Turnip Posted February 21, 2007 Share Posted February 21, 2007 [quote user="Tony F Dordogne"] Never been happier, yesterday worked for a couple of hours in morning, then on to local market, 10.5 euro menu in resto we hadn't visited before but which had been recommended by French and English chums, back home via a couple of quick visits to chums for exchanges of information and then about 2 hours each working on terrace setting it up for spring.And as for the retiring and being together all day thing, we've always worked (arms length) together, have similar interests (though we also also do our own thing), keep each other on our toes intellectually and we miss each other when we're apart. For us retirement (and we both baled out early) was always going to be a partnership and that's how it's turned out to be - and we both realise just how privileged we are financially but it's taken 40 years for us to get to this position and it was worth every day for what we have now. But I don't think I'd like to be a younger family, artisans having to make a living here, we have friends in that position and sometimes my heart bleeds for them.Go back - no, that's a retrograde step to us, don't think we've ever gone back at all in our lives, doesn't fit in our mind sets. The kids (all in their 30s, eldest 40) and rest of the family know where we are, 2 and half hours from them by plane max from airport to our door, they have their own lives and so do we. The thread above this (Whats the 7th largest city french city? - "London") relates to the young families you mention: If they are able and so inclined they head for the Uk for a decent job and income. [/quote] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KathyC Posted February 21, 2007 Share Posted February 21, 2007 [quote user="Panda Bear"]In danger of going off topic but in line with the sentiment in the article sited by WJT, has anyone else noticed that programmes on the TV such as 'master chef' are starting to be full of what anyone would consider to be highly trained professionals looking for a way out of their hard fought for career. The last show I watched had 2 lawyers and a scientist with a phd, why do they want to give up years of training to become a chef which they could have achieved in a fraction of the time? We seem to live in an age where everyone is unhappy with their lot and wants to change, I must say that when I first started work everyone eyed the top job with envy and worked hard to get promotion, if I think about it now I don't know anyone who has that kind of ambition anymore, the only ambition I come across is to be able to 'drop out'. Am I imagining this shift in mind set.... [/quote]I do careers guidance work with adults and what you've said is so true! I've seen unhappy teachers who want to be hairdressers, unhappy chefs who want to be plumbers, unhappy plumbers who want to be teachers; it goes on and on. Sometimes I wish I could get them all in a room together and get them to all to swap their lives to see if they would be happier. I rather doubt it! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Teamedup Posted February 21, 2007 Share Posted February 21, 2007 When I think about it so many my friends have had career changes in the UK, the majority of them. All this started a long long time ago when I was a young woman. I suppose that most of us started work at a young age. By the time we reached 20 some were already ready for a change. Qualified apprentices went off to college and became various things, a complete change for them. And as time went by more and more of my friends did the same. Why, because they could. Maybe those of us who were leaving education in the late 60's just knew that nothing was fixed in stone. We could move on.Happiness, well maybe that, some of the men certainly left well paid skilled jobs to end up in less well paid careers. I think fulfillment was something that was valued when these changes were made. Changing jobs is certainly something that is 'done' in the UK. I only know one person who has had a full career change in France. Are people happy in their work in France, are they fulfilled. It is never discussed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cassis Posted February 21, 2007 Share Posted February 21, 2007 [quote user="Teamedup"]Changing jobs is certainly something that is 'done' in the UK. I only know one person who has had a full career change in France. Are people happy in their work in France, are they fulfilled. It is never discussed. [/quote]Christ, no - in France everyone does the same thing all their life, don't they? Or so it seems. Hence the catastrophe if a company closes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cerise Posted February 22, 2007 Share Posted February 22, 2007 In France changing companies, never mind careers is seen as unstable. The anciennete system tends to mean that you only get paid more if you have been there about 100 years (OK exaggeration 97 years[:D]). On recent trip to England with French friend she was horrified to hear one of my friends say that her son (aged 29) had packed up his job to 'give something else a try'. English friends were quite casual about it and happy that he had moved to something he enjoyed more, but French friend said 'Oh his poor Maman, I'd be so worried if one of my children behaved like that.' My husband is retraining in France (very lucky that his employer took a chance on him), but people are very uncomfortable that he is not working in his old field and find it very odd. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chauffour Posted February 22, 2007 Share Posted February 22, 2007 we are leaving France (once we sell...) after 5 fantastic years, why we are leaving? we have found another paradise: South Africa! we had a great time in Dordogne, running our gites and developing new skills we never knew we had, (for some strange reason we seem to cook the best pizza on this planet! [:D])we just feel we need a change and a new challange, we will open our pizza club in Cape Town. we feel our life is more complete here in Cape Town, we live in a beautiful valley, overlooking Table Mountain, 3km from the beach, 20 minutes from the centre where we can see cinemas (one of the things we miss in france, our french being so so), we can eat in so many different restaurants etc. who knows, one day we might even go back to live in France, maybe in the alps this time......anyway, we are coming back to France in April for possibly our last season, and i cant's wait to fire up my oven again!!! massimo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Llwyncelyn Posted February 22, 2007 Share Posted February 22, 2007 Chauffour I do not wish to extend this posting to encompass other issues but a friend of ours together with his wife and young children gave up wonderful careers in the UK for they had a 'calling.' They are absolute and commited Christians. They work for nothing in an aids facility in South Africa and it is harrowing to see what is currently going on not only in South Africa but Africa as a whole.I have also been on a cricket tour to South Africa and we were feted but at times warned not to go out at night. I felt uncomfortable not with the inability of going out but the overall concept. I did not go again.I am sorry but as in the rest of the world there is good bad and absolutely horrendous things taking place in South Africa. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Le Petomane Posted February 22, 2007 Share Posted February 22, 2007 "Nothing, like something, happens anywhere." (Philip Larkin) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ruonglue Posted March 1, 2007 Share Posted March 1, 2007 IMHO its crazy to come to france and expect to be having intellectual conversations in French unless you are fluent before you arrive I think i can speak the language to a moderate degree and dont have a problem in my daily conversations with the other people who live in my commune, however they are almost 100% small farmers. The weather Crops Animals Veterinary Subjects and Food and drink are the main subjects.My French friends are extremely impressed with the number of books we have on display, i cant remember seeing a book in any of my neighbours houses.The real revelation to us in our 3rd year in France is how easy it has been to make such good friends from England. From having a small circle of old friends in the UK we have a great social life now , OK you do meet the odd ones now and again but except for the obvious chavs we are willing to give anybody a try once.most of our new friends tend to be from the south of England(we are from the north) as i think the majority of migrants tend to come from there.We are a fairly young family with kids at school but our friends both French and Brits come from all age groups which is another refreshing change.In the Uk we wouldnt have dreamt of inviting a couple in their sixties to dinner, but here its natural and we have really benefitted. Where do you all live where there is nothing to do? we are so busy i worry that we are taking too long to get round to people we owe invitations to. we recently held an aperatif evening and 65 turned up 50/50 French/English and there were loads we forgot or couldnt make .I find the French a bit reserved sometimes but given a bit of encouragement,a few drinks and a bit of insight into how the brits enjoy themselves they are unstoppable and are really pleased to have the opportunity to let themselves go.Move Back? never Move on? maybe when the kids leave home sellup and go round the world in a winnebago Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RumziGal Posted March 2, 2007 Share Posted March 2, 2007 [quote user="ruonglue"]Where do you all live where there is nothing to do? [/quote]The outskirts of Montpellier.The last time I was here, I was here for 3 weeks and hardly saw anyone, because people just stay in their little houses or in the evenings are taxi-ing the children about to their various activities. There isn't the wild and constant socialisation thing going on, no communal card-playing on winter evenings or anything like that. I can walk the dog 3 times a day and not meet another soul, or walk the kilometre into the village to the boulangerie and back and also not meet a soul except the lady behind the counter in the boulangerie.Don't get me wrong, the neighbours are there if you need them, but if nobody needs anything, they see no reason to bother each other. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PossumGirl Posted March 2, 2007 Share Posted March 2, 2007 [quote user="RumziGal"]The last time I was here, I was here for 3 weeks and hardly saw anyone, because people just stay in their little houses or in the evenings are taxi-ing the children about to their various activities. There isn't the wild and constant socialisation thing going on, no communal card-playing on winter evenings or anything like that. I can walk the dog 3 times a day and not meet another soul, or walk the kilometre into the village to the boulangerie and back and also not meet a soul except the lady behind the counter in the boulangerie.[/quote]It's just the opposite for us here. I can't go out the door without stopping to chat with at least 3 or 4 people. Just going to get bread (2 doors away) turns into a half-hour trip because of chatting.Granted, one doesn't have in depth, intellectual conversations with everyone they meet, but there is plenty of room for different types of interaction.PG Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gastines Posted March 2, 2007 Share Posted March 2, 2007 Whilst I expect that there are some UKers that you may not wish to socialize with,an evening without having to keep up a French conversation can be a pleasure. Try this to break the monotony. Contact 4-5 couples and say you are doing a light supper and a Trivial Pursuit game afterwards. If they would like to contribute a bottle of wine. After that it may be that the idea will get passed on to the others attending, No need to go mad with the budget.Regards Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smudger Posted March 2, 2007 Share Posted March 2, 2007 I am. After 6 years I’m off .My reasons are pretty much the same as many of thosearticulated on this thread. I reckon there’s a sort of evolutionary process that’sfairly typical:Year One – An exciting time. Start to learn French, meet themayor, and find out how the place ticks (slowly, but you won’t know this tillyear 2). You may even do an ‘at home’ for your neighbours but are mildlychagrined that none of them invite you back to chez eux.Year Two – French improving above beginners level. Start tohave the ‘French’ experience – chat to neighbours (and are sort of pleased whensome ask you to tutoyer them), do the ‘aperos’, convince oneself that the €10menu is great (basic but, hey, it’s the ‘real’ France) and meet other expats.Exchange interesting information relating to CPAM, tax, builders, tilers,plumbers, how cheap (or not) power tools are in Castorama and where you can buy MarmiteYear Three – Your UK based chums and family start tobecome a pain as they all insist on coming over every Summer and still don’tknow the Fish rule – fine for a day or two but stink after the third.Year Four – Good intermediate French. You now realise howexpensive it is to live in France,and how you’ve been stitched by builders, tilers and plumbers over the past fewyears – all their ‘handiwork’ starts to show its age. And you’re beginning torealise duck-fat is not good for the heart.Year Five – You finally twig that the French are geneticallydull, often dysfunctional and, according to one of your only 8French friends, still believe that they can have something for nothing. Yourealise also that a significant proportion of fellow expats are not, to put itdelicately, the sort of folk you would have associated with back in the UK. Year Six – Your golf isn’t improving and you’re on the vergeof being blackballed at your local club on account of drinking too much andgoosing the female staff. You then startto learn to ski and find the food in French ski resorts is even worse thanwhere you live. And there’s no snow. But you’re not surprised. And then you move to Belgium, for a more exciting life. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Will Posted March 2, 2007 Share Posted March 2, 2007 How true - haven't quite got to six years myself yet but I can appreciate every word.One thing that always mystifies me. Why, if the cost of living is so low in France, are certain forums full of requests for the cheapest sources of this, that, and the other? (well, perhaps not the other, but I have heard some stories of local expat communities, definitely not the sort of people I would associate with from choice in England. In fact nobody who uses the word 'expat' is likely to be a friend of mine). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steff Posted March 2, 2007 Share Posted March 2, 2007 Smudger - that was a brilliant summary and made me smile. We too are leaving! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oglefakes Posted March 2, 2007 Share Posted March 2, 2007 Smudger, you may have been happier further south, Señor ?? [:)] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cassis Posted March 2, 2007 Share Posted March 2, 2007 It made me smile as well - timescale may be shortened or compressed, but in general if what you believe on here is representative [Www] of us immigrants, it rings all the right bells! Good luck! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Iceni Posted March 2, 2007 Share Posted March 2, 2007 If the UK is so wonderful why did you/we leave in the first place ? Or have we all realised too late that the grass is never greener ?Johnnot Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cassis Posted March 2, 2007 Share Posted March 2, 2007 The one thing you can't leave behind is yourself. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chauffour Posted March 3, 2007 Share Posted March 3, 2007 [quote user="Cassis"]The one thing you can't leave behind is yourself.[/quote] ...but you can leave the Mother in Law!!! [6] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Logan Posted March 3, 2007 Share Posted March 3, 2007 How does life become in France after year 25? You start to believe France is the only civilised place on earth. The British seem quite beyond the pail and a siesta in the afternoons becomes obligatory. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dick Smith Posted March 3, 2007 Share Posted March 3, 2007 I like the idea of being beyond the pail. Does that mean you have kicked the bucket? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blanche Neige Posted March 3, 2007 Share Posted March 3, 2007 I like the idea of being beyond the pail. Does that mean you have kicked the bucket?LOL[:)] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Teamedup Posted March 3, 2007 Share Posted March 3, 2007 [quote user="Logan"]How does life become in France after year 25? You start to believe France is the only civilised place on earth. The British seem quite beyond the pail and a siesta in the afternoons becomes obligatory.[/quote] [8-)][:-))] Non, cannot relate to that at all.Only the siesta in the afternoon seems to become obligitory after a certain age where ever one is, or as my Dad calls it a quick snooze. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dick Smith Posted March 3, 2007 Share Posted March 3, 2007 [quote user="Teamedup"]my Dad calls it a quick snooze.[/quote]Julie calls it 'resting her eyes'... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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