Being charged for French TV/redevance audiovisuelle

[Tieman]

Whilst we've had our second home in Vendee since June '02, we've just received a "redevance audiovisuelle, demande de renseignements" letter from the local office of the ministry for economy, finance & industry.

i.e. We are assuming that you have a television aerial and we'll charge you via tax d'habitation for television!

Like many of us, whilst our house came with an aerial, we only have/use a SKY satellite set up and don't watch French TV (and don't really want to help finance more of their endless panel/game shows or badly dubbed old American TV shows!).

What joy have people had with contesting the charge (how much is it now anyway?) if they don't or can't receive/watch French TV?

Words of wisdom or (successful) template letters gladly received!

Thanks

David

 

 

 

 

[AlanW]

I've just posted a similar topic myself, got the letter yesterday.  We do actually have a TV but it's the first we've heard of the licence money being collected this way.  Good luck with any challenge.

Having just checked the botom of my letter, there is a tear-off portion to return for us to declare if we do not have a television or comparable device.

Hope this helps

Alan

[Simon]

I don't watch the BBC in the UK, but as I have a TV I still have to pay the fee. Not a happy situation, but I doubt you can use the don't watch the French TV as an excuse.

Regards

Simon

[Tieman]

[quote]I don't watch the BBC in the UK, but as I have a TV I still have to pay the fee. Not a happy situation, but I doubt you can use the don't watch the French TV as an excuse.RegardsSimon[/quote]

It's not just don't watch don't want to pay but can't watch so why should I pay?

They are asking if you has a television aerial, not if you watch TV or have a TV set. So if you take down the aerial (even though you could still use a portable/indoors one), they can't then charge you?

I think I remember a case a while ago in England, where the license people failed in prosecuting someone who had a TV but just used it to play videos!  

David

[AlanW]

I've just translated my letter using Worldlingo and it's actually asking me if I have a "receiving set of television or a comparable device", so I guess that rules out the aerial but no TV arguement.  Unless it's different in your department.

Alan

[JohnM]

I "think" that in France you have to have a license if you own equipment capable of receiving TV signals, it matters not one jot whether you use it or not.

More informed sources, please correct me if necessary.

 

[Miki]

This old chestnut comes up every year about the Brits coming to France and saying "we have Sky TV so why should we pay for a French licence" was blown out of the water many years ago when the Redevance in the Dordogne publicly announced that simply having a TV set was enough to make you liable for the TV licence.

I simply cannot fathom out why people will not pay this fairly inexpensive tax, just because they don't want to receive French channels (more fool them anyway as that is where most of them would benefit from watching it to improve their French). I bet none has ever asked the govenement if it is alright to carry on paying French car tax (even though that has finished here) but would like to pay car tax, as they did in the UK !

Having your cake and eating it, n'est ce pas ? ...

[Will]

In France, the law is that any TV equipment has to be licensed. There are very few exceptions to this.

As you say, it is to be collected with the habitation tax. As far as I am aware, the only way you can avoid that being done later this year is by having submitted a French tax return (the time has passed for doing this for most people for this year) and ticked the box that says you do not have a television or are otherwise exempt.

[Teamedup]

For several years since our ariel moved we haven't been able to pick up french tv. You know the law in the UK and it is just the same here. You have a tv, you pay. Get rid of your tv and then you can tell them that you don't want to pay.

[Tieman]

[quote]This old chestnut comes up every year about the Brits coming to France and saying "we have Sky TV so why should we pay for a French licence" was blown out of the water many years ago when the Redevanc...[/quote]

 

"I simply cannot fathom out why people will not pay this fairly inexpensive tax"

Do you pay a tax just because you are asked to pay it? or do you look to see if it's correct and how your liability can be legally minimised or avoided?

If stating (correctly) that you only have the facility to watch SKY (i.e. you only have a UK transmission standard TV with a SKY box) means that particular tax is not applicable, what is wrong with asking the question?

David

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Nick Trollope]

If stating (correctly) that you only have the facility to watch SKY (i.e. you only have a UK transmission standard TV with a SKY box) means that particular tax is not applicable, what is wrong with asking the question?

Because the statement part of this question is wrong. i.e incorrect a false premise on which to base the subsequent question.

The tax is for ownership of equipment capable of receiving a TV signal. The fact that the signal comes froma UK-based TV company is not considered. This has been hacked over so many times that one would hope that people have got the message!

If you live in France (even part time) then pay yer taxes like everyone else has to, or at least don't whine (or gloat) whilst you avoid paying.

 

[Miki]

[quote]"I simply cannot fathom out why people will not pay this fairly inexpensive tax" Do you pay a tax just because you are asked to pay it? or do you look to see if it's correct and how your liability c...[/quote]

Tieman,

Sorry but yes we do we pay taxes that are demanded from us, I know the circumstances that can be put in to action if you try to avoid paying them !

Pay first, sort it out later, unless you have a solid and obvious case, that EVEN a fonctionnaire will spot and that a blunder has been made and correct it on the spot, otherwise, best to do as stated !

The only "taxes" we get are the usual ones, there are no real surprises in general, although some strange demands can come afterwards from building, restoration works carried out but in general most, if not all the rest, are well known here.

Like many here, of course I look at the demand, then shrug, inhale deeply, blow a couple of raspberry's and get the bluddy cheque book out

Can I put the boot on the other foot, now you know you are liable, will you be paying the back payments therefore due ? Not a fair question I know, as I doubt any of us on here would pay it, unless it was demanded but............

[Simon]

"This old chestnut comes up every year about the Brits coming to France and saying "we have Sky TV so why should we pay for a French licence" was blown out of the water many years ago when the Redevance in the Dordogne publicly announced that simply having a TV set was enough to make you liable for the TV licence.

I simply cannot fathom out why people will not pay this fairly inexpensive tax, just because they don't want to receive French channels (more fool them anyway as that is where most of them would benefit from watching it to improve their French."

I couldn't agree more Miki, just having a set in the UK means you need licence, why should the rules in France be any different. As for the French language, I have heard many such critisms of the British (Tieman, this is not aimed at you specifically, just a general point) that they do not intergrate into French culture and they lock themselves away watching their own TV and listening to UK radio on the internet. I have friends just like this, lived in France for years, but cannot speak a word, very sad.

Regards

Simon

[Tourangelle]

Let's be honest though, how many of us living in France know somebody who doesn't pay it? This is really one tax the French do their best to get out of (that and parking fines). The number of people I know who have a TV from their family or who have bought one claiming still to live with their parents, well ,the list is endless. People will not pay it because they know they could get away with it. Most French people live in flats, and therefore an aerial on the building means nothing. Obviously it is not a few British people coming over thinking because its in English it is exempt that has caused the French to change the system and make it part of the taxe d'habitation. That said, if you have a TV you have to pay, as this government site says very clearly

http://vosdroits.service-public.fr/particuliers/

[zeb]

The owners of a house I keep an eye on have received this letter and contacted me asking what it was all about.

They have no TV or radio (nothing in the house that would receive a signal) but they do have a very large satellite dish which the previous owner had installed. Where do they stand? I told them to tick the box saying no telly but now I'm wondering.....

[Teamedup]

Tieman, you have a tv that works. Therefore you have the elements to pay this.

 

Also you said that you have an ariel.You plug that tv in and attach the ariel link and you will have french tv too, maybe noir et blanc, but tv never the less. Some french people only pick up satellite too, and they have to pay.

I just cannot see any functionnaire taking this seriously at all. Although they may dine out on the story for while.

[Hagar]

[quote]The owners of a house I keep an eye on have received this letter and contacted me asking what it was all about. They have no TV or radio (nothing in the house that would receive a signal) but they do...[/quote]

Zeb,

The actual letter says "un poste recepteur de televison ou d'un dispositif assimile" i.e a television receiver or comparable device.

A sateliite dish can in no way be described as a comparable device to a television receiver  (it's just an antenna and does not contain a receiver).

Therefore you have given your friends the correct advice.

rgds

hagar

p.s - Note that a VCR is a "comparable device" and a satellite decoder may also be considered such - even if it is not connected.

 

[Dshart2]

reply received  ref  TV /redevance .

En application de l' article 41 de la loi de finances pour 2005 , la redevance audiovisuelle est due par toute personne physique imposable à la taxe d' habitation qui détient au 1er janvier ( 2005 au cas particulier ) un appareil récepteur de télévision ou dispositif assimilé permettant la réception de la télévision .

Il résulte de ces dispositions , qu' en raison de la détention d' un poste de télévision , vous êtes redevable de la redevance audiovisuelle.

Marie- France RUELLE.

If  you  have  any  device  capable of  receiving a tv signal  whether is connected or  switched on  you  are  now liable   for the  new tax  .

Doug H

 

[Hagar]

"Can I put the boot on the other foot, now you know you are liable, will you be paying the back payments therefore due ? Not a fair question I know, as I doubt any of us on here would pay it, unless it was demanded but...........".

Miki - I tried to do exactly that last year - downloaded the form and sent it off to the " centre de redevance" in Toulouse.

Got a letter back basically saying that since it will be collected through taxe d'habitation this year (2005) they couldn't care less.

Maybe they were feeling a bit aggrieved at the centres being closed.

http://fr.news.yahoo.com/040707/214/3yfm8.html

rgds

Hagar

 

[Quillan]

You know some times I despair, how many times do we have to go through this sort of thing. People either ask a question and when they get the answer they don’t want to hear they tell us we are all wrong. Alternatively they receive something and say that’s wrong as well or that they have not heard about it before. The worst thing is the lack of use of the search function on the forum, please people start using it. We get the same old questions followed by the same old answers followed by the same on arguements time after time, it really gets quite boring.

 

Collecting TV fees through your tax and not as a separate bill has been debated on the forum and publicised in the local and national press in France. You have a TV so you pay. Sitting smug and saying "well I have Sky (with or without a subscription) so it does not count" is no excuse bearing in mind it’s illegal to receive sky outside the UK (this has also been debated several times on the forum), check their Terms and Conditions. OK so we all do it and I include myself but I still pay my French TV licence just like everyone else.

 

So whilst my comments are NOT specifically aimed at the originator of this post what I will say is pay the bill.

 

You know some people have a pop at Miki sometimes because he appears rude but to be honest I understand where he is coming from, I should imagine he's the same as me sometimes and does a Victor (Meldrew that is - "I don't believe it").

 

Rant over.

 

The other person who has a dish but no TV or radio I would say take the dish down and invite an inspection and tell them they don’t have to make an appointment just pop a long anytime. It will be interesting to see how they get on and I hope they don’t have to pay.

[Hagar]

"The other person who has a dish but no TV or radio I would say take the dish down and invite an inspection and tell them they don’t have to make an appointment just pop a long anytime. It will be interesting to see how they get on and I hope they don’t have to pay."

Quillan - I agree with most of what you say re going over old ground and I have read most of the threads on this but don't remember discussion about whether having an aerial or dish alone will make you liable for the license fee. Apologies if I missed it.

To be abslolutely clear - " In radio terminology, a receiver (poste de recepteur in french) is an electronic device that receives a radio signal from an antenna and decodes the signal for use as sound, pictures, etc. " 

Therefore it is the TV set itself, (or the tuner in the VCR or set top box) that receives the signal . It is possession of one of these ( be it english, american or french , terrestrial, sateliite or cable  that makes you liable for the tax NOT the aerial or Dish.

rgds

Hagar

p,s - Hope you don't think I was having a go at Miki re "back taxes" - that was meant as a funny anecdote. If I can dig out the letter I'll see if I can post it - the "I don't really care" tone of the official was quite amusing.

 

[Hagar]

At the risk of being accused of flogging a dead horse - have a look at this French internet forum - http://www.forum-auto.com/sqlforum/section7/sujet271170.htm

Some of the members there are arguing the opposite case - " Je n'ai réellement pas de télévision -  I have a TV card in my computer - don't recieve TV via an aerial - I get it over ADSL - I don't need to pay the license fee! - I have never paid it before so why should I pay it now? ".

someone asked for a template earlier - what about "Pis c'est pas vraiment une tele hein"

rgds

Hagar

 

 

 

[Quillan]

[quote]At the risk of being accused of flogging a dead horse - have a look at this French internet forum - http://www.forum-auto.com/sqlforum/section7/sujet271170.htm Some of the members there are arguing...[/quote]

My guess is that it might be the same as UK TV in that part of your charges go towards some form of performing rights licence or whatever that the TV companies have to pay.