TWINKLE Posted March 19, 2008 Share Posted March 19, 2008 Well that is what my life is like but without the marmite[:D] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Just Katie Posted March 19, 2008 Share Posted March 19, 2008 OMG Twinks, you make me laugh. There you go, that is what you get for marrying a French man. Breakfast, dishes, lunch, dishes, dinner, dishes, supper dishes. Chuck him a croissant and tell him to stand by the sink and eat it.[:D]I can see him now being on the receiving end of that, throwing his hands in the air and blowing raspberries in his latin way. It is little wonder the British dont want to integrate, they probably get bored talking about food all the time.[:D] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Christine Animal Posted March 19, 2008 Share Posted March 19, 2008 So those who don't want to integrate, don't integrate, those who do, do integrate. Those who are married to French people just integrate gracefully and soon learn how to eat a croissant correctly. As long as we all do our thing and are happy with it, so what !I couldn't be in your group Twinkle, I can't sing ! [:D] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sprogster Posted March 19, 2008 Share Posted March 19, 2008 Part of the problem is perception, in that when you are in France and you listen to a British family not bother with the French language in a shop, you do not know if they are second home owners, holidaymakers or permanent residents.The vast majority of British owners of property in France are second home owners and if you are only spending a few weeks a year in France, it is next to impossible to become fluent in the French language, as you just do not get the practice. Especially, as you get older.In the threads on the changes to French health rules, I was very surprised at the comparatively low number of E106 and E121 holders resident in France, compared to the estimates as to the numbers of Brits that own houses there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Christine Animal Posted March 19, 2008 Share Posted March 19, 2008 That's probably true. In the Summer in the supermakets there are no end of English voices about, but there don't seem to be very many in the Winter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TWINKLE Posted March 19, 2008 Share Posted March 19, 2008 [quote user="Sprogster"] low number of E106 and E121 holders resident in France, [/quote]Oh no - please don't mention the E numbers[:)] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pads Posted March 20, 2008 Share Posted March 20, 2008 Im afraid I must agree a little with katie here......! Where as I want to learn the language as I want more than just to go to the supper market once a week, I will still be in the garden early in the morning eating my marmite on toast and mug of coffee in hand while I look to see whats happening in my garden. I even walk to the lake with mug of coffee and toast in hand for a peacful 5 mins , much to the amusment of the neighbours [:$]But I do get fed up of meetig people who pretend they are so french and know everything when they cant even speak the language and still have the mentality to think shouting helps [:-))] they are normally in the do -it-all shops !![:D] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Patf Posted March 20, 2008 Share Posted March 20, 2008 What amazes me is the number of british people who have been here, full time, for ages, 15 to 20 years sometimes, and still hardly speak a word of french. How have they managed? They must exist in a bubble detached from reality. To be fair though, it's usually one member of a couple, the other speaks a bit of french. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mint Posted March 20, 2008 Share Posted March 20, 2008 I think it's fair enough that people integrate (because they want to or are able to, such as learning the language) as much or as little as they choose.What annoyed me about the article, which Clair pointed out, is the patronising and sneering way in which that idiot talks about other Brits in France.There are some people (and I know a few of them) who just don't want to learn the language and don't want to try. Fortunately, they are in the minority.As far as I'm concerned, it is they who are losing out. Here we are in a beautiful country with all that wonderful opportunity to tap into an exciting and utterly fascinating culture, so we would be fools not to make use of such a grand chance.I only wish I knew more French to be able to read some of the great French classics in their original language. Luckily for me, I am a great classical music fan and I have such a choice........Gounod, Bizet, Debussy, Berlioz..........OH and I sat down the other day to see how many French composers we could name (without resort to Google) and we came up with just under 30.I am enjoying life like never before and I find all the challenges here a huge learning curve (including how not to get ripped off by the piano tuner next time!) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cooperlola Posted March 20, 2008 Share Posted March 20, 2008 [quote user="TWINKLE"][quote user="Sprogster"] low number of E106 and E121 holders resident in France, [/quote]Oh no - please don't mention the E numbers[:)][/quote]Seconded. [:-))]What amazes me is how the writer says he's never met any Brits, even though there are loads about. At every gathering we go to, the first thing anybody says to one is "do you know the Anglais who live in...? Must introduce you." Or, "so and so's daughter/son in law is English, you must talk to them..." Thus, even if I had been determined not to meet any other Brits, it would have been pretty difficult not to!As it is, yes, I know a small group of Brits whose social life is totally limited to the half a dozen or so others who live within a 20k radius, and I'm quite happy to spend an evening with them, but they are not my whole life. Equally, I think I'd miss them if I decided (for what is a particularly spurious reason, imo) that I'd turn my back on all the people who were born in the same country as me. Deciding on whom I'm going to be friendly with, based simply upon where they come from seems bonkers to me. I meet Brits, I meet French - whether they become my friends depends purely upon whether I like them or not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Weedon Posted March 20, 2008 Share Posted March 20, 2008 When we, as a family, moved into our small village many years ago, we didn't have much time to join any of the local clubs. Some of them might have appealed but we got used to doing things as a family. Perhaps this had the effect of insulating us from much of what went on in the village but over the years we got to know most of the villagers just from normal everyday contact. Some of them we got to know reasonably well, others not so well, some of them I didn't care for and I dare say they thought the same about me. I went to the amateur dramatic society's anuual attempt once, then decided I would go to a proper theatre if I ever wanted a good night out. Many villagers enjoyed attending the jumble sales, dancing clubs and all of the other stuff that the more "enthusiastic" people in the village organised but I guess some villagers never attended any of them. Anyway, after 30 years we moved away from that village in Sussex to come to France. After 7 years, life has pretty much been the same here. I can't speak much French, and sorry to have to tell you, I most probably won't learn an awful lot more but I know the neighbours well enough despite that. The Lotto night, country dancing and the anuual twinning culture week just do not do it for me so I give them all a miss...anyway it's a village from Germany[:-))] I just don't understand why anybody feels it neccesary to pass judgement onto others who just want to lead a more simple life. Throw yourself into everything that's going if you want, just don't give me a thrashing for having the temerity not to want to join in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chessfou Posted March 20, 2008 Share Posted March 20, 2008 [quote]Oh no - please don't mention the E numbers[/quote]You're right:E106 Riboflavin-5-Sodium PhosphateE121 Orcein, OrchilE129 Allura Red AC - yeuch; plenty of French (as well as English) processed foods to avoid containing these little horrors (and lots more besides).[:)] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Val_2 Posted March 20, 2008 Share Posted March 20, 2008 When we came here to this community and even now, if you do not speak or try to speak french then that is tough, no one will go out of their way to speak english unless you are really in deep trouble and then it is limited to what they can actually say and because of this,we have really gone out of our way to learn the language so we can communicate and get on with our lives which is the best thing that could have happened. Those brits who stay in their own little bubble deserve all they get if they cannot be bothered to at least learn some of this beautiful language which is frustrating at times and no one can say they are completely fluent but its part of the living in France experience. If you want to speak english,eat english foods,have english entertainment,pubs,restos,cinemas etc then go to Spain and you will be right at home. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chancer Posted March 20, 2008 Share Posted March 20, 2008 I didnt see anything patronising in the article.FWIW I agree with most of what he had to say, did he touch a few nerves? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Will Posted March 20, 2008 Share Posted March 20, 2008 The patronising bit, in my opinion, was the inference that unless you do as the writer did, and go to local events and drink at the local bar, you are in some way inferior - a 'bad' kind of British person in France. Although the article was taking the rise out of the Eymet brigade it can apply equally to a lot of places in Brittany and Normandy, and probably other parts of France too.Some people may do those 'local' things and feel that makes them better. Others prefer not to. The important think, as far as I am concerned is to be yourself. That doesn't have to mean pretending to be French. When in England I never go to bingo at the church hall behind our house, and don't go to the pub down the road very often. So why should I do the equivalent in France? If that means we are 'not properly integrated' then I'm quite happy with that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mint Posted March 20, 2008 Share Posted March 20, 2008 Well said, Will, you are the voice of reason indeed. I don't understand pop music and I don't like barbeques, so I don't go to local events featuring these.The OH loves table tennis and so he plays in our local club. We both love our French lessons and we do go to those.I profoundly disagreed with practically everything that the journalist wrote and, as I was feeling very ill with flu yesterday, I must admit I completely lost my sense of humour and was practically foaming in the mouth and sneering with scorn (can you do both those things at the same time?) by the time I was a few lines into the article! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob T Posted March 20, 2008 Share Posted March 20, 2008 Everyone to their own. If the writer of this article sees things that way then who are we to correct him. He will never meet me if he is looking for other Brits in the bar as I don't go to bars in the evening, never did it in the UK so why should I here? I have been here for just over 3 years and made an effort to learn the language, but I would never expect to be treated as anything other than a British immigrant. I am accepted in our local town, which has around 5 Brit families, and most of the locals are fantastic people. The only one person who I have found that I don't get on with is another expat and that is only because he is a Walter Mitty character.The people in the local shops seem to be happy that I manage to speak a little more every week, and are willing to help me learn a few more words whenever they can. I do think of this place as my home now and have no ties with the UK anymore. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Will Posted March 20, 2008 Share Posted March 20, 2008 Quite right Bob, I'm really pleased that you are happy to be a British immigrant in France - that's exactly how I regard myself, I'm proud to be that, and I don't think the French people have any problem with that. You regard France as home - I still have strong ties with the part of England where my roots are, and it will always be that way for me, so that's where we differ. But everybody is different, and, as you say, if the writer of the article is happy to live as he/she does, then that's great too.Thanks too to Sweet 17, I'm not sure that certain other forums would use the 'voice of reason' but thanks anyway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frenchie Posted March 21, 2008 Share Posted March 21, 2008 Having a croissantwhile standing up is sooooo shocking !! [:D]As many of you said, what matters is happiness, and trying to communicate at least just a little to be able to say bonjour and a few words to your French neighbours, as well as being able to cope with some issues.I know a person in the Dordogne who can't speak a word of French after 8 years in that lovely departement, and without judging him, I wondered how he would manage if he had to be taken to hospital for instance, .. How could he explain what he feels , understand what the doctors would say about the treatment , etc..Each time he has a problem he calls me, and I call the bank, the garage, etc.. I tried to tell him " OK, let me help you with this, and teach you a few basic things" but he doesn't seem to be bothered...............He's a really nice person though.. Just living in a bubble , 70% of the houses in the village are owned by British families.............. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Framboise Posted March 21, 2008 Share Posted March 21, 2008 Frenchie, he is never going to bother all the time you do everything for him! Frankly I see it as a great insult to the host country to not even attempt the language after eight years, indeed it always infuriated me back in UK to be told that "So-and-so can't speak any English after twenty years of living here!!". My French might be absolute rubbish but at least I try, because I have found that people are more receptive if you make an effort and actually its amazing just how many can converse in Anglais quite well IF they choose to do so. However, if this person lives in a Brit enclave as you say then he can survive in this sheltered environment without bothering to learn the lingo, but for us we live in a tiny hamlet in the middle of nowhere and are the only Brits in a 5k radius. Being vain enough to pretend we don't need to learn French was not a viable option for us. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cooperlola Posted March 21, 2008 Share Posted March 21, 2008 Frenchie and Framboise, you are right. I have friends here (I knew them in the UK - I did not actively seek out British friends but if I meet Brits I like, that is what they become) who do not speak much French. He is diabetic and so has to visit the doc' every couple of months and I go with him. Fine - we have known them for over 30 years and so I'm prepared to do it for them. I am constantly offering him and his o/h a bit of basic lingo teaching (I'm no professional, but I can give them enough hints to get by) but they just are not interested. I say time and again that I'm often not here, and if he had a problem, they would be seriously stuffed - the gp doesn't speak English and nor do most of the staff at the local hospitals as this really is not a great immigrant area so why would they? They seem to bumble along hoping that nothing bad will ever happen but life just is not like that. I have no problem with their not "joining in" with things they don't care for - they prefer to mix with the small number of other Brits around here and good for them - it's their life - their retirement - and their choice. But from a self-preservation point of view if nothing else, to my mind a basic grasp of the language is a must.I'm full of admiration for people who are prepared to move here with no French language skills and who cope. But to steadfastly avoid learning seems potentially suicidal to me! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Christine Animal Posted March 21, 2008 Share Posted March 21, 2008 [quote user="Frenchie"]Having a croissant while standing up is sooooo shocking !! [:D][/quote] I could never quite "integrate" the thing of a bol à café, going and getting nice fresh crisp croissants at the boulangerie and then dunking them in the bol, making them all soggy ! [:'(] [:D] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clair Posted March 21, 2008 Author Share Posted March 21, 2008 I know that I had become more British in my morning habits...A French person usually has breakfast before getting washed and dressed, but my routine is to wash and get dressed then have breakfast...Does that make me dis-integrated?[8-)] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Christine Animal Posted March 21, 2008 Share Posted March 21, 2008 Maybe ! [:P] Coffee first ! But then the English get washed and dressed for anything don't they !? [:P]Now I'm running to hide out in the rain with the dogs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
5-element Posted March 21, 2008 Share Posted March 21, 2008 [quote user="Clair"]I know that I had become more British in my morning habits...A French person usually has breakfast before getting washed and dressed, but my routine is to wash and get dressed then have breakfast...Does that make me dis-integrated?[8-)][/quote][:D]I do the French person thing, Clair, but then, I have a cup of tea and toast, never coffee or croissants. Does that make me mixed-up? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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