Wobbly Wife

[Brian]

We are moving to France later this year and my wife is spending all her waking moments and her sleeping ones too on the Living France Forum. With all the problems people encounter is there anyone out there who knowing then what they know now would not have made the move or is it still all worthwhile.

 

Reassurance please before my wobbly wife clears the shelves of Kalms tablets although she does come in handy spreading the Shake n Vac.

 

 

 

[Deimos]

Knowing what I know now I would definitely move out here. Probably earlier had I known what I know now earlier.

Different for different people though and just because it works (or does not) for one person does not mean it will (or will not) work for somebody else. Individual circumstances vary and what problems one might come across can depend on a lot of factors. Remember that not all the problems and negative things posted here happen to the same person/everybody.

There can be a lot of negativity and people love talking about “rose tinted spectacles”, about how everything is not cheap, how …, but most of those people are still here and probably mostly enjoying themselves.

Ian

[Just Katie]

Life begins at 40!  I am now 41 and what I have discovered since my 40th is to never be put off by other peoples experiences.  During my young years there were many things I wanted to do but Aunt Flo said this and Uncle Albert said that and my teacher said something else and I believed them all.

I now realise that I am my own person and what may be a tragedy for Uncle Albert would be a walk in the park for me (or vice versa).

Follow your dream and enjoy.

[Honeydo]

I lived abroad for twelve years, in the US and Switzerland, now back in Uk but have a second home in 17.  I learnt over the years the experience is what you make of it.  You will have frustrations, but the joy is the learning and then being able to say I did it. I had many friends with the same attitude, but others sadly couldn't or wouldn't adapt expecting everything to drop in  their laps.  I say go for it, on a whole you will find people helpful.  Even when we bought our place in 17, shopkeepers and the like seem to have gone out of their way to be helpful and extremely friendly.

[Eslier]

There are only two things that you need to be sure of . . .

First, income. If you have a good income, whether from  pensions/investments or from a source of guaranteed employment then everything will be much easier. If you are relying upon self employed income then make sure you have a very good business plan with realistic cashflow predictions and a decent amount of capital to carry you through the first year or so.

Second, location.  Too many people fall in love with a particular house without giving enough consideration to where it is situated. This will probably be the most important decision you make. You need to consider transport links - distance to ferryports airport etc. You also need to consider whether you want to be near enough to larger towns or cities to make a quick visit. If you've never lived in a rural environment before then make sure you know what you're letting yoruself in for if this is where you choose to be.

If you've got both these things covered then you're going to love life in France. It's natural to be aprehensive but sometiimes you just have to make that jump for things to happen  for you. I amd one of the many who have moved to France and love it. That doesn't necessarily mean I'll stay here for ever but I'll certainly never regret it.

The very best of luck to you both.

[ali-cat]

Sorry that I can't tell you what it's like in France at the moment- as we are moving over this June.  But I know how you feel as I have a wobbly husband!!  Everyone on this forum has been great with advice & helpful tips & they all sound like they love being in France (they could have been on the wine, though!). [;-)]

There would be nothing worse, than in 10 years time looking back & saying "I wish we had done it".  My hubby is slightly less wobbly, now that we have decided to rent for at least 6 months before buying somewhere.  If France isn't for us - we can come back.  But I honestly don't think that will happen. 

Go for it!!  As someone said to me - life's not a rehearsal.  [:-))] 

[Anton Redman]

Probably looking at the past through rosy glasses but versus say 6 years ago there seems to be a preponderance of people posting problems and obstacles rather than solutions. There also seem to be people posting who expect London Cab Drivers to have a bale of hay in the back of the taxis. There are also large numbers of people who would have missed the day tour of Addis Ababa that I enjoyed thirty years ago when my travelling companions were stuck at the airport because they believed you could not obtain a visa at the airport and it was too dangerous in town.

 

There were people who posted that “Everything in the Garden was not rosy”  What there was not was a majority of people who had read the code Napoleon on line and assumed that that was how the French lived their lives. I do not think everything is marvellous in France and know it is a very tough place to run a business. Your posting does not give enough detail about how you expect to earn a living in France. If you have enough money to retire here it is great. Last Friday in Leroy Merlin in Bordeaux I met a French guy who was setting up in Guildford. Most of the French round us were amazed when I said there was no way I would want to run a business in France and that if I wanted a business I would go back to England.

[Deby]

You only regret what you never did.   Life does not stand still.  Do your research, sounds as if she is doing so already, at least she will not get too many surprises.  The ones who fail are because they have no real idea of what they are venturing into, looking for solutions to other problems or merely just seeing a move to be an answer to their problems.

We moved to France and now we are back in the UK. We have never regretted moving to France, we had a lovely life in France, our return to the UK was based on our current family needs/lifestyle.  So we have not failed, we are just doing what needs to be done now.

One thought though, I have tended to notice that those who have moved to France and still keep a place in the UK tend to be more successful, as they are not affected so much by property prices/eggs all in one basket/got to make the move a complete success scenario!  I know this is not true for some, but it does give people some comfort.
Deby

[Tresco]

You can do all the research in the world but the things that may 'get' you are not anything that you can research.

They will be things that are unpredictable; they may be things you never even thought about before you leave UK. In fact they may be things you never thought about consciously in your whole life.[:)]

Whether those things are enough to make you want to go back is another matter. It's swings and roundabouts, but not ones you have ever encountered before.

Plan your way to go back in case it's needed.

[Pip]

Plan your way to go back in case it's needed.

Pearls of wisdom Tresco !  As is that life is unpredicable.  Circumstances change for most people over time.  A year ago I would have dropped everything and just followed my heart to France.  However, I too have a wobbly OH who grounded me and set me on a path of research.  Now, with so many peoples help on the forum,  I can see the whole picture.  I now know what pitfalls to look out for and view our move realistically.  I would no longer consider selling our home before renting for at least six months to a year and know that we need to save hard to have a cushion for at least a year.  All that said I am no less determined to follow my heart but I have removed the rose tinted spectacles.  Can't wait !! [:D]

[Owens88]

[quote user="Tresco"]

Plan your way to go back in case it's needed.

[/quote]

Cool advice. If you can rent before you buy/sell even better.

Juts remember, an English village is a  French town.

I was talking to one of our possible renters, a pre-buyer. He expressed ease at 'rural isolation' because the nearest shops were '2 miles away' where he lives at the moment. France is much more spread out. I think most Brits should only consider the bigger villages / towns. We looked at loads of places before my wife fell in love with ours.

Good luck

[Cerise]

A few weeks before we came here my husband came home and announced it was 'all off' - not only did he not want to move to France but best we got divorced as we obviously didn't want the same things etc.  This from the man who had been so keen to go.  Then he got very upset and said he was scared of moving to another country where he didn't speak the language, we didn't have jobs, we didn't know how everything worked - he ranted for England.  I was obviously upset by this but kept saying calmly that it was something we had BOTH decided and we could always come back.

Four years down the line we are still here, we have renovated the house, started the B & B and my husband speaks French and has a job.  In many ways he has fitted in better than me - even though I spoke French before we arrived.  Deby has got it right, moving back to England or anywhere else for that matter is not a 'failure' simply the next step in life.  I am always amazed by people who say that the place they moved from was not nice and they don't want to 'go back there'.  Doesn't it occur to them that even if you return to UK you don't have to go to exactly the same place and live the same life as previously.  When you move to another country you learn a whole new way of life and a new set of skills - you can take these with you if or when you go.

Obviously you need to make sure you have enough income, or at least a realistic way of generating one, but after that you just have to jump and try it.  Give it a realistic amount of time and if you don't like it do something else.  That is not failure, that is common sense.  Many people who return to the UK have 'made a go of it' but still decide they now want something different.  You can't know until you try.

Good luck to thoose with the Wobbly partners.

Maggi

[SaligoBay]

Stop that wobbling immediately!   Just get on with it.  The first two years will be so full of new experiences, new people, silly mistakes in learning French, you won't have time to worry.

THEN you take stock, and see if it's for you long-term.  But you can't say that now.  If it helps your wife to look on it as an experiment that she can stop if it's not working, it may take some of the fear away.

After 6 years, I've just run out of things to learn and positive things to look forward to.  It doesn't mean I don't like France, OR that I dream of returning to inner-city Southampton.   Why do you think I took Dick's question about reading Foucault's Pendulum as a challenge?   How sad is that!  [:)]

Deby, people often regret things they've done.  C'est la vie!  [:)]

 

[Lou]

Tomorrow sees the six month "anniversary" of our permanent move to

France.......and no regrets!  I agree wholeheartedly with everyone

else - definitely do lots of research before you go, and before you

buy, but ultimately you have to take that deep breath, cross all your

fingers and toes and just go for it - I don't believe it's possible to

feel absolutely 100 percent sure about anything, you just have to trust

in yourself.  It's natural to worry about such a huge change, and

some people worry more than others.  We had our moments of doubt

and fear about what we were doing, but having already had a big change

in our lives with my husband's redundancy (which prompted the whole

idea of moving here) decided we'd rather try and fail than be in the

same old place in 5 or ten years time saying "I wish....."  You

can't turn back the clock! 

Good luck

Lou

[Gardian]

Would endorse most of what has been said in the other posts on this subject, but can best contribute with my last 4 days 'diary':

Saturday: went for a drive locally and stopped at a 'Vente: Asperges' sign. Walked 50 m through the field, where 3 people were lifting asparagus. Bought 1 kilo for €2 - it came out of the ground not an hour or so before. That was dinner that night, with a bit of melted butter and some parmesan shavings on top.

Sunday: our local village 'Foire de Paques', with half a dozen serious nurserymen, selling all sorts of plants - cheap & good quality. Cheese and other craft stalls.

Monday: clear blue sky, temp 28C-ish. Spent most of the day potting up the previous day's purchases. Aperitif on the patio of a few / several  glasses of local red (€1.65 / litre - it's not Chateauneuf du Pape, but it doesn't cost that much)

Tuesday: spent an hour over a coffee or two with my French neighbour discussing sanglier / fouine / renard and the possible cause of attacks on our cats (see another thread). No conclusion reached, other than apart from him being a lovely man, he's not a patch on ChrisPP. Agreed that the 4 of us would go off for a spot of lunch and a visit to a nursery in the Drome tomorrow.

Is it all worthwhile?  I rest my case.  

 

[Sprogster]

I almost fell off my chair the other night when the presenter of a reality moving abroad programme actually gave some sensible advice.

In a nutshell the advice given was by all means go for it, but whatever you do keep your foot on the UK property ladder.

Apparently, there is an increasing trend of expatriates returning to the UK and finding themselves impoverished, due to being priced out of the UK property market.

Having an exit strategy when moving abroad is not being defeatist or negative, it is just being realistic in that statistically most people do return. Not through any failure on their part, but due to change of circumstances such as illness, bereavement, divorce, lack of income and proximity of family.

[Cerise]

Possibly a sensible idea, but not all of us are rich enough to have two homes.  We are ordinary folk - neither rich or retired - who can only afford one life.  If we had not sold our English home we simply would not have been able to come here with enough money to see us through the first couple of years.  No, we couldn't have rented out the old house as it would not have made us any money because the house was mortgaged.  So, only thing to do think of a sensible plan and go for it.

I felt quite strongly that when the going gets tough and, unless you really are well off (and possibly even then) it will at some stage, it would be easy to run away if you could.  Having our whole life here meant that we had to focus and get on with it.  One of the biggest mistakes I notice is that many people seem to treat their arrival in France to live like one large holiday.  Again; fine if you are wealthy but a quick muncher of capital if you need to get out there and earn your living.  Have seen several people spending the first year or so eating out all the time, letting the renovation slide and waking up one morning to the cold reality of no job, no income and a house which is still a bit of a wreck and unsaleable.

We have been accused a few times of being a bit unsociable because we made a strict rule on arrival of no lunches out, sitting in the bar etc from Monday to Friday.  Sounds a bit miserable perhaps, but we never lost sight of the fact that we had no source of income other than working here so renovating house and then husband getting job were our priorities.  For us that worked and we are managing to make a living (albeit not on grand scale), have a house which is hopefully saleable, and have always kept a 'running away fund' of enough money to pay rent and live on for 6 months if we ever felt that we really wanted to go before the house could be sold. 

I hope the 'wobblies' are feeling better, and wish them luck with their new lives.

 

Maggi

[Deimos]

Whilst I can see the “we can return to the UK whenever we want” reassurance, keeping an investment worth substantial capital in a questionable market is quite a lot of “reassurance”. If one has that sort of capital then, given the current UK housing market there are much better ways at the moment to get income from that capital. Taking the UK National average house price rise across 7 different data providers, last year saw an average house price increase of 3.9%. Just putting money in a short term deposit account can get a much higher return on the capital.

Depending on circumstances, there are significant costs to maintaining a property in the UK (assuming it is let out) such as agency fees, maintenance, etc. From what I have read, should you then decide you like France or want to invest the money more sensibly then you may end up paying significant French Capital Gains tax when you sell your UK 2nd home.

For me the problem with these “relocation” TV programs is that the presenters have no experience. Sometimes they are UK Estate Agents, sometimes 2nd hand car dealers and sometimes somebody who is presentable and can speak clearly. Invariably their knowledge and experience of the country they are advising about is minimal. I would thus personally doubt their advice even if I agreed with it. I also say some TV program guy say something like that the other week. The presenter was a UK Estate Agent who now does programs about how to do up sell your UK house for sale. Thus, quite how he has any idea about how to best invest significant capital I have no idea (maybe he’s a closet IFA).

Ian

[Will]

All I can add is that if you are retired on a good pension then France is probably an ideal place to move to. If depending on work, or planning to live off capital, then think long and hard about it - preferably have the jobs/business etc issues well sorted before you come here.

That's not being negative, or anti-France or anything like that. It's being realistic, and based on experience - i.e. our own experience of coming here with jobs (and retaining a house in England), versus many others we have known who end up in all sorts of s*** because they cannot find legal work, their capital runs out, the gite B&B bookings just don't materialise, they suddenly discover words like 'cotisations' and 'bureaucracy' which drive a steamroller through their carefully worked-out business plans etc. Sorry if it sounds smug, it shouldn't because we know that even with the most careful planning things can go wrong. And the two houses came from long hard work.

So get the income sorted out, and come here with an exit strategy. That doesn't have to mean keeping a British house, though that has a lot to commend it, as one needs to consider other factors than mere finances. If your mortgage can't be covered by the rent you actually receive (after management and maintenance charges) then you have probably over-borrowed.

And don't think that the talking head on the telly programs is actually personally responsible for what is said. Although many do have a personal input into the scripts, the advice they give is not their own. It's often geared to selling related magazines, exhibitions, commercials in the programmes, or bringing punters into their own day-job businesses (in the case of certain 'relocation consultants'). And that ctoo omes from my first-hand experience.