive more favourable treatment than other residents who are EU Citizens!

 The fact that the French Government relies on EU Directive 2004/38EC (in particular Article 7 (1) (b)) to underpin both the French legislation and its clarification statement in regard to ‘inactive’ residents from other Member States is relevant. This EU Directive does not provide, in respect of Article 7 any derogation from Article 24. Therefore, in the words of Article 24 ‘provisions as are expressly provided for’ do not exist to negate the supremacy of Article 24 over the contents and application of Article 7 (1) (b).

 This petition seeks redress and remedy for the French Government's decision  to exclude certain EU Citizens from the CMU while not applying that rule equally, as required by Article 24 of EU Directive 200/38EC, to all.

 

CONTACTS

French Ombudsman

http://www.mediateur-republique.fr/

Petition

http://www.europarl.europa.eu/parliament/public/staticDisplay.do?id=49&language=EN

Complaint

http://ec.europa.eu/community_law/your_rights/your_rights_en.htm

[Chassaing]

Here is another bit of the action.....  Same article, different paper.

http://www.thisismoney.co.uk/mortgages/homesabroad/article.html?in_article_id=426276&in_page_id=&ito=1565

[Ron Avery]

Nice to see how understanding our brethren in Spain are and how they cannot even read what is in front of them.  I really hope they build a multi-storey car park in front of his appartment, or is that being unkind[:D]

Mind you Mr Purvey, (is that why he is in Spain) might think we get healthcare for free in France, which could be interpreted from the way Deborah from Dudley has been quoted. 

[Glyn]

So its OK for Mr Purvey to have his healthcare paid for by the UK taxpayer as he has reached UK retirement age, but not OK for us to pay into the French system for ours!

[cooperlola]

[quote user="Ron Avery"]

Nice to see how understanding our brethren in Spain are and how they cannot even read what is in front of them.  I really hope they build a multi-storey car park in front of his appartment, or is that being unkind[:D]

 

[/quote]I think a nice big shelter for the homeless would be better.

[cooperlola]

As Jim Murphy's bringing up the case with the French authorities in Paris tomorrow - today is a good time to post again on his blog - especially if your E106 is about to expire, and/or if you have a chronic or existing illness which will exclude you from getting private health insurance.  Let's give him some ammunition to take with him.

http://blogs.fco.gov.uk/blogs/jim_murphy/archive/2007/11/09/14438.aspx

[Cat]

And there's more today http://www.dailymail.co.uk/pages/live/articles/news/worldnews.html?in_article_id=493519&in_page_id=1811

[Joshua]

Brilliant, you’ve really got people’s attention on this issue

I just wish they wouldn’t keep saying it’s FREE

I've not been here that long but we’ve never had anything free.

Subsidised, even heavy subsidised but not free

Joshua[:)]

[Suninfrance]

Just received my online Property FInder France news letter which contains the following:

After hazy reports from various sources

about the healthcare situation for early retiree expats in France, it

has recently been confirmed that Britons who have been resident in

France for five years will not be affected by the recent changes.

All those who have not been in

France for five years or more, are under retirement age and not working

have until the end of March next year to make new healthcare

arrangements. Under the new rules, newcomers to France who are under

retirement age will also have to seek private health insurance.

According to a French Government

spokesperson those in France for five years are exempt from new rulings

because the changes are connected to initial entry requirements. These

requirements no longer apply once a person has gained a permanent right

of residence.

The spokesperson also said it would be

up to local prefectures to rule whether a foreign resident had the

required period of ‘legal and uninterrupted residence’

Although this gives a clearer picture of

the healthcare situation for those who are well, critically ill expats

still do not know if they will receive special help. Such residents are

unable to take out private health cover due to their existing

illnesses. The Government had promised to address their situation in

early October, however this information has been delayed because

discussions are still underway.

Find out more about all aspects of Living in France from The Connexion, available monthly, visit www.connexionfrance.com for more details.

I have e-mailed them the frenchhealthissues website address.

[Helen]

I've just been reading about the role of the French mediator. Frank gave his link earlier.http://www.mediateur-republique.fr/en-citoyen-03-00

The website is available in English.

'The Mediator of the French Republic has the mission to help people contesting a decision or behaviour by government departments , territorial bodies, public institutions or any other organisation with a public service mission.

First of all, before contacting the Mediator of the Republic, you must make an initial approach to the government department concerned - requesting an explanation or contesting a decision - and noted that the disagreement persists.

Next, referral to the Mediator of the French Republic is not direct: you must go through the intermediary of a member of parliament, deputy or senator, of your choice. You put together a full dossier, with a clear account of your problem and all the documents relating to the case. You hand this dossier to the deputy or senator of your choice and he/she will pass it on to the Mediator if he/she thinks it appropriate.

However,the Mediator of the French Republic's delegates can settle a large number of problems directly and quickly.You can arrange to meet one of the delegates from your department by making an appointment over the phone or by going in person to their office - ie at an easily accessible organisation(legal information centre, public services centre, community welfare centre, etc) or to the prefecture.

If the delegate cannot settle your problem, he/she helps you to put together your dossier and directs you to a member of parliament who will pass it on to the Mediator of the French Republic.'

His role is also to help promulgate new laws that will make injustices less likely. One of those in the pipeline is interestingly  'Mettre à disposition des ressortissants communautaires un document équivalent à l’avis d’imposition sur le revenu pour favoriser l’accès à un logement social ou à d’autres avantages sociaux.' (presumably for peopel who have not been living here long enough to have completed a tax return.)

We still haven't received our letter   but would certainly follow this procedure if necessary.

sorry I'm not sure lobbying is the right thread [8-)]

[cooperlola]

19 new signers to the Honeyball declaration today - a real step in the right direction :

Signed/signé by/par  (54) members/députés:

 

 

 

Adamou, Allister, Atkins, Aylward, Baco, Belohorská, Birutis, Buşoi, Cabrnoch, Casaca, Corda, Degutis, De Rossa, Dičkutė, Dover, Duff, Fernandes, Ford, Gierek, de Groen-Kouwenhoven, Hall, Hamon, Higgins, Honeyball, Hughes, in 't Veld, Janowski, Juknevičienė, Kinnock, Koch, Kozlík, Libicki, Lucas, McAvan, Meijer, Moraes, Neris, Newton Dunn, Nicholson, Novak, Oomen-Ruijten, Oviir, Paparizov, Patriciello, Pīks, Şerbu, Simpson, Škottová, Staes, Sumberg, Titley, Tomaszewska, Vlasák, Watson

 

[Mrs B]

I've received two replies today from MEPs.

First one from Conservative MEP Syed Kamall who used Robert Atkins' letter word for word. I have responded using Makfai's response. Thank you Makfai.

Second one from Philippe de Villiers, Independence/Democracy Group for Ouest France. Briefly translated as 'Thank you for bringing this to my attention. I note the difficulties you have to overcome. I have sent a copy of your letter to your local area CPAM office and I will let you know the results of my enquiries."  Although he hasn't confirmed that he has signed the petition, this is a much more sympathetic response than any from my UK MEPs. 

 

[Chassaing]

A little more coverage.....

http://www.channel4.com/news/articles/society/health/bid+to+save+free+french+healthcare/1048747

[LanguedocGal]

Just a little word or warning Mrs B.

P. de Villiers is a well known right-wing eurosceptic despite being an MEP. You guys have been working hard on this campaign and it would be a pity to get people like him working against you. I'm not saying he would, but his politics are very Franco-Francais. He is ''perhaps'' one to be wary of  (hope I'm wrong) on such an issue as French laws are being challenged. 

[krusty]

[quote user="cooperlola"]

19 new signers to the Honeyball declaration today - a real step in the right direction :

Signed/signé by/par  (54) members/députés:

 [/quote]

 

Sorry if this sounds a bit of a stupid question , when will this declaration be sent to someone of importance ?

 

and will it not be too late for us who`s e106 run out in January 2008

[cooperlola]

Not a stupid question!  A declaration has to be signed by a majority of MEPs, and when and if it is, it becomes law (although there are more processes to go through - ammendments can be added etc.) The declaration closes on 24th January '08. Until then, it's just a question of building up numbers of MEPs because if it becomes law  - then universal portable state healthcare throughout the EU will be a reality, and there will be nothing the French government will be able to do about it.  In individual terms then yes, I guess it will be too late, but at least you'd be allowed back into the CMU as soon as it was confirmed, instead of waiting until you've been a resident here for five years.

And if nothing else, it keeps our case in the front of the minds which count.

[krusty]

Thanks coop , now another queastion what number is a majority ?

[SheilaG]

[quote user="krusty"]Thanks coop , now another queastion what number is a majority ?[/quote]

393 is a majorety

 

[krusty]

thanks SG , just tracked down the answer myself........a long way to go

http://www.europarl.org.uk/guide/GFAQmain.htm

[cooperlola]

A long way to go yes, but momentum is building.  The problem is that the UK MEPs on their own (even if all sign) are nowhere near enough for a majority, but the promising thing about yesterday is the increase in the different countries represented - and thus the numbers grow.

We'd really like to find a few people who speak other European languages, who might be able to see if this is a hot topic on other fora like ours for nationals of other EU countries.  Because if they could lobby their MEPs too this would have a chance.  It may seem a long shot but it really would go most of the way to solving not only the problems of those who already live here, but those who are planning to come too. (Although I guess there'll be one or two who'd think that wasn't a good thing!!![Www])

[Brando]

You state the following:

'In individual terms then yes, I guess it will be too late, but at least you'd be allowed back into the CMU as soon as it was confirmed, instead of waiting until you've been a resident here for five years.'

Can you please quote where the French Government/CMU/CPAM has accepted this 5-year rule if, indeed, there is such a rule.?

We have close friends who have been permanently resident in France for 12 years and have held Cartes Vitales for well over 5 years already. He is aged 61 and his wife is 55. They have been informed by letter from CMU that they will be granted, as a special case, continuing cover until 31 March 2008 (for which they must pay a contribution) but after that date they MUST purchase private health insurance if they wish to reside permanently in France. They have appealed against this decision, providing all necessary documentation proving their residence here for 12 years. This has not been accepted by CMU who do not recognise any 5-year rule.