Debra Posted August 31, 2005 Share Posted August 31, 2005 Just for the hell I dont sit on the computer all day I do other things so as your missus said on the other forum to Newlad aka me (big deal I post on two forums) "Go away, little boy" Her words not mine Now if you dont mind Im off to watch the tele with Mrs Fluff if that is alright with you . So it might be tomorrow before we speak again XXXXXXSorry not to respond to your kisses more quickly but we had already retired to watch TV - Emmerdale and Eastenders - digging up Den's body - and then The Bill - had more appeal than continuing with this saga, believe me!Glad you admit to being newboy on the other forum. The main reason I mentioned it (repeatedly before you finally admitted it) was because you made a big deal about Paul and I posting to the same subject as if it was somehow wrong. We posted to the same subject on both forums (and with the same and then similar (I objected to him pinching my photo so I changed it!) avatars and signatures, its rather obvious that we are connected - and use the same ids on both forums, not trying to hide under completely different identities. We don't normally have cause to post on the same forums (Paul hasn't posted on either that often) but on this occasion I felt I should join in with my valid opinion. You seem to object to this - is Mrs Fluff not allowed an opinion then?You posted with different ids on the two forums, seeming to only be out to cause trouble and not admitting that it was the same person quoting out of context on both forums. Glad we cleared it up. Paul has turned his pc off in disgust and gone to bed, so I'll turn mine off and join him now. Hope you enjoyed your evening of TV with Mrs Fluff. Sweet dreams. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
0zeb100ddMMyyyy0Falseen-USTrue Posted August 31, 2005 Share Posted August 31, 2005 HelloThis thread has reached the point where it has moved miles away from the original post. The original post asked for info concerning air rifles in France and now it seems to be that all the tree huggers are beating their drums. If the guy has a problem with pests (and there are quite a few out there causing a lot of damage to the environment) and he wants to try to balance the situation why not mind your own business and let him get on with his.Regards Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pinkfluff<P>Big Wet Drops and Lots of Them, Are a Sure Sign of Rain!<P> Posted August 31, 2005 Share Posted August 31, 2005 Sorry ZEB100 just like you are expressing your opinion, I can and will ,with or without your aproval express mine .Now it is the first time I have been called a "tree hugger" you have made me proud I never joined swampy because I did not like the taste of special brew and was too busy working 7 days a week to live in a tree or a hole Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Debra Posted August 31, 2005 Share Posted August 31, 2005 [quote]Hello This thread has reached the point where it has moved miles away from the original post. The original post asked for info concerning air rifles in France and now it seems to be that all the tree...[/quote]Exactly. I believe its clear both on here and the other forum that (despite the implications of trouble makers) we have no intention of breaking any laws. If we do have any problems with herons, cormorants or coypu we will check with the relevant authorities what we are allowed to do and within that, what we consider to be the most humane methods for dealing with them. Thanks for your help. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zeb Posted August 31, 2005 Share Posted August 31, 2005 It's a pity that neither of you made that very clear in the first place.I'm with pinkfluff in that I really don't mind being called a "treehugger" whatever that is, but I do resent being called a troublemaker just because I enjoy the rich variety of wildlife around here. Hopefully, you will too when you move to France and respect the fact that they also have to feed, just as you and your carp do, the only way they know. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Debra Posted August 31, 2005 Share Posted August 31, 2005 I'm sorry but if you read both threads it is made clear. This thread was asking about the regulations for air rifles and the subject digressed. As soon as someone questioned the legality of shooting herons or cormorants, Paul asked if anyone knew the regulations. Noone replied, but simply digressed into attacks about the very idea of shooting birds or the supposedly cute coypu (even though the problems these animals cause have been well documented on these forums). We were told to 'let the professionals handle it' and asked how they handle it but that question wasn't replied to either. Noone on this thread even told us who the professionals were - so the other thread created on TF asked specifically about the regulations regarding these birds/animals (which,clearly, we did not know about when starting this thread). We were given specific advice on TF about the regulations about the birds/animals and specific advice on this thread about regulations about guns. The rest just got out of hand, with newboy/pinkfluff making inflamatory statements about us breaking the law which were just out of the air, using quotes out of context, with no real basis on the true progression of this thread. Certain people will object to us (or anyone) killing any birds or animals, within the regulations. They don't care about the law - only their personal opinions. The laws are there for reasons. For instance, it used to be illegal to kill cormorants in the UK until it was recognised that they cause significant damage to fisheries. The fact that in France they were allowed to kill 25000 a year was used to argue for UK fishery owners to have special licences to shoot these birds. The law in the UK has now changed and the special licences are issued. We're not sure about the law in France and need to find out exactly what it is. The posters on TF have explained that, as we found out ourselves via an internet search (and posted on here accordingly), herons are protected across Europe, that it is the responsibility of the Guarde De Chasse to control cormorants - whether he issues licences to fishery owners or not, we don't yet know. Finally, coypu (or ragondin) control differs by department and time of year. We will ask the maire who is selling us the lakes for specific advice, since we also understand from the TF thread that the law can be different by department on all of these issues.Basically, if you don't like people operating within the law and think cormorants and coypu should be left alone to destroy lake habitats and fish, then campaign to change the laws rather than attacking individual people who intend operating within the law. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Christine Animal Posted August 31, 2005 Share Posted August 31, 2005 Zeb and Pinkfluff, I'm with you too. I think Treehugger is a lovely name, much better than Triggerpuller.Debra, please do not answer, distorting what we say. Let's hope that the session is now closed and that you will enjoy your new life in France, whether you respect the laws or not, as long as you respect ethics and nature. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Debra Posted September 1, 2005 Share Posted September 1, 2005 Some quotes from the other forum:"Anyone see on the UK news this AM that licences have been granted to cull up to 3000 (I think it was) cormorants on fishing lakes in the UK?"my reply:It looks like it was 3000 but then the RSPB objected and it was reduced to 1500. Isn't that countrywide? I got this feeling that we were being slammed because we are 'English people coming to France to decimate the wildlife' (even though we may not even have a problem and so may not be culling anything), really awful - and yet hang on, French people are allowed to cull 25000 per year and English people 1500? So who is fitting in with the French here, us or the objectors? It seems that if we own a fishery in France we are allowed much more leeway in killing predators than we would be if we bought a fishery in the UK. Signing off, rather tired of this whole argument, having avoided it all day and been much worn out by playing Risk with three under 8's for 8 hours today (have sympathy, please - its still to continue tomorrow!).... (Oh no - have now left myself wide open to objectors to playing world domination games with primary school aged children! Hey, in my defence - at least they already know world geography better than I do!!!) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Debra Posted September 1, 2005 Share Posted September 1, 2005 Debra, please do not answer, distorting what we say.Christine - its not me that's been distorting - I have tried to answer every post whereas you just make statements, ignore the response and ignore any return questions. Even this final posting (or will it be? Can you live without having the last word??) with the 'distorting' bit in it is an attempt to imply I've somehow been dishonest. You're even answering someone elses namecalling as if it was me that said it (did I call you or anyone a treehugger?) and then using silly names in return. Can't you answer the person who called you a treehugger directly? Scared of the response or just got your knife out for me, disregarding anyone else's name on a post/opinion and attributing them all to me? Do you just hope people will take you at your word and not read the whole thread? Thanks for finally wishing us well, instead of ill, if you meant it - I'll give you the benefit of the doubt and assume you're not just being patronising. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Christine Animal Posted September 1, 2005 Share Posted September 1, 2005 What a shame you have just deleted most of the text of your post at 2 or 3 in the morning, it was pourtant a lovely "Fishy Fairy Tail". Could you please put it back otherwise people who saw it, and can no longer see it, might think that you are distorting things.Zeb 100. Thanks for calling me a Tree Hugger, I take it as a compliment.Debra, I have nothing personally against you, can you try to understand that? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
le bouffon Posted September 1, 2005 Share Posted September 1, 2005 Getting back to shooting herons I would suggest that a shotgun would be more of a gun to use and not that difficult to get hold of in france after all herons are pretty thin and with a wide spread cartridge would make sure the bird is well shot,. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bluebells Posted September 1, 2005 Share Posted September 1, 2005 advice only : no arguements please : if you are still in the uk go down to your local gun shop and discuss your potential problem, air rifles maybe ok but distance and quality of weapon critical and do not scrimp on a good scope, only up to 12ft lbs pressure in uk without firearm certificate, under 12ft lb will not give you too much lethal disatnce, dont know about France but the extra poundage would greatly increase ability of weapon so if you could get one in france without a licence so much the better. Head shots very tricky, slightest movements, wind etc, hope you are as good as you say, but discuss all with gun shop they may have some very good bird scarers also, good luck with the resolution of the problem.P.S try the BASC website for info or even give them a call. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
serrif Posted September 1, 2005 Share Posted September 1, 2005 [quote]We are shortly to complete on our lakes in the Dordogne and I would like to have an air rifle powerful enough to take out a heron or a cormorant (not that I've seen any yet). I was wondering if they ...[/quote]Make very sure that you are not breaking the law in France, by hunting with an air rifle. An off the shelf rifle in the UK has a power maximum of 12/foot lbs. That power will kill a rabbit up to about 30 yards, using a head shot. Any power above 12/ft.lbs requires a firearms certificate in the UK. I don't know about France. I would not consider any rifle below .22 without a good scope, and definitely over 12/ft.lbs. for what you have in mind. Followed by plenty of practice !!!Check out www.airgunshooting.org Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
serrif Posted September 1, 2005 Share Posted September 1, 2005 [quote]We are shortly to complete on our lakes in the Dordogne and I would like to have an air rifle powerful enough to take out a heron or a cormorant (not that I've seen any yet). I was wondering if they ...[/quote]Make very sure that you are not breaking the law in France, by hunting with an air rifle. An off the shelf rifle in the UK has a power maximum of 12/foot lbs. That power will kill a rabbit up to about 30 yards, using a head shot. Any power above 12/ft.lbs requires a firearms certificate in the UK. I don't know about France. I would not consider any rifle below .22 without a good scope, and definitely over 12/ft.lbs. for what you have in mind. Followed by plenty of practice !!!Check out www.airgunshooting.org Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Debra Posted September 1, 2005 Share Posted September 1, 2005 [quote]What a shame you have just deleted most of the text of your post at 2 or 3 in the morning, it was pourtant a lovely "Fishy Fairy Tail". Could you please put it back otherwise people who saw it, and c...[/quote]Why would it be distorting things to remove a post noone had replied to? I wrote it when I was half-cut and mellow at 2am in the morning, and thought aw - maybe she's not as bad as she is sounding. In the cold light of day, sober, I realised you most likely are and would probably take the mickey - which you have, so you've proved me right. The main thing I noticed this morning was the significant 'distorting' comment and realised you were probably being sarcastic wishing us well, so my response was inappropriately friendly and personal. Hence I removed it and replaced it with a more appropriate response. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Debra Posted September 1, 2005 Share Posted September 1, 2005 Thanks for your help guys, especially since you run the risk of being harrassed about it. Le Bouffon - if you read the thread, we discovered that herons are protected, but then I suspect you already know that (not trying to wind Christine the animal up even more are you??) The info about feet and pounds and stuff means nothing to me but Paul assures me he has the information he needs from the postings and pm's (and yes, he is a more than competent shot), as he posted earlier. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
le bouffon Posted September 2, 2005 Share Posted September 2, 2005 Read only a few posts on this and was replying on the subject of air rifles and was pointing out the they are not the best thin to shoot at herons or birds in general when a shotgun is a much better option with the cartridges they can fire.Such as a wide spread cartridge will spread and "blow away"anything with in range,though not recommended if the thing your shooting is for the pot as there would be little left to eat and would be full of buck- shot.The hunting season as now just started with the dogs an all,our neighbour across the road as 7 shotguns including a 410 which would get rid of most animals. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Debra Posted September 2, 2005 Share Posted September 2, 2005 Sounds a bit dangerous! Though admittedly, I'm ignorant about guns - but wouldn't there be a possiblity of hitting something else, that you weren't aiming at, with such a shotgun? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stevemaison Posted September 2, 2005 Share Posted September 2, 2005 If heron shooting was legal in France, would you shoot them with your air rifle if they came near your lake in order to catch fish? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Posted September 3, 2005 Share Posted September 3, 2005 I wanted to buy an Air Rifle for getting rid of some rabbits at a house i look after, went into a gun shop and was told that an Air Rifle was not powerful enough and was shown a fully silenced Beretta? .22 rifle, the owner told me that with this there would be no mistake, telescopic sight, bolt action. The idea of it being silenced was so that you could pick off the animal/bird without scaring off the rest of the flock....price....around €550.00 NO permit required. He also told me that lathough you would be shooting on your own land you were still NOT allowed to shoot outside of the hunting season....this was in Riberac, northern Dordogne so this may be different from place to place. Before anyone attacks me as a 'killer of animals' i am posting this info as someone who actually gave up fishing because i thought that i was hurting the fish, that said i am NOT anti Fishing/Hunting either. just to add, i recently read of a guy that went into his local Intermarché with .22 rifle...killed his girlfriend then himself, so who knows how long a rifle of this type will be available without a permit? Perhaps you could use one of those bird scarer guns that just make a bang automatically now and again?......Anyway happy fishing...regardsDave Goodwin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Posted September 3, 2005 Share Posted September 3, 2005 just took the time to page through ALL of the posts in this thread..........my my....Born_to_Fish....you really have stirred up all the 'righteous' folk on these forums. He only asked for advice...not condemnation..regardsDave Goodwin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chris pp Posted September 3, 2005 Share Posted September 3, 2005 The facts of the situation have been made clear one way or another on "the other forum".All birds are protected in France with the exception of the birds listed as "huntable". All three types of Heron and the cormorant are protected Nationally.Cormorants can be subject to culling only by a specific arret prefectorial, this is normally only given for people who are running fish farms for human consumption and is subject to a quota and circumstances.No firing of guns or hunting is permitted outside of the hunting season dates set every year (different dates for different types of hunt)The only group that is permitted in normal circumstances to operate outside of these dates is the Guarde de Chasse again by prefectorial arret.Coypu ( or ragondin) are subject to the same hunting laws although again the commune can apply for a specific arret. Unfortunately poisoning of coypu is widely practised at all times of the year - the problem with poison is that other species, some endangered fall victim to the poison - BAD NEWS.There are also other complications which require legal solutions - it is not straight forward to make you fishing or hunting private without a legal process - if you hunt or fish on your land so can everyone else in most departements.The only place where one will get definitive answers is the Prefecture - forget your local Mayor.Chris Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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