Dordogneshire - ghetto aimé?

[chessfou]

Is it disparaging to refer to Dordogne as Dordogneshire and Eymet as a ghetto?

Maybe but there are plenty of French (as well as British) who seem to do so.

A rather good and well-balanced article by Anne Vidalie in L'Express (June 2005) "Bienvenue dans le Dordogneshire!":

http://lexpress.fr/info/region/dossier/bergerac/

It's well worth reading the whole lot but note particularly page three (my emphasis):

Eymet (2 683 habitants), jolie bastide médiévale et fief britannique à

25 kilomètres au sud-est de Bergerac, ou le «ghetto anglais», comme

l'appellent les Britanniques eux-mêmes. Eymet et ses deux écoles

primaires, l'une publique, l'autre catholique, qui scolarisent 10

petits British chacune. Eymet et son marché où l'on parle anglais, même

au cœur de l'hiver. «Il suffit de fermer les yeux pour se croire en

Angleterre», rigole Leslie Hambleton, 43 ans. Eymet et son équipe de

cricket ...

and

A la jardinerie Desmartis aussi, la maîtrise de l'anglais est indispensable pour les vendeurs.

and from Le Monde diplomatique (Aug 2004) http://lexpress.fr/info/region/dossier/bergerac/

A Eymet, le maire, M. Magnac, recense 200 familles anglaises.

links edited by a moderator

[Teamedup]

Sounds like a curiosity to visit and if we are over that way, maybe we will.

Dordogneshire, that's just about right isn't it. I wonder how the indiginous population feel about the invasion.

[Hoddy]

Pity you didn't read the whole article Teamed up. We don't live down that end of the Dordogne, but we have been made very welcome - even my French friends from Soane-et-Loire were surprised.

Hoddy

[chessfou]

[quote]I wonder how the indiginous population feel about the invasion.[/quote]

Many are surprisingly positive - the invasion has helped to keep open several local schools and has been a boost for employment (of course, that doesn't mean they actually like it) - read the article linked in the first post - well worthwhile.

[Teamedup]

I've read the article now. And I might visit Eymet through morbid curiosity. It is an anathema to me that people move abroad to somewhere full of their compatriots. I realise that it isn't especially a british thing, most people's do it, I wouldn't and simply do not like the thought of it.

Should I be saying well done to the dordognais for being so sympa and how sad sad sad that their region was in such a bad state.

[Tony F Dordogne]

So why not Normandieshire or Brittanyshire for the large number of British living there?  One of the problems here is that the generation that orginally moved out here 20/25 years ago were older, retired and home counties, starting up groups like DOGS - can't remember what it stands for but it's a posh end group, also have a female equivelent and very 'Shire' which may have contributed to this silly name being used.

The village we live in is called Berbiguieres on Thames in a local immobilier.  Can't understand why, there aren't that many Brits here - but there are two Scots, a German/American, an Australian couple (maison secondaire) the chateau owners are Brits (but it's a maison secondaire and they don't really mix).  In fact there are only four Londoners living here, so the nickname is wholly inappropriate but probably used locally to drum up trade for the estate agent.

You do hear a lot of English spoken in the Dordogne, especially in the tourist seasons but then you do in other areas of France.  In our area there are a few Brits but in the winter, when the people who live here full-time are more evident, hearing English drops right away, it's only the quite small number of people who actually LIVE here full time that you hear and see.  And there are also a large number of Dutch here full-time so why not Hollandshire or something equally facile?

Eymet is odd in the British population being so large BUT, Eymet use that to their advantage and sort of hold themselves up as a Brit centre, not necessarily with the support of the British community - it would be interesting to know the proportion of British home owners who live in the Dordogne full-time as opposed to maison secondaire owners.

[cooperlola]

Agree, Tony, it's all about perception. When I tell the French locals where we live, they say, "oh, there are lots of Brits in that village."  In fact, there are 3 couples in a village of 2,000 inhabitants!!

[Teamedup]

Yes I would think that as many as Tony mentioned would be classed as a lot by the 2000 odd inhabitants in our village. I was wondering how many lived in this village with 'so' many brits.

[Turnip]

Whats new. You have ghettos in Brixton, Bradford etc. Maybe it's a safety in numbers thing to make life easier re- beaurocracy etc.

[Jacqui Too]

We have recently bought a house in the Dordogne as a holiday home, we spent 3 years looking in different parts of NW, W, and finally SW France, We knew what we wanted and we found it in NE Dordogne about 12 miles from Perigueux

We fell in love with an area and a house and the fact that there will probably be other brits in the area didn’t matter either way.

People have asked me if there are any other brits in our village and the answer is I don’t know and I don’t care, if I like someone it doesn’t matter if they are French, English, Dutch, Indian, black or white, and if I don’t I don't, simple

The Dordogne is beautiful and I can understand why everyone would love it.

I know it sounds like I have rose coloured specs on and we are only going to use the house as a holiday home, and maybe living there full time is a different ball game.

But until we find out any different, it’s the place for us

[:D]

Chipie

 

[Ford Anglia]

I have reasonable French, and have asked many people in our area, (about 6km north of the Dordogne border), how THEY feel about the numbers of English people living there.

Without fail, the replies have been positive, ranging from keeping businesses open, to doing up old houses which would otherwise fall into disrepair, and thus paying their previous owners for something that would otherwise be virtually worthless.

I've EVEN had one person tell me he prefers dealing with Brits as they are more polite than the French.....

[Gail Smith]

We live full time in N. Dordogne and when we were looking for houses it was a strange combination of events that led us to buy here.  I was adamant that I didnt want to live in Dordogne because of the concentration of brits here.

I was very wrong and am happy to admit it.  It is truely beautiful here and we love the area where we live.  When we travel around we have rarely found anywhere as beautiful as the Dronne valley where we live.  I would hate to leave here. 

We are quite isolated and there are Brits around but we are about 5 k from the nearest village and so we dont really know many people there.  We have British, Dutch and French friends and I am not ashamed of them!  They are friends and race doesnt matter.

I think there is a kind of inverted snobbery that people can say 'We live somewhere that has never been seen by a British person'  Well good for you.  What is the matter with people?  Is it a kind of oneupmanship that makes one feel superior to Dordogne dwellers?  The French people around us have no problem with British or Dutch or Germans or whatever.  I reckon that sometimes Brits are voicing some stereotypical racist comments and if you substituted the word British for black or Muslim the thread would long ago have been deleted.

 

Get over yourselves.

Gail x

[Just Katie]

Hi Gail,

I have been wondering that myself.  Why do people state they do not want to live near other British people?

[cooperlola]

True.  Of the three houses I can see from here (which include my own), 2 are occupied by Brits.  Is this a ghetto then?[:D]

[Val_2]

Funny word to use - Ghetto. Conjures up pictures of gangs hanging round on corners, broken down cars with wheels missing and hookers plying for trade. Is it really like that down there?

[RumziGal]

[quote user="Just Katie "]

Hi Gail,

I have been wondering that myself.  Why do people state they do not want to live near other British people?

[/quote]

Because they think it will give them extra points towards their Brownie Integration Badge?

[chessfou]

Definition of "ghetto":

 (1) Quartier d'une ville où résidait la communauté juive.

(2) Quartier d'une ville où vit une minorité mal intégrée à la société.

(3)  Se dit d'un milieu social clos sur lui-même.

[chessfou]

[quote]I have been wondering that myself.  Why do people state they do not want to live near other British people?[/quote]

Nothing to do with brownie points, more to do with two things:

(1) Are you really living in France if most, many or even just a few of your neighbours are not French?

(2) Even if you have reasonably good French (as we do), it will never be fluent if we surround ourselves with the English language.

Have you ever been to any of the Spanish Costas?  There are great swathes where Spanish is a foreign language! I recall a visit I made to Almeria (as special guest of an event there about 15 years ago), watching the roadside signs (none of which were in Spanish) as my hosts drove me through, successively the German quarter and the English quarter to my hotel on the edge of the tiny Spanish quarter.

[Teamedup]

Why don't people like me want to?

 Well, why leave one's native shore voluntarily to live amoungst one's compatriots somewhere else?

 If one is moving to France for France how much would a larger brit community affect the frenchness of where one lives.

This article has shown how much it can affect a region. No way would I want to say show off where I lived if we were next to a cricket ground in La France Profonde, or had numerous 'english' shops in the vicinty and heard constant english around me. Now my visitors might find it reassuring and maybe nice, but I would feel, well I can't think of a better word than embarrassed.

I sort of believe in some sort of herding mentality too, and that people who have a common language will be drawn to others they can talk to. Now I may be wrong about this, but I think that I could have done that.

I had a choice, there are areas around here with quite a lot of brits and other english speakers, so we deliberately went in the other direction. I always say, when I want lots of english company, I know of a little island just en face de Calais, I go there.

 

[Suze01]

With a few exceptions, it's not because who lives here already for the reason to moving to the Dordogne, it's because it's a beautiful region with superb varied scenery, fantastic food, lovely architecture, an excellent climate... I could go on.  That is why many nationalities, inlcuding many French second-home-owners and re-locators move to the Dordogne. 

Unfortunately it has acquired this tag which could equally be applied to Provence, Languedoc, Charente, Lot, Normandy to mention but a few. 

It would be interesting if someone could find some stats on the spread of Brit nationals living in France by region, we may be able to start off a new nickname for some other regions then that may well have a higher % of Brit residents.

I have lived in the Dordogne for the past five years (in the NW which is less touristy). Yes, when you go to certain towns on market day you will hear qute a few Brit voices, but some of those will be holiday makers. Generally though you really don't come across that many on a day-to-day basis, or even week-to-week for that matter. I have no idea about cricket grounds, there may be one in St Astier, there's certainly not one of every village green as seems to (almost) have been portrayed.

How 'it' can affect a region? Well, I can't see any detrimental effect on the area, only positive ones like regeneration and more regional income from taxes paid. There is no 'Britishness' anywhere around here, it is regionally French through and through.

Personally I think those who are critical are just jealous - if it wasn't such a georgeous place to be then why do so many people holiday here?

[:P] 

[Just Katie]

 I understand TU's choice (as well as the choice of so many others) and so be it.  But I still do not understand why a person would avoid a beautiful area like the Dordy because of its 'high' number of Brits.  If it is all about integrating with the French, you could still do that regardless of the number of Brits in the area couldnt you?

Of course there are some Brits one would not want to integrate with in a million years and I could stereotype the sort that would make me run a mile.  However is there not a French variety that would have the same effect?

My mum told me there is good and bad everywhere.

[5-element]

[quote user="Just Katie "]

  But I still do not understand why a person would avoid a beautiful area like the Dordy because of its 'high' number of Brits. 

[/quote]

Perhaps because there are other equally (if not more) beautiful areas than the Dordogne, with fewer Brits, and therefore where property prices are still attractive.

I was born in Perigueux, by the way.

The few (French) family members I still have who live around the area, bemoan the way it has... gone to "Les Anglais", which means according to them, that property prices have shot up so that no French person can buy a house in the Dordogne anymore. Not strictly true, of course, but still worth mentioning.

 

[Just Katie]

Yes 5E I agree with that.  We have the same in Wales.  Les Anglais are sneakily building a new empire throughout the world[:D].

My question however was, why would people avoid areas where there is a high number of Brits irrespective of property prices?

[5-element]

Maybe because "they" like the idea of   moving somewhere exotic, where the notorious, pioneering indomitable British spirit can shine through. Large numbers of other Brits already being there would put the koibosch on that notion?...[:D] What happens to your need for conquest then?[:D]

(sorry about spelling for koibosch, not in my Robert)[:'(]

[Patf]

There are a few british families near us and we are  friendly with them, as with our french neighbours. But I would be uncomfortable if there were more british than french in our commune. So I am also concerned about the influx of british and dutch to the proposed  retirement village not far from us. The reason is that when  immigrants outnumber the  indigenous population this is a recipe for trouble. That is why I would avoid areas where there is a a high number of brits. Partly because I'm a coward and partly because it's not fair for the locals.  Pat.