Baware if you are driving on UK plates

[woolybanana]

Just out of interest, has anyone come across anyone who has been refused a claim by their French insurance company because their car is still on British plates? Or have they been either warned or more by the gendarmes or whoever that they should change their plates?

[Tony F Dordogne]

Yes, I know of at least 3 people who have been warned by the gendarmes and one other who has been prosecuted for this and a couple of other offences.  And this offence is one of those being dealt with by the special unit set up in the Dordogne, so people like the guy whose uninsured - completely uninsured - UK car which hit and killed a deer before the wife - who was driving - buggered off before the authorities arrived, may finally get caught.

[Juswundrin]

"Just out of interest, has anyone come across anyone who has been refused a claim by their French insurance company because their car is still on British plates?"

Sort of; a couple from OH's French class were involved in an accident in their UK-registered, French-insured car.

The car (can't remember the model, but it was a pretty upmarket saloon, and only two or three years old) was damaged beyond economical repair.

The insurers gave them scrap value; their argument was that, as it wasn't registered here, it wasn't a 'car' so was treated purely as a couple of tons of metal.

[Chancer]

So after all of the hypothesising about legality etc we have two anecdotal cases of insurers (one british one french) refusing to meet the insureds claim but not the claims of a 3rd party.

It has previously been pointed out that these people are usually actually paying far more for their motoring costs(especially if returning to the Uk for MOT) than if they were to register and insure their cars here.

As the only people they are cheating is themselves should they wreck their car I think that we should feel sorry for them rather than huffing and puffing about "if they were to run into my car[:@]" etc etc etc.

Why not turn the attention towards uninsured drivers of all nationalities? At least they are easier to find here in France. If the Uk were to adopt the vignette system then you would know at a glance if any of these UK registered cars parked at airports that so bother some people are actually insured and could inform the Gendarmes.

In fact why not send E-mails to the UK government lobbying them to fall into line rather than bothering the DVLA on hypothetical points of law?

[woolybanana]

And how else would you while away your leisure hours?

[Miranda]

 I strongly object to your defamatory remarks about the paper I edit. Of course it has made mistakes in the past and has always published errata when necessary as all responsible publications  do. The fact that this  paper has been going for twenty years means most other websites and papers in English about France have gleaned from it an amount of information researched originally and painfully by our team starting from an era before government websites and fora like this one existed, probably even before you had your first French dream. Anyway, those wishing to receive a copy of the letter from the ministry which supported Brian McCullough's article can email me on [email protected].

[AnOther]

[quote user="Bugbear"]

I've posted this little snippet for those who may still doubt that insurance companies will do all they can to avoid paying out on claims.

Now you can understand a problem if you make major modifications, but tyres and even a different type of spark plug  [:@]

Read the full article HERE

[/quote]I agree in principal that insurance companies will do their best to wriggle out of paying out but a sense of proportion needs to be kept.

Premiums are based on risk and if that is not fully disclosed then both the letter and spirit of the contract has been broken.

Let me say I have no personal downer on bikers nor any axe to grind however I too would reject an insurance claim for a vehicle, bike or car, with £1000 worth of undeclared modifications, can people not see that such mods would undoubtedly make a bike more nickable and therefore higher risk ?

Frankly whatever they say I cannot believe that NU would get away with rejecting a claim for something as simple as a spark plug or a replacement tyre, if it were a racing slick or something not suitable for normal road use then that's a different matter of course.

I admit to only being a casual and infrequent reader of MCN but have to say that some articles I have read do little to dissuade a large proportion of the public at large of the opinion that motorcyclists are a bunch of anarchistic hooligans who consider themselves above the law and this article does them no credit.

Some of the ensuing readers comments are also somewhat immature and nieve.

e.g.

going to tell the bastards are you?

At present I have road legal race tyres on bike.

[dave21478]

wow, I go away for a few weeks and when I come back, this is STILL going?

Im sure its a very interesting debate for those involved, but time to gve it a rest surely?

 

 

Oh, and those brits who have their cars done legally here would seem to be the tiny minority. Walking across the long-term airport car park the other day, a quick look revealed that 19 of the 32 cars I walked past between mine and the exit were UK registered, and only 1 of them had a valid tax disc. Obviously no idea how long it had been there though.

[woolybanana]

But Dave, you do not need to tax a car in France because they do not have tax discs.

[Jonzjob]

Yeh, but they should have a nice one to match the U.K. plates Woolleeyy. It looks nice and adds a bit of colour to the window?

Edit :- Quick change of subject for a mo. Why do some French cars have a white rear number plate? It seems to be getting more common round here???

[SC]

[quote user="Jonzjob"]

Why do some French cars have a white rear number plate? It seems to be getting more common round here???

[/quote]

Because they can [:)]

Steve

[woolybanana]

Because the French distrust anything which is not 'white'?[6]

[mint]

Wooly

You are mixing up your threads (not to say your p's & q's)!

[woolybanana]

Surely, sweet17, you have a white rear   numberplate, don't you? I do. Imagine having a red one like the Belgians, or a blue one like the Chileans.

[ColinE]

Hi People

Have just come home after a week in France looking for a house to buy, a friend gave me the November copy of French news, there is an articale in there say that you do not have to change your english number plates, it quotes reg, numbers anyone got any thoughts on this.

 

Colin

[woolybanana]

I think I want a ringside seat here please[6]

[Clair]

[quote user="ColinE"]Hi People

Have just come home after a week in France looking for a house to buy, a friend gave me the November copy of French news, there is an articale in there say that you do not have to change your english number plates, it quotes reg, numbers anyone got any thoughts on this.

Colin[/quote]

Hi Colin,

this particular article is the cause of the current discussion. Read the thread from here: http://www.completefrance.com/cs/forums/16/1077926/ShowPost.aspx#1077926

Is this round 12?[blink][8-)]

[powerdesal]

Deja-vu, and round and round they go.[:(]

[Tony F Dordogne]

Colin, as with other things in this paper, they got it wrong.

[woolybanana]

If they did so, will they publish a retraction, do you think?  Or did we?

[Bob T]

No problem Colin, just have the newspaper with you in the car when you are stopped by the French police, or when you have an accident, and show them the paper. I am sure that they will let you off. Not.

[Ron Avery]

[quote user="Tony F Dordogne"]Colin, as with other things in this paper, they got it wrong.[/quote]

Actually Tony they didn't get it wrong as such, this is exactly the information supplied to them by Monsieur  Villeneuve,  Chef du bureau de la législation économique et domaniale et du droit communautaire (DGPA/DAJIL/ED4).   In the letter he states: (my translation)  "The acquisition of a used vehicle requires a change to its registration".

 Then he says: "the acquisition of a new vehicle already registered in the EU does not require a new registration in France".

 

Why there is a difference between the immatriculation of a new car and a used one is not explained, but perhaps what is meant by "immatriculation" in both context needs clarification and that is what is happening. 

M.Villeneuve then goes on to say that  these "foreign" registered cars must have a French CT, but then further down the letter he says that they can have a CT from their own country provided it meets the requirements of the French CT and the date of the test can be demonstrated. So all in all a confusing letter that begs the question as to what M. Villeneuve means by immatriculation and if he actually knows what he is talking about.  The legislation he quotes is not new, but what he has stated is certainly contrary to both UK law in respect to the export of cars and the French code de la route

 

[pimpernel]

[8-)]And so the fog descends again[8-)]

[woolybanana]

[quote user="Ron Avery"]

[quote user="Tony F Dordogne"]Colin, as with other things in this paper, they got it wrong.[/quote]

Actually Tony they didn't get it wrong as such, this is exactly the information supplied to them by Monsieur  Villeneuve,  Chef du bureau de la législation économique et domaniale et du droit communautaire (DGPA/DAJIL/ED4).   In the letter he states: (my translation)  "The acquisition of a used vehicle requires a change to its registration".

 Then he says: "the acquisition of a new vehicle already registered in the EU does not require a new registration in France".

 

Why there is a difference between the immatriculation of a new car and a used one is not explained, but perhaps what is meant by "immatriculation" in both context needs clarification and that is what is happening. 

M.Villeneuve then goes on to say that  these "foreign" registered cars must have a French CT, but then further down the letter he says that they can have a CT from their own country provided it meets the requirements of the French CT and the date of the test can be demonstrated. So all in all a confusing letter that begs the question as to what M. Villeneuve means by immatriculation and if he actually knows what he is talking about.  The legislation he quotes is not new, but what he has stated is certainly contrary to both UK law in respect to the export of cars and the French code de la route

 

[/quote]

Wild guess here. I think he means that a vehicle acquired outside France but in the EU does not need to be registered AS A NEW vehicle but would be registered as a simple import based on the CT.

[Ron Avery]

Yes WB, that is what is now thought, and makes sense, but its not what the letter says.  AFAIK the correspondent who has a significant grasp of motoring matters took the letter on face value as a change in the law when perhaps a little more checking and clarification should have been sought, but that is now happening and they will publish an update I believe.