Closing Window Shutters

[audio]

I thought it was mandatory to close window shutters if a house was left vacant for more than 24hours.

This has always been common knowledge here.

Stupid law I thought but is it the law?

According to my neighbour’s insurance company AGF, this is not required by law or insurance in his area of dept 22.

I will write to my insurers Credit Mutuel for their thoughts.

Does anyone know the law for this?

[pachapapa]

L’UTILISATION DES MOYENS DE

PROTECTION

La plupart des contrats exigent que les portes et fenêtres

soient fermées en cas d’absence de jour ou de courte durée. Et

pour les absences plus longues (c’est-à-dire, selon les contrats,

supérieures à douze, quinze ou vingt-quatre heures) ou pendant

la nuit, les volets ou persiennes doivent être utilisées.

A matter between you and the insurance company subject to terms & conditions of contract.

Jurisprudence places the burden of proof on the insurer, there are a number of Cassation Court cases confirming this, see Code d'Assurances.

[audio]

Pachapapa thank you for your post.

 

If your house is unoccupied for more than 24 hours, close your shutters. What an invite to burglars.

Closed shutters won’t stop them, well not the usual wood or plastic type.

Stupid regulation in my opinion.

 

 

[pachapapa]

[quote user="audio"]

Pachapapa thank you for your post.

 

If your house is unoccupied for more than 24 hours, close your shutters. What an invite to burglars.

Closed shutters won’t stop them, well not the usual wood or plastic type.

Stupid regulation in my opinion.

 

 

[/quote]

As you seem to have intuitively transmogrified my post regarding the NON REGULATORY nature of a contractual arrangement; I shall decline from commenting on your perception that the french insurance companies are collectively a "bunch of cons" as a juxta position to your own deliberative wisdom.

[audio]

Intuitively transmogrified?

Juxtaposition (note it is one word)

Bunch of cons?? Not a phrase I use.

Deliberative wisdom (sounds a bit like Merlin).

In my opinion your phraseology sounds very old fashioned and if you respond to other queries along the same superior vein, you won't be a very popular chap-apa..

During my travels, I remember that Lonely Planet recommends Pachapapa - is that you, bye the bye?

I no longer require your pompous advice/opinion; thanks all the same, just get a life!

[NormanH]

I think the point is that it isn't a law, but it is a get-out clause from an Insurance company.

If you haven't taken these precautions you probably aren't covered, but you won't get a visit from the Gendarmes either.

[audio]

[quote user="NormanH"]I think the point is that it isn't a law, but it is a get-out clause from an Insurance company.
If you haven't taken these precautions you probably aren't covered, but you won't get a visit from the Gendarmes either.

[/quote]

Thank you NormanH

[pachapapa]

To day the 3  rd  oct ober the MAIF based in Ni ort deuxsevres introduces a novel arrangemernt for the re placement of bodyparts dam aged on auto mobiles co-vered by insurance.

The source of the auto mobile bodyparts will be a Ni ortaise "con"cern; the trial will initially be only in poi tou charente but it is intended to extend it wide in the hexagon at a date not this year.

Pour ce test, prévu pour durer un an avant une éventuelle généralisation à l'échelle nationale, la MAIF travaillera avec le recycleur niortais Genève Occasions. « Une entreprise reconnue, qui a été un des promoteurs du monde moderne du recyclage automobile et dont nous sommes partenaires depuis longtemps. Toutes les pièces sont tracées : on sait de quels véhicules elles proviennent.

La MAIF utilise des pièces d'occasion

L'assurance MAIF lance un test grandeur nature pour les voitures, à partir d'aujourd'hui dans toute la région Poitou-Charentes. Elle propose d'utiliser des pièces d'occasion et non pas des pièces neuves, pour les réparations après un accident. Les voitures de plus de de 6 ans sont concernées, seulement pour les pièces de carrosserie. Si l'expérience marche, elle sera étendue à toute la France.

[audio]

[quote user="pachapapa"]

To day the 3  rd  oct ober the MAIF based in Ni ort deuxsevres introduces a novel arrangemernt for the re placement of bodyparts dam aged on auto mobiles co-vered by insurance.

The source of the auto mobile bodyparts will be a Ni ortaise "con"cern; the trial will initially be only in poi tou charente but it is intended to extend it wide in the hexagon at a date not this year.

Pour ce test, prévu pour durer un an avant une éventuelle généralisation à l'échelle nationale, la MAIF travaillera avec le recycleur niortais Genève Occasions. « Une entreprise reconnue, qui a été un des promoteurs du monde moderne du recyclage automobile et dont nous sommes partenaires depuis longtemps. Toutes les pièces sont tracées : on sait de quels véhicules elles proviennent.

La MAIF utilise des pièces d'occasion

L'assurance MAIF lance un test grandeur nature pour les voitures, à partir d'aujourd'hui dans toute la région Poitou-Charentes. Elle propose d'utiliser des pièces d'occasion et non pas des pièces neuves, pour les réparations après un accident. Les voitures de plus de de 6 ans sont concernées, seulement pour les pièces de carrosserie. Si l'expérience marche, elle sera étendue à toute la France.

[/quote]

We were talking about house shutters, sounds like you have lost the plot. Look out for the man in a white coat.

[Chancer]

I am not sure if amongst all the banter you have appreciated PP's initial point.

It is not a regulation, it is a requirement of most insurance companies for longer periods of absence which according to the company can vary from 24 hours to quinze jours, you would need to check with your company to see what applies to your policy.

I cant see the thread whilst typing this but I seem to recall that you have already asked the question of them.

[pachapapa]

The man in the white coat agrees with you.[:)]

All shutters should be removed in order to eliminate house breaking and burglary.

 

[betty]

[quote user="pachapapa"]

The man in the white coat agrees with you.[:)]

All shutters should be removed in order to eliminate house breaking and burglary.

 

[/quote]

I think you are missing the OP’s point. Leaving your shutters closed is an advertisement that ones house is empty, as the OP states ‘What an invite to burglars’.

I do not think that closed shutters would be any deterrent at all.

I must say that this rule applied to our insurance and worried us while we were away for some weeks.

 

[Araucaria]

We don't have shutters at all (and yes perhaps we'll regret it one day). Our menuisier said when he installed the windows (with toughened glass) that he had never envountered shutters he couldn't open in less than five minutes - usually a lot less - without any special tools. He thought that as a security measure they were useless, but if you didn't like thunderstorms maybe they helped.

[Mr Coeur de Lion]

I wonder how it would affect my property.

It is rented out, so I obviously do not have contents insurance.

However, the French doors (the type you get from Brico depot) do not have shutters. they are double glazed and have probably the best locking system on the house.

My tenants would have contents insurance, but should the worst happen could there be any come back on me?

[Nearly Retired (I am now)]

"he had never encountered shutters he couldn't open in less than five minutes - usually a lot less - without any special tools."

Yes, that sort of thing bothered me so I fitted locks internally which I only put on when we leave the house for weeks/months at a time. Of course that's no big deterent either, but the thief would need to lever-off the shutters until something in the oak planks broke or else the lock bolts pulled out. So maybe it gives us a little more time for the neighbours to wake up!

[NormanH]

There would be an interesting legal battle with at least one attempt to hold you responsible.

[Patf]

Most french people here keep their shutters closed all the time anyway - in summer to kep the house cool, and in winter to keep it warm.

So potential burglars get a bit confused.

[pachapapa]

[quote user="betty"][quote user="pachapapa"]

The man in the white coat agrees with you.[:)]

All shutters should be removed in order to eliminate house breaking and burglary.

 

[/quote]

I think you are missing the OP’s point. Leaving your shutters closed is an advertisement that ones house is empty, as the OP states ‘What an invite to burglars’.

I do not think that closed shutters would be any deterrent at all.

I must say that this rule applied to our insurance and worried us while we were away for some weeks.

 

[/quote]

On that basis, a priori, I can take you to hundreds of rural villages in La Vienne where at 20:00 all the shutters are closed. As I drive through it had never occurred to me that all the houses in these villages were empty; now I am puzzled as to where all these people go every night.[:)]

[cooperlola]

I shut mine the moment the sun goes down, Pacha, but I guess that shutters closed all day (except in summer when they're shut to keep the place cool)  might be an invitation to burglars - I don't know - I've never thought about it.  But certainly my own insurance policy specifies that all windows have either shutters or bars and that they are closed if the house lies empty for a certain length of time.  What I've never known is if the twice daily visits to feed my cats and dobbins when we're away would count - I don't put this to the test though.

[betty]

[quote user="pachapapa"][quote user="betty"][quote user="pachapapa"]

The man in the white coat agrees with you.[:)]

All shutters should be removed in order to eliminate house breaking and burglary.

 

[/quote]

I think you are missing the OP’s point. Leaving your shutters closed is an advertisement that ones house is empty, as the OP states ‘What an invite to burglars’.

I do not think that closed shutters would be any deterrent at all.

I must say that this rule applied to our insurance and worried us while we were away for some weeks.

 

[/quote]

On that basis, a priori, I can take you to hundreds of rural villages in La Vienne where at 20:00 all the shutters are closed. As I drive through it had never occurred to me that all the houses in these villages were empty; now I am puzzled as to where all these people go every night.[:)]

[/quote]

I think you have difficulty understanding.

It would appear to me that the shutter closure in question is for holidays or long periods of absence when they are shut 24/7 for several days or weeks not just overnight.

 

[pachapapa]

[quote user="betty"][quote user="pachapapa"][quote user="betty"][quote user="pachapapa"]

The man in the white coat agrees with you.[:)]

All shutters should be removed in order to eliminate house breaking and burglary.

 

[/quote]

I think you are missing the OP’s point. Leaving your shutters closed is an advertisement that ones house is empty, as the OP states ‘What an invite to burglars’.

I do not think that closed shutters would be any deterrent at all.

I must say that this rule applied to our insurance and worried us while we were away for some weeks.

 

[/quote]

On that basis, a priori, I can take you to hundreds of rural villages in La Vienne where at 20:00 all the shutters are closed. As I drive through it had never occurred to me that all the houses in these villages were empty; now I am puzzled as to where all these people go every night.[:)]

[/quote]

I think you have difficulty understanding.

It would appear to me that the shutter closure in question is for holidays or long periods of absence when they are shut 24/7 for several days or weeks not just overnight.

 

[/quote]

I have lived in my present french village full time 365 days a year since the Spring of 1997 and I can assure you that I fully understand the volet/shutter situation.

[Chancer]

No longer having any buildings or contents insurance I can do exacty what I want with my shutters!

As the ones on the front of the building are never closed I think its unwise to close them when I am away, were I to be burgled its a 99.9% probability ot would be one of my neighbours.

I close all the ones facing my rear courtyard in case anyone jumps over one of the walls, its more so that they cannot see what is on offer.

I never close the upper floor ones unless its to avoid glare in the evenings.

I have 25 windows and doors with either volets roulants or blinds and there is no way that I am going to faff around with all that lot.

If you are the victim of a burglary and are worried about your insurers, and well you should be, I advise you to make sure there are physical signs of forced entry on the door/window and shutter before reporting the sinistre, even if it means being a little creative.

I used to install burglar alarms and have often seen burglaries where there are no obvious signs of forced entry, the insurers play their game to their advantage, you just have to be better at it than them.

[AnOther]

"he had never encountered shutters he couldn't open in less than five minutes - usually a lot less - without any special tools."

That is complete BS and flannel. Sure basic shutters with nothing more that their own closing mechanisms and tiny top and bottom tabs won't keep out a 5 year old armed with nothing more than with a lolly stick however, add some internal bracing such as the 20mm square section solid bars sold in ever Brico shed for the purpose, then it becomes an entirely different proposition, not impossible but now definitely involving a serious bit of leverage with special tools.

[pachapapa]

No special tools, just an angle grinder or a miners bar.[:)]

[IMG]http://www.isoferm.com/volets/images/fritzell.jpg[/IMG]

[sid]

[quote user="Chancer"]

No longer having any buildings or contents insurance I can do exacty what I want with my shutters! .....

[/quote]

Wow! I understand how you picked your user name. [:-))]

Leaving aside the folly (in my opinion) of not insuring what is probably your most valuable possession, I thought there was a legal obligation to insure one's property?  Certainly the notaire checked that we had the appropriate document for insurance when the house purchase took place. Do we only have to insure, by law, for the short period of the purchase?