Ferrari and Porsche confiscated

[Georgina]

I was in disbelief today when I read that two Brits had their cars confiscated in France (I think it said they were estate agents) and sent to prison for three months for speeds of around 200km and above on French roads.  Apparently they were on their way to Rimini (Italy).  I don't know which was more shocking, the speeds or the confiscation of these cars, -  that's an expensive lesson - ?.. It was only a small piece in the local but anyone know any more?

Georgina

[Suze01]

They got a three month suspended sentence.  The Brit police couldn't catch them that side of the channel and alerted the French police.  They were on a race,  à la Jeremy Clarkson, from the UK to Italy.

I don't understand why you were in 'disbelief', their speeds were a danger to themselves and other road users. 

There was a story about it on TF1 online news page: http://tf1.lci.fr/infos/france/0,,3315720,00.html and the update was here: http://tf1.lci.fr/infos/france/0,,3316018,00.html

[Georgina]

[quote user="Suze"]They got a three month suspended sentence.  The Brit police couldn't catch them that side of the channel and alerted the French police.  They were on a race,  à la Jeremy Clarkson, from the UK to Italy.

I don't understand why you were in 'disbelief', their speeds were a danger to themselves and other road users. 

There was a story about it on TF1 online news page: http://tf1.lci.fr/infos/france/0,,3315720,00.html
[/quote]

You misread me, exactly.... disbelief at the zero tolerance, there should be some of it in Britain.

Georgina

[Alcazar]

Here we go again. Sigh.

There IS zero tolerance in the UK, but only for offences like speeding and parking illegally...........you know, offences that REALLY hurt people! Every time anyone does it! Let's not hear anyone say, "who has it hurt?" It COULD, so we MUST punish them! Oh, and the fines are a nice revenue earner too[;-)]

Unfortunately, the tolerance levels for rape, mugging, assault, even murder, are much higher. But then, they hurt people every time REALLY.

Priorities? 'Nuff said.

Alcazar

[Georgina]

[quote user="Alcazar"]

Here we go again. Sigh.

There IS zero tolerance in the UK, but only for offences like speeding and parking illegally...........you know, offences that REALLY hurt people! Every time anyone does it! Let's not hear anyone say, "who has it hurt?" It COULD, so we MUST punish them! Oh, and the fines are a nice revenue earner too[;-)]

Unfortunately, the tolerance levels for rape, mugging, assault, even murder, are much higher. But then, they hurt people every time REALLY.

Priorities? 'Nuff said.

Alcazar

[/quote]

Yes, rape mugging and assault crimes are not dealt with severely enough in the UK. But also, killing people with your car is quite serious. The point I was trying to make was that in the UK, even if they had killed someone doing that speed, they would not have been dealt with quite as severely.

Georgina

[vmax]

I can see another speeding debate coming on, as a biker I know the temptation to speed is ever present so I thought this link might help in demonstrating the correct procedure for making progress in a built up area

http://www.moto-depot.co.il/club/video/uponone_city_madness.wmv

[Tony F Dordogne]

Alcazar is using the favourite smoke screen for people trying to justify their behaviour - they (the rapists etc) should be dealt with more seriously therefore leaving what's left in the punishment 'pot' to be spread more thinly among those that drive at high speeds etc.  And the hurting thing is just the usual Alcazar mantra because he wants to break the law when it suits him or when he wants to get on his 'revenue raising' hobby horse, can't see that it applies here at all.

If the law was applied consistantly, it wouldn't be an argument and its not the UK law that applies here.  Do the crime in France and face the French consequences.  Get caught racing on the roads, instant disqualification and cars impounded, easy really.  Get caught driving over the limit and your licence is pulled immediately for three months and you have to face a 'convocation' with clean urine and blood samples to get it back while you wait for a court date and that can depend on the severity of the crime so you still not get it back though you are 'clean'.

Like it or not, the French system charges people with offences up front and then knocks them off if the case can't be made, doesn't wait weeks or months to bring charges which are usually ameloriated because of the burden of proof, like death by dangerous driving being downgraded.  And here, involuntary homicide (manslaughter) charges can be brought because of the circumstances (speed, tyre condition, vehicle loading) of the driving, it doesn't have to be the WAY in which the driver drove - if he/she has an accident - that determine the charges.

If one of the morons driving these high performance cars had hit and killed somebody they BOTH would have faced up to 10 years inside for involuntary homicide - down to them Alcazar and the fact they didn't is immaterial really but that they chose to race through France - not park in London on double yellow lines - is material and is down to them also.

Don't want the time, don't do the crime - today people want the law enforced and on the motorways in France it seems that the Gendarmes are trying to do it - can't argue with their application or UK/French co-operation in this instance. 

 

[Iceni]

[quote user="Alcazar"]

There IS zero tolerance in the UK, but only for offences like speeding and parking illegally...........you know, offences that REALLY hurt people! Every time anyone does it! Let's not hear anyone say, "who has it hurt?" It COULD, so we MUST punish them! Oh, and the fines are a nice revenue earner too[;-)]

Alcazar

[/quote]

And luckily those who speed and park illegally are so stupid that they keep getting caught.

In a perfect world there would be zero tolerance of all crimes all the time but for that we need govts who DO rather than TALK. A bit like hen's teeth ?

John

not

[Christine Animal]

The cars mentioned above are made to go at very high speeds.  Whey are they sold if their owners get "caught" using them ?

 

[Val_2]

I'm afraid I have to own up to gesticulating in anger at a young woman driving a souped up new Mini on the dual carriageway yesterday coming back from Brest and using her phone clamped to her ear at the same time as overtaking many HGV's at a speed of over 110kms, how can you concentrate on two things at once and the result of any errors is terrifying for all those around - sorry to go off topic but I was so angry to see this blatant ignorance of the law on using mobile phones that are not hands free.

[Iceni]

[quote user="Christine Animal"]

The cars mentioned above are made to go at very high speeds.  Whey are they sold if their owners get "caught" using them ?

 

[/quote]

All vehicles (except possibly sans permis) are capable of breaking a speed limit of 20 mph/30 kph so ban the sale of all ? Pls remember that the speed of a vehicle is controlled (sic) by the nut holding the steering wheel.

John

not

[Alcazar]

[quote user="Tony F Dordogne"]

Alcazar is using the favourite smoke screen for people trying to justify their behaviour - they (the rapists etc) should be dealt with more seriously therefore leaving what's left in the punishment 'pot' to be spread more thinly among those that drive at high speeds etc.  And the hurting thing is just the usual Alcazar mantra because he wants to break the law when it suits him or when he wants to get on his 'revenue raising' hobby horse, can't see that it applies here at all.

[/quote]

Where did I say I wanted motorists dealt with less severely? What I'd LIKE is parity. What we HAVE, like it or not Tony, is revenue earning.

I've also said this so many times I sometimes wonder if others read my posts at all: "I DO NOT CONDONE SPEEDING, NOR DO I WISH TO DO IT MYSELF!! There, is THAT clear enough for you?

How can you condone a system that fines people heavily, and possibly removes their license, for doing something that MIGHT hurt someone, while those who DELIBERATELY hurt others, and sometimes on a regular basis, are just told: "don't do it again please".

As I said, PRIORITIES!

Alcazar

[Deimos]

[quote user="Christine Animal"]

The cars mentioned above are made to go at very high speeds.  Whey are they sold if their owners get "caught" using them ?

 

[/quote]

A few years ago I fell into the trap of "flashy cars" and got (or rather got my company to get me) a Lotus Elise 111S.

The fun in it was not the speeds above 70mph but the handling at lower speeds. Whilst I only did it occasionally, every now and again you come across an empty roundabout with good visibility and then "gave it some stick". Whilst there is always an increased risk driving closer to the limits, I have to say that if the car is designed for it and you are aware of the signs of "reaching the limit" the risk is lower.

Before I actually collected the car I actually went on a course at Lotus showing me how to drive it - which was fantastic fun and very interesting. I am convinced I was much safer in the car having done the course as I was far more aware of its limits and more importantly, the signs the car gave as one got close to the limits (plus how to react and how not to react). For example, they get you driving round and round a roundabout going faster and faster. You get to the point where you can only just hold the car on the roundabout and the instructor is telling you to go faster and faster. Then you realise you cannot hold it so your instinctive reaction is to take your foot off the accelerator - and next thing you know is you are pointing in a random direction with the engine stalled (having spun round a few times). Once you've done that a few times and get to appreciate what you should do detected the signs, practiced the right way to get out of it, etc. I felt I was much safer when "pushing it".

Ian

[Rob Roy]

Maybe it is time to review some of what is shown on Top Gear? [Www]

[Christine Animal]

I know exactly what you mean Ian, it all depends who is behind the wheel.  My father used to race (just in club meetings).  We felt so safe with him on the road, he had fast cars, but also knew how to handle them.  He never took his eyes off the road.  My mother used to be saying "look at this and look at that", going along, but he never turned away from the road.

Someone in a Porsche at 200 kmh can be far safer than someone else in a "noddy car" at 70 kmh, but that's another debate... [:)]

 

[Georgina]

Alcazar said: Where did I say I wanted motorists dealt with less severely? What I'd LIKE is parity. What we HAVE, like it or not Tony, is revenue earning.

Yes in the UK they do seem to give rapists robbers and muggers lighter sentences than those who have driving offences but that's down to the law, - you can mitigate but you can't get away with it, whereas when you rob someone, some kind persons rights a report on how badly you had been treated as a child and hey presto, you get off.   But if the police do stop people speeding whilst quote"not concentrating on the real criminals "unquote, chances are they catch loads of criminals this way.....so I believe the ends justify the means, don't you think. I mean didn't they catch the Ripper on a traffic check?

 I for one, do not mind being stopped and checked.  Having said that I have been driving for over 25 years now and never had a speeding ticket.  But then I do smile nicely.

Georgina 

[saddie]

In France it is not just excessive speed which can get you in trouble. You can have your car confiscated for doing 70k in a school area clearly marked as 50k. This was illustrated in an episode of a TV series 'pere et frere' I think.

[Cassis]

[quote user="Christine Animal"]

Someone in a Porsche at 200 kmh can be far safer than someone else in a "noddy car" at 70 kmh, but that's another debate... [:)]

 [/quote]

And exactly whom do you have in mind?

[IMG]http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i26/cassiscassis/sausage5.jpg[/IMG]

I would say that 70k in a school area marked 50k is excessive speed, Saddie.

[Christine Animal]

Any old cronk in a wheelbarrow who suddenly turns left in front of you without a signal when you are about to overtake him at 200 kph !

Dear old Cassis   [:P]         

 

[Georgina]

Actually now that we digress, why do old ladies drive completely around the roundabout in the right hand lane, and is it legal to actually stop on a roundabout as I have seen several times, when someone does not know where to go?

By the way did you know Noddy was Oui Oui in France.  A bit confusing for the lads when we first came.[:)]

Georgina

[Christine Animal]

The best way is to avoid the roundabouts altogether and have a flyover...

                                                                       

We are busy right now preparing my brouette for my retirement next year...   [geek]

      

 

 

[KathyC]

[quote user="saddie"]In France it is not just excessive speed which can get you in trouble. You can have your car confiscated for doing 70k in a school area clearly marked as 50k. This was illustrated in an episode of a TV series 'pere et frere' I think.[/quote]

Doing nearly 50% over the speed limit seems pretty excessive to me and worst for being in a school area.

[opas]

Whether it be a burgler, a Rapist , a speeding car or a litter lout(yes they do exist)  a broken law or bylaw should be paid for , if it means a £20 fine, 30 years in the slammer or the offending car crushed!

[Alcazar]

[quote user="Opas"]Whether it be a burgler, a Rapist , a speeding car or a litter lout(yes they do exist)  a broken law or bylaw should be paid for , if it means a £20 fine, 30 years in the slammer or the offending car crushed![/quote]

Agreed..................if ONLY all were treated the same.

In FACT the mororist would be imprisoned, the rapist let off on a technicality, or because some fancy lawyer labelled the poor lass he raped as a slag, and the litter lout fined £30, which he never pays, since he hasn't a barcode/numberplate on his head, so who the fek knows who he is?

Parity? I think not, Priorities? NOT A CHANCE!  Revenue, Yep, bring it on!

Alcazar

[The Riff-Raff Element]

[quote user="Alcazar"]

Parity? I think not, Priorities? NOT A CHANCE!  Revenue, Yep, bring it on!

Alcazar

[/quote]

This, surely,  is absolute rot? If the exercise were simply about

revenue then why bother dedeucting points until a point is reached were

the licence is suspended? It would be far more sensible to allow

persistent speeders to stay on the road, thereby providing a consistant

revenue stream (not a bad wheeze - it paid the wages of several

thousand Eastern European police officers for some years after the end

of the Cold War). The more one were prepared to pay, the more one could

"drive as conditions & ability dictate." Maybe discounts could be

offered for advance payment or direct debit...