Are we prisoners here?

[Alexis]

Could we afford to go back to the UK and still have our standard of living?

Lots of space.  Larger houses.  Bigger gardens.  Further away neighbours.....

I don't think that we would have enough money if we sold up everything to buy a decent place in the UK.

[phandm]

well I would say the answer is yes but we all made the decision to come here, if you want to go back then I suspect we could all find away even if it ment renting I also think age and ambition comes into the decision.

[Jon 1]

There was a detailed article in the Guardian on the 8th August which predicts that the UK housing bubble has been significantly pricked and may be about to burst, see http://money.guardian.co.uk/news_/story/0,1456,1544527,00.html  There are numerous economic and other indicators which tends to support this.  So you may not be as trapped as you think.  Unfortunately, there are numerous other reports which suggest that this may be a global phenomenon and France will not escape.  The foregoing is without the overlay of increasing terrorist activity and the current oil price crisis.  It may be that the future should be renting rather than buying, as any significant house price crash is usually followed by 8 to 10 years of economic stagnation. 

 

[Russethouse]

I've been reading about the UK housing bubble being about to burst ever since this forum started!

In my neck of the woods houses are tending to be priced to sell but no great downward trend, many people seem to be extending or improving rather than moving. I think nationally the trend is a rise of .5%

I do think that at the upper end of the market (I am talking £500,000 plus here) there is a slow down and pricing has to be considerably more realistic.

The Halifax office in our suburb has closed, and one other private estate agent has a notice saying that the office is closed due to unforseen circumstances but whether this is illness or financial problems I couldn't say.

[Teamedup]

When I came here the housing market in this part of France was twice the price of the same housing in my part of the UK. In the mean time it is has swung around and now this house is about half the price it would be in the UK.

IF I wanted the same again I would  be snookered. But I do not. I don't want what I have here anymore. I am quite simply bored. I want a town and all the things that includes I don't want a garden or very little too.

Alexis this post also  sort of implies that that is french life. But even in this village, they build new appts, country side all the way around and people go for literally living on top and side by side with their neighbours.  Look at Calais. You head towards Calais............. nothing and suddenly you are there and a concrete jungle. French people live in appts. A lot of french people live in appts.

Is anyone clever at finding how many french people live in Appts or houses.

[ChezShells]

Depends, those that have been here a few years and missed out on the UK property boom may go back to a different lifestyle.
We moved just as it was levelling out and hope to go back to a buyers market, we missed out on several houses in the UK which prompted us to move to France.

Could we have what we had tho?
Not sure, we could live in the same area same style of house but I suspect our old house has gone up by about 40k but we wouldn't go back to the same area, we are going to try and go to a more desirable area so we might be downsizing in terms of property, depends on mortgage.

Michelle got an offer of work in the UK yesterday and is waiting on a couple more, one seems to be willing to wait until we move back, doubt i'll be that lucky.

[Richard-R]

TU

I think i read it was about 85% of the population.

Being able to afford to return to the U.K. Well for us it would not be an issue, but i think a lot of people will find it hard. They will have sold there U.K. payed of the motrgage, car, credits cards etc. Then purchased with cash in France. A lot of people would be/ have been better of getting a second mortgage and then renting out there U.K. house long term or buying a small place in the U.K. and a small place in France. I know a couple who moved from there house in Croydon ( 3 bed semi) and now have all there cash tied up in a 120h of land and a massive house in need of major restauration. A trap a lot of Brits fall into.

[ChezShells]

I agree, I think we should have looked into buying a 2nd home and renting our 1st one out, my boss suggested that when I handed in my redundancy application, but I wanted out of work, well, a rest from it anyway.

Are we prisoners?
I think some are but choose to be, we make a massive step moving to France and then try too hard making it work almost in denial and then (with me) something clicked and thats it, move back.

I wouldn't put anyone off from doing it tho, its a good experience, and you can't beat the weather.

[Alexis]

A lot of people fall into the trap of buying too big a house and too much land.  Understandably so.

I would want to go back to no mortgage.  I haven't had to pay one for nearly fifteen years now!  Anyway, we are too old to be messing about with loans.

So.  In a way, we are trapped!

[le bouffon]

Trapped no only rats gets trapped,our old house in the UK as increased by 100% in less than 3years(it`s now back on the market)our house in france as increased by more than that!!!!!We have no debt as we we paid cash and so we could move back at any time though would we no way.We would live in a tent before we would have to go back to the UK(or a caravan:cool.

[Hegs]

"These figures are more surprising when the types of properties are taken into account as over four-fifths of British households prefer to live in a house. The report reveals that 82 percent of British families live in a house and only 15 percent live in a flat. This is in stark contrast to families on continental Europe where flats are more popular. In Spain, Italy and Germany more than 50 percent of families live in a flat and France is not far behind with 41 percent. Yet almost bizarrely the average British family home has the least usable living space of the countries surveyed."

Sources quoted by http://www.learnenglish.de/culture/britishhouses.php

Will the UK housing market crash? Of course, along with the Irish, Australian and US markets! Rents are significantly lower than the interest payments on the equivalent capital. This can only mean one thing, the market has become irrational and house pricing only makes sense in terms of expected continued capital appreciation: i.e. the very definition of a bubble, and in monetary terms the biggest bubble in history:

http://www.economist.com/printedition/displayStory.cfm?Story_ID=4079027

The more interesting question here is whether the French market will crash - and there is not such a clearcut answer there.

[Alexis]

The house that we are in at the moment has gone up 10 times since I bought it.  Mostly in the last three years. Before that, prices hardly moved.

Unfortunately, I paid one saucisson and a bottle of muscadet  Well, maybe a bit more but not a lot.

I'm not planning on going back to the UK but you ever know.  I could never fork out half a million though.  Blimey.  Funny money.

When I started work I got 1/11d an hour.  A hundred pounds is a lot of money to me....

I know.  I should get with it.

[le bouffon]

At least you will get your pension very very soon.1shilling is what in todays money 5p,11d is nearly 5p two bob an hour,can I borrow your bus pass.

[Alexis]

That is the trouble bouffon, I don't get my bus pass soon.  I started work at 12...I was big for my age...but it was just in the summer. 

I've got another ten bloody years to go yet.  The swines increased it to make it equal to men...mutter, mutter mutter.

[Mpprh]

Hi

about 15 years ago someone said to me "if you live abroad for more than 12 months, or marry a foreigner, you become a stateless person".

He had been abroad for 20+ years, had never worked in his home country, and was married to a foreigner.

Happily, he is now back in his own country, and very happy !

Worth thinking about ?

 

Peter

 

 

[letrangere]

"our old house in the UK as increased by 100% in less than 3years"

My goodness, don't wish to appear nosey but where is it located?  Perhaps in area that hadn't seen the previous massive increases and is catching up?  (Scotland?) That said, you can only judge the true value of a property after it's been sold and from what I hear in London, few sellers are getting their asking prices.

Alexis makes an interesting point and one that is echoed increasingly by immobiliers in France.  Why do so many Brits insist on a huge great house with hectares of land?  Unless you're planning on opening a B&B or intend to run a free holding, do you really and honestly need so much?  I know comparisons with what the same money will buy you in Britain can make them appear so tempting.  But unless you are young and/or loaded with cash, surely both house and land can quickly become a millstone round your neck? 

M

[Alexis]

It is that little red devil sat on your shoulder whispering in your ear "Buy it.  Buy it!"

[le bouffon]

MWJ,`up north but not as far up as scotland if I can find the link will post a pic,crazy prices.......

[letrangere]

It is that little red devil sat on your shoulder whispering in your ear "Buy it.  Buy it!"

You're so right, Alexis, we all hear him.  But fortunately on the one occasion when he were confronted with sheer and utter temptation in the form of a beautiful manoir and way too many hectares, his pleas were drowned out by the voice of common sense shouting in my other ear, "who's gonna cut all that bloody grass and how much will it cost when we one day have to repair that huge expanse of roof?".  I also dread to think how much it would cost to heat, once we'd got round to replacing and double glazing all the windows!  M

[Debra]

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[Debra]

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[Alexis]

Then there are the tenants who won't pay the rent....

Tell me about it.

[Debra]

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[letrangere]

If you do your homework before you buy, employ a letting agent and take out the necessary insurances, letting in the UK isn't quite as dreadful as people sometimes fear. You have to have a property for which there's a big demand locally in the rental market.  Agents will tell you what goes and what doesn't, they'll also tell you what they have too many of!  They take a hefty percentage of the rental fee (and charge for other misc bill handling) but a good letting agent is invaluable, especially if you're abroad, as they can arrange maintenance, redecorating, debt collection, evictions, anything in fact.  There's a whole host of different types of insurance policies that you can take out to cover you for non-payment of income, having to evict people, etc. they're usually priced as a percentage of your monthly rental charge.

Going this route, even though you may not receive quite as much money by way of income at the end of each month - and months in which you have to pay for annual gas checks, the tenant's inability to re-light the boiler or other bits of maintenance you may not receive any income AT ALL - you do at least still retain a foot on the UK housing ladder and during better times, benefit from property appreciation.

We have a place in the UK that we've been renting out for 20 years and I don't think it's been empty for more than 8 weeks in all that time. 

I must look in on LF and read this thread.  We had a very heated debate here some years back on the subject of retaining a foothold in the UK.  I argued then that it made a lot of sense if people could afford it.  Even when the market's slow, property in the UK is still a fantastic long term investment.  However, a lot of people at the time of the thread (2002?) reckoned that keeping  house in the UK implied a, "lack of commitment to moving to France", which I personally thought was bunkum.  Times change I guess.

M

[andyh4]

Back to the original question are we trapped?

Well in my case yes - have been all my life - still cannot afford the luxury mansion on the secluded pacific island with private airstrip and jet.

 

trapped in this sense is a state of mond, and if people truely think they are trapped because they cannot afford to get back to the UK, then it suggests that they have a need (psychological at least) to feel they can return as a bolt hole.   These are probably the people (with hind sight) who should have retained some physical link in the UK to bolster their psychological need.

 

Personally - I couldn't afford to return to the UK at today's prices, but I don't feel trapped because I have no desire/need to return.  Indeed each time I have gone back for visits to friends and family I have felt more and more disappointed in the general state of things.  That's not to say there are not some things that I miss, but it does not make me feel trapped.