Martin963 Posted January 29, 2011 Share Posted January 29, 2011 Well I was hoping to kick off a "rip-off Britain" debate, and thanks to your link sid I can in fact see that we ARE bieng ripped offSep 2010 France €0.74 Britain approx 47 pJan 2011 France €0.85 Britain approx 72 pBritain up 53% (just on my rough figures, it's widely reported as 70%)France up 14%I've always insisted that we have more than one source of heating (much to the chagrin of a Calor Gas Installer who wanted to remove our "nasty dirty back boiler". He later admitted that he'd done the same at home, ie linked the two heating systems. So when Calor up'd the price in 1990 during the Gulf conflict we just told them to take away the tank. The price promptly came down again! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woolybanana Posted January 29, 2011 Author Share Posted January 29, 2011 The problem in UK is that the same company now controls over 50% of the delivery market through shell companies that have kept their original names, and so there is no competition and they can charge what they like. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Simon Posted January 30, 2011 Share Posted January 30, 2011 [quote user="Martin963"]Well I was hoping to kick off a "rip-off Britain" debate, and thanks to your link sid I can in fact see that we ARE bieng ripped offSep 2010 France €0.74 Britain approx 47 pJan 2011 France €0.85 Britain approx 72 pBritain up 53% (just on my rough figures, it's widely reported as 70%)France up 14%I've always insisted that we have more than one source of heating (much to the chagrin of a Calor Gas Installer who wanted to remove our "nasty dirty back boiler". He later admitted that he'd done the same at home, ie linked the two heating systems. So when Calor up'd the price in 1990 during the Gulf conflict we just told them to take away the tank. The price promptly came down again![/quote] Of course, the other way to read your figures is that in Sept 2010 people in France were paying well over the odds compared to the UK, and despite the huge increase in UK prices, it's still cheaper than France. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Martin963 Posted January 30, 2011 Share Posted January 30, 2011 I suppose that's possible, but with inflation running at nearly 4% in Britain (even on the CPI measure) and only 1.75% in France I tend to suspect that it's Britain with the rising price problem...... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AnOther Posted January 31, 2011 Share Posted January 31, 2011 Your calculations are too simplistic to be meaningful as they completely ignore the fact that oil is priced in USD.Back to the calculator methinks [;-)] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quillan Posted January 31, 2011 Share Posted January 31, 2011 Yes but 5 middle east countries accept Euros as well as Dollars for their oil. The price may well be set in Dollars by OPEC but if you are in the Euro Zone you have to convert too Dollars or alternatively, if you are buying from one of the five, they take payment in Euros and convert to Dollars (if that's what they want, they may leave it in Euros or exchange directly in to their local currency). With exchange rates as they are this works well for Euro countries but not so well for the UK. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Martin963 Posted February 1, 2011 Share Posted February 1, 2011 [quote user="AnOther"]Your calculations are too simplistic to be meaningful as they completely ignore the fact that oil is priced in USD.Back to the calculator methinks [;-)][/quote]I wasn't aware that the $ had moved much either against the £ or the € in the last few months Ernie. Certainly not enough to cause a 70% increase in price of heating oil (but not automotive fuels).Whilst life in Britain may be irrelevant to you I don't think you've hit on the explanation either Ernie! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crossy67 Posted February 1, 2011 Share Posted February 1, 2011 I have done some very rudimentary and probably totally inaccurate calculations and when a litre of oil reached the same price as 10kw/h of electricity the prices will be somewhere near the same. That's assuming 1ltr of oil yields 34478BTU's, 1kw electricity yields 3412BTU's and the efficiency is the same for both fuels. However, if you are using an inverter AC unit that claims 4-1 efficiency (4kw's heat for 1kw electricity) then oil is over three times more expensive. I might be miles out only done a bit of internet and Wikki reaserch.[8-)] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Martin963 Posted February 1, 2011 Share Posted February 1, 2011 Interesting. With electricity in Britain at (very roughly) 13 p (kWh -1) oil works out at roughly "half the price" still.However, our thoughts (at least) are that one can save a shed load of money by not using the oil boiler, because it's relatively difficult to "zone". Very roughly I think it burns about 3 - 4 litres per hour (by which I mean if it's running the heating for an hour, (with its switching on and off as controlled by the circulating water thermostat), not that it's continuously burning for an hour); so very roughly it's costing £2.30 - £3 per hour's heating. And the whole house is warm.However, by huddling round our coal fire (in a back boiler system) which also adequately warms 5 rads upstairs and heats the main living room, and judicious use of electric storage heaters and peak rate electric "fillers", we can keep the cost well below £3 per hour, and the coal fire is on all day and night, which the oil heating wouldn't be (at least not economically).Your calculation for off peak is also interesting, as off peak electricity here is about 5 p (kWh -1) and if the ratio is 10 then oil is more expensive. Maybe time to buy another storage heater.Very interesting calcs for which I am grateful; I'm sure some of you in France permanently feel pretty smug about your lack of oil price increases, but it's hit very very hard here; bad enough for us but for many country folk (and coupled with ever rising prices such as petrol) it's often making them think seriously they'll have to sell up as living in the rural areas is just getting too dear. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crossy67 Posted February 1, 2011 Share Posted February 1, 2011 Well bu66er me. I have just checked the electricity bill in work and it is indeed 12.26p/unit. This means you would need to spend roughly £1.23 on electricity to get the same amount of heat you could get from £0.80's worth of diesel. If you use inverter heaters this drops to £0.32, well worth investing in. This doesn't take into account off peek lower tariffs. What are the off peek hours in France, how many do you get and when do they start and finish?Does any one make an inverter heater that could be used to heat water, this could be stored in a thermal storage tank. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Martin963 Posted February 1, 2011 Share Posted February 1, 2011 From our latest EDF billHP (normal tariff) €0.0901 per kWh (ie 9.01 cents)HC (cheap tariff) €0.0557 per kWh (ie 5.57 cents) As has often been stated (including by me) consumption of the actual electricity itself is cheaper in France, but the overall cost goes up as there are other charges added on, and the monthly standing charge is much higher than in Britain (€12.58 per month in our case).Cheap rate for us is from 22.30 - 06.30 (ie overnight!) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crossy67 Posted February 1, 2011 Share Posted February 1, 2011 Great stuff. Thanks for the info Martin, it will help me to plan my warming in the future when we move out.[:)] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Martin963 Posted February 1, 2011 Share Posted February 1, 2011 The way things are going my recommendation would be to buy somewhere with plenty of trees suitably for firewood. When the balloon goes up (or preferably a bit before!) we'd try and get over to France as our place has more wood than we know what to do with, so at least we'd be warm.....With what's going on at the moment in the Middle East I think the "balloon" has floated a bit closer....... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jay Posted February 1, 2011 Share Posted February 1, 2011 [quote user="Martin963"]From our latest EDF billHP (normal tariff) €0.0901 per kWh (ie 9.01 cents)HC (cheap tariff) €0.0557 per kWh (ie 5.57 cents) As has often been stated (including by me) consumption of the actual electricity itself is cheaper in France, but the overall cost goes up as there are other charges added on, and the monthly standing charge is much higher than in Britain (€12.58 per month in our case).Cheap rate for us is from 22.30 - 06.30 (ie overnight!)[/quote]Ours (EDF) is exactly the same price per kWh but our monthly charge is 6.36€ and cheap rate is 12.00 - 14.00 and 01.00 - 07.00 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quillan Posted February 1, 2011 Share Posted February 1, 2011 You can use this http://bleuciel.edf.com/abonnement-et-contrat/les-prix/les-prix-de-l-electricite/tarif-bleu-47798.html to see the charges for electricity with EDFDon't forget the taxing system on electricity was amended as of 1st Jan, you can view the changes using the link below.http://www.edf.com/html/taxes2010/index.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joe Posted February 11, 2011 Share Posted February 11, 2011 Just been quoted 0.86 a litre up from 0.60 last November.Had fuel delivered today @ 0.70 cents a litre. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Martin963 Posted February 11, 2011 Share Posted February 11, 2011 Just had a look at an on-line quote here in Britain and miraculously the price has come down from 75 p per litre a few weeks ago to 51 p per litre.Of course, that can have absolutely nothing to do with the OFT enquiry that was launched into the whole thing can it......? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bugsy Posted February 28, 2011 Share Posted February 28, 2011 We have just been quoted 0.93 for heating oil and were advised that it could hit 1.00 next week.gobsmacked.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
parsnips Posted March 4, 2011 Share Posted March 4, 2011 Hi, I have found this site useful;http://www.fioulmoinscher.fr/annuaire-des-marchands-de-fioul,-- for current prices by region. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clair Posted March 16, 2011 Share Posted March 16, 2011 [quote user="Bugsy"]We have just been quoted 0.93 for heating oil and were advised that it could hit 1.00 next week.gobsmacked..[/quote]I phoned our two nearest suppliers yesterday (15/03) for a tankful of Premium and I was quoted 0.989€ by Alvéa and 0.933€ by the other, an independent who always manages to be cheaper every time I call for a quote.I have just had a delivery of 1299 litres for 1211€.As an aside, Alvéa told me their highest price so far has been 1.04€...EDIT: This is my spreadsheet to date: Date litres coût € / litre 10/09/03 1,366 € 542.30 0.397 € 08/03/04 1,184 € 481.89 0.407 € 07/03/05 1,251 € 729.33 0.583 € 07/05/07 1,505 € 946.65 0.629 € 31/01/08 671 € 530.09 0.790 € 16/03/11 1,299 € 1,211.81 0.933 € Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clair Posted February 10, 2012 Share Posted February 10, 2012 [quote user="Clair"][quote user="Bugsy"]We have just been quoted 0.93 for heating oil and were advised that it could hit 1.00 next week.gobsmacked..[/quote]Alvéa told me their highest price so far has been 1.04€...[/quote]Almost a year on from this quote, our absent Dutch neighbours have just had a delivery at 1.02€/l. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FairyNuff Posted February 11, 2012 Share Posted February 11, 2012 We're having some delivered on Tuesday at 1€055/litre. we couldn't believe it. Two months ago it was at 95.7 cents. I hope the weather warms up a bit, I'm heartily sick of the cold!FairyNuff Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AnOther Posted February 11, 2012 Share Posted February 11, 2012 Do you mean you bought some two months ago or held off hoping the price would drop. If the former then unfortunately watching the oil price is almost as futile as watching the exchange rate and I have learned that the only real option is to buy when you need and move on.I do always try to buy my oil in the in the middle of Summer which at least takes away some of the demand and supply element and also try to to couple up with nearby friends and/or neighbours for a better price on a larger quantity. Even if they only need a few hundred litres it's the overall quantity which gets the price down so always worth asking.If you bought two months ago do is it that you have a tiny tank or a mansion to heat I wonder [blink] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joe Posted February 11, 2012 Share Posted February 11, 2012 We bought some fuel today (501) litres at a cost of 87.2 euros.438 euros plus tax. Total cost was 522.92 euros. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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