Advice on a good popular diesel car (not a dorky one)

[Mr Coeur de Lion]

Hopefully we'll be moving to France in the next 6 months or so, but as I've been away from England & Europe for the past 6 years, the names of cars over there seem to have changed.

I'm thinking of buying a diesel car as petrol is so expensive in France (I only pay 96 cents Australian per litre here) what are the best diesels out at the moment? I'm thinking of a car the size of a VW Golf (my wife still thinks VW's are dorky and herbie like, mainly because all the VW's in Australia are crappy old Beetles - can't convince her to buy a Golf s yet). Citroens used to be pretty good 10 years ago. Are they still the best for diesel? I guess this post may open a can of worms as people will obviously have their favourites, but if anyone can point me in the right direction as I am severly out of touch at present. The musts that this car must have is diesel, automatic and blue (last one was the wifes only request)

Many thanks

Lyndas husband.... Richard

[Nick Trollope]

Diesel, good? Oxymoron or what?

Buy a petrol car. There is nothing nice about diesel, it smells, damages the environment (worse, nowadays than petrol), causes cancer (summat to do with microparticulates), damages roads, kills motorcyclists becuase it does not evaporate...

The vehicles are only economical because they produce naff-all power and then in a powerband so narrow that you have no prospect of overtaking regardless of the power produced by the engine, even assuming that you and passers-by don't die from fractured eardrums because of the appalling noise.

Diesels belong in boats where the rest of us can't see and hear them.

That said, I have 2 diesels, both turbocharged - whatever you do, don't buy a normally-aspirated diesel - no power, no power band. Get an automatic, saves alot of gear-changing aggro - you can never beat the power band like you can in a pertrol car. Go for a huge engine - anything less than 2L turbo is a waste of steel (My 4x4 has a 3.1L turbochraged straight 6 and that is just about acceptable).

Think again about buying a petrol car - especially if you are considering something the size of a Golf & don't do many miles..

Start a campaign to have diesels outlawed (except in boats, see above). Buy a petrol car.

Get the message?

 

[Mr Coeur de Lion]

So why shoul take the advice of someone who has a diesel that damages the environment, kills mototcyclists, damages eardrums etc etc

So you think I should go for petrol then???

Gosh I don't know how I'll cope with the fuel prices....

I thought diesels were actually cleaner than petrol, I know you see a lot more rubbish from diesel than petrol, but it's not always what you can see that causes the damage. Then again the person who told me this swears by diesels and it was over 12 years ago he told me this.

Ah well I guess something the size of a Golf would be pretty economical, I drive a Kia Sportage 4x4 over here in Oz. Pretty economical for a 4x4 but it's a Kia - Asia's version of a Skoda! Can't wait to get rid.

[Happy Expat]

Love the 'advice' given by a previous poster! We found that the answer is to forget what someone else in another post called 'Brit thinking' and look at what local people drive. The most popular choice seems a Renault Kango or the Citroen/Peugeot variants. So, we bought a three year old Kangoo 1.9 Tdi it's economical (55 mpg average), roomy (especially with the back deats down for carrying the odd large item), does not strain our eardrums, has an acceptable performance and is reliable and inexpensive on parts when nneded. What more could you want :-)

Bob & Jane (47)

[Happy Expat]

Love the 'advice' given by a previous poster! We found that the answer is to forget what someone else in another post called 'Brit thinking' and look at what local people drive. The most popular choice seems a Renault Kango or the Citroen/Peugeot variants. So, we bought a three year old Kangoo 1.9 Tdi it's economical (55 mpg average), roomy (especially with the back deats down for carrying the odd large item), does not strain our eardrums, has an acceptable performance and is reliable and inexpensive on parts when nneded. What more could you want :-)

Bob & Jane (47)

[Poolguy]

These days you can get 130 hp out of a 2.6lt TDI without any trouble ... more if you mess with it. And at less than 7lts per 100 km or better ...its a bonus.

The petrol people are those on the roads that accelerate too hard, pass when its dangerous and give us all heart attacks from stress long before we will ever die of cancer.

Gasoil is good, Biofuel is better, (but you've got a challenge persuading the Gendarmes).

A 5 series VW Golf is a great vehicle, comes in 2,3 4 or 5 'doors' with all the extra's.

I've just bought a VW Carravelle in Germany and am importing it to France ... saved a bundle. But its not exactly a doddle.. I used an agent to look over the prospectives and negotiate for me. Very safe.

PM if you want the details.

Andrew

 

[Happy Expat]

PS !! Local diesel price is 0.96 euros per litre ...

[Mr Coeur de Lion]

Thanks Bob & Jane. Sounds pretty good. But how many people has it killed with its fumes?

[Alcazar]

The latest Citroen/Peugeot diesel engines are amongst the cleanest EVER with particulate filters, common rail injection etc etc.

Our neighbour has a Berlingo 2.0HDi, it's powerful (130bhp), quiet, frugal, and has an amazing load carrying capacity.

As for noisy, modern diesels aren't. And the particulates? Hmmmmmmm, I'm not convinced about these either, I still reckon it was a scam by HMG to give them a reason to put diesel into a higher tax bracket than petrol, simply because most modern diesels will do 50 to the gallon.

At least the French government were honest, they just put it up to the same price as petrol and admitted that they had to do so because they were losing taxation because diesels did so many miles to the gallon.

[Miki]

Alcazar ..."At least the French government were honest, they just put it up to the same price as petrol and admitted that they had to do so because they were losing taxation because diesels did so many miles to the gallon"

Are you sure about that? Diesel has never been the same price as petrol, not even today.

How does one believe what is worse, one minute diesel motors are better for the environment, then next day it is petrol,and the following week back it switches to diesel, rather like a bacon sarnie and tea are good one minute but killers the next !

Buy what you want, get here and take a look around, it's only a jam jar after all..........

[Mr Coeur de Lion]

Buy what you want, get here and take a look around, it's only a jam jar after all..........

My wife totally agrees with you. I can pick any car I want so long as it's blue she says.

Next question, what blue car should I pick.......

[Val_2]

As long as it gets you from A to B,isn't a rustbucket or a gas guzzler you have a big choice to choose from here. The french are very loyal to their car companies hence most people opt for Renault,Peugeot or Citroën for easiness of getting parts and work done on them. I've never understand why people want to spend huge amounts of money on cars when they don't need to as they just sit in the drive or in a works car park for most of their vehicle lives depreciating.

[Pixietoadstool]

Another vote for a Citroen Berlingo 2.0 HDi!

I sometimes get 600 miles out of a tank and it is very comfortable to drive.

The rear passenger seats are higher than the front seats so passengers get a good view and there is room for 3 full sized adults in the back.  It has very good visibility and head height and a massive amount of carrying space.  Other clever things include the modutop (roof rails that can be changed to fit at a 90 degree difference depending what you are carrying) aircraft style overhead lockers with also drop down picnic tables, hidden drawers and plenty of 9 volt sockets for plugging in all those accoutrements, a CD rack overhead, good CD player/radio system.  My only criticism is that, like all modern Citroens (and Fords for that matter) the dash and insides of the doors are very plasticky (but the seats are nice and comfortable).  It is pretty nippy too - especially in second gear and can cruise comfortably at 90 mph.

 

... oh and I forgot to say - it's blue - metallic royal blue!

Valerie

[Poolguy]

When will you people convert to the metric system........MPG..., MPH. huffff... its nonsence.

You live in France .... metrification happened nearly 45 years ago to most of known world (except UK).... maybe noone noticed

Get a grip

Andrew

[Blackadder<IMG src="http:forums.livingfrance.comimagesline.gif"><BR>Blackadder<BR>Keighley and Creuse]

Its got to come down to how many miles you intend doing, (oh and what budget you have) How many of you there are, whether you'll tow a trailer/fill the car with pets etc etc.

Size of engine is codswallop, a new 1.9l can push out 150 horse power, top 130 mph...which just means it'll cruise very happily and quietly at 130kmh.... and the torque they have makes overtaking a breeze.  Oh and it'll do 50mpg or is that 6 litres per 100 km???

Most modern cars (certainly over the past 4 or 5 years) are fine but you need to be doing in excess of 15000 miles or 24000km a year in the UK to make a diesel worthwhile, France may or maynot be similar.

Us???? I run a diesel estate and do 25000miles a year, the mrs runs a Yaris petrol and does 6000miles a year. We both get 45mpg.

Happy hunting

[opas]

We have a Citroen Xantia deisel 2L , get about 50 to the gallon, though we are not boy racers....but the acceleration is there if needed, Mr O says we have to economise on the fuel.....I do, I close the windows to save on drag and put the Air conditioning on

you could always stop off in the UK , I beleive Rover are doing some good deals(acc to Jeremy Clarkeson  , Top Gear) though the parts would be expensive.

Mrs O

[Teamedup]

Obviously Mrs O you didn't see Mythbusters the other week. Get more MPG by turning the airocon off and opening the windows. I was quite surprised by this, but that is what happened in their tests.

[Mr Coeur de Lion]

Oh yes, I can safely say that air con does whack the mpg's. You need it on all the time in the Australian summers, but now its winter time here, it's mainly off and the mpg's have soared with it off. Got more power too. Ah winter time in Australia - down to 6 deg C at night and low 20's during the day.

Had a look at some of the cars mentioned on this post. Is it me or has the good looking car vanished??? I was expecting sleek smooth lines. They all look like vans with windows in the back. The one that look nicest is the Renault Megane. Might look into that more.

[Mr Coeur de Lion]

[quote]Oh yes, I can safely say that air con does whack the mpg's. You need it on all the time in the Australian summers, but now its winter time here, it's mainly off and the mpg's have soared with it off. ...[/quote]

Please forgive my darling anal husband. We have about 8-12 weeks before we can make the move to France from Oz and we are staying in our miniature holiday villa (only 40 m2) until everything is sold and we are ready to go.

Our days are so terribly boring, so please forgive him!  He has nothing to do here at this hinterland resort but to play tennis, drink wine, walk the dog, and dream about what car he is going to buy when he gets to France.

As for me, voiture bleue is just fine, and..... bring on more wine!  Can't remember the last time he let me drive anyway!

Lynda (Richards wife)

[Poolguy]

Which resort would that be in Oz then Lynda. Is the weather hot enough for you.. did you see the hail storm in Brisbane then?

Do you have a favourite wine in Oz .... fairly different to the offering in France... I'm sure that you will notice the difference.

Andrew

[Mpprh]

Hi

just worth adding a few points :

Non turbo, old design diesel engines are truly unpleasant

There has been enormous development of diesel engines in the last few years

Better fuel consumption reduces CO2 emissions

Latest engines have particle filters

Higher sulphur emissions will be resolved as cleaner diesel becomes available

From the driving seat, a modern diesel feels 20% more powerful than the bhp figures suggest (i.e. a 100bhp diesel feels like a 120 bhp petrol because it has more torque)

VW group have a 2 litre / 140 bhp diesel engine available in many models

As a general rule the best small diesels are Renault / PSA / Fiat / VW and the best large diesels are MB / BMW

The Japanese are now introducing their own new generation diesels, and these appear to be very good

Some research is needed because Ford use Peugeot diesel engines and some GM products use ISUZU diesels, etc.

In Europe the larger the car, the higher % sold with diesel. Some models are 85% diesel

Some larger models are hard to sell in France as used cars if they have the petrol engine

Diesel engines have a lower fiscal cv rating in France : so lower insurance and vignette (if it comes back)

French manufacturers develop their diesel engines to optimise the eventual cv rating : so a 6cv Peugeot diesel is often more powerful than a non French 6cv (n.b. cv has nothing to do with power !) 

Peter

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[opas]

[quote]We have a Citroen Xantia deisel 2L , get about 50 to the gallon, though we are not boy racers....but the acceleration is there if needed, Mr O says we have to economise on the fuel.....I do, I close...[/quote]

Calm down everyone! I`m not that thick......It was a joke I also know that the air cond emits even more crap into the air mrs O

[Mr Coeur de Lion]

[quote]Which resort would that be in Oz then Lynda. Is the weather hot enough for you.. did you see the hail storm in Brisbane then? Do you have a favourite wine in Oz .... fairly different to the offering ...[/quote]

We are about an hour south and inland from Brisbane at a resort called Kooralbyn but saw nothing of a hail storm out here. Not even any rain which we are desperate for.

Getting a bit chilly, got the reverse cycle air conditioner on. At night it gets quite cold, even below zero in the height of winter, but the days are beautiful, low 20's, just enough for a jumper.

Watching the French Open on Austar, see Tim Henman has lost yet again. Not seen many Aussies play yet though.

As for wine, we're slowely introducing Lynda to some reds. Had a glass of Merlot the other night (not sure of the brand though) with a selection of cheeses. Wouldn't be a patch on the French stuff though.

As for metric system, it's all metric out here. No imperial at all.

[Poolguy]

Hi again

Yes Merlot its a speciality, not to many vingobles have the backbone to serve a straight merlot in this country.. Mostly tinker with it by adding Cabernet. Have you had any straight shiraz from the Connawarra... heaven.

If you PM me you email I'll send you some pics... its was dramatic, ice flows in Brisbane streets... talk about 'el nino'

Yes, its completely metric in France too but you wouldn't know it reading this thread.

What the previous poster was saying about Cv rating is really significant. For example a 111kw 5 series BMW is the same insurance rating as a 75kw 2 llitre Renault. Its wacky, and the forumla is almost incomprehensible. Its to do with the power delivery v top speed in top gear. Consequently some French cars go faster in 4th gear than 5th (the BMW for example). It can mean a lot when you are getting your annual flogging by the insurance co.s.

Is there anything you will miss about Oz then?

Andrew

 

[David584]

Just to bring the thread back to the subject.

Also have a look at the Volvo S40. Volvo have recently produced their own 5 cylinder diesel and are now fitting this to their range of vehicles, thereby replacing the VW units. Even if you purchase one that has a 4 cylinder VW engine, not a problem. Solid, reliable and good fuel consumption.