ams Posted January 22, 2008 Share Posted January 22, 2008 Are capital gains subject to the 8% CMU charge thus making the effective rate 35%. ams Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Will Posted January 22, 2008 Share Posted January 22, 2008 No - capital gains are subject (but only for French residents) to CSG/CRDS/PS at 11%. As the basic rate for Europeans is 16% that makes the effective rate 27%. If you are non-European the rate is 33.3%. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sunday Driver Posted January 22, 2008 Share Posted January 22, 2008 Capital gains are subject to the 11% contributions sociales as mentioned by Will. However, the gain is also taken into account when calculating the revenu fiscale de reference - it is after all, income - so it will impact on the 8% CMU calculation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ams Posted January 22, 2008 Author Share Posted January 22, 2008 So the effective rate is 35%. So i guess to avoid paying sustantial taxation on capital gains, wait until after one is 65 years old and then does the rate drop by 17.5%. I would now like to leave the CMU, where is the door. !!!! ams Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ams Posted January 23, 2008 Author Share Posted January 23, 2008 I their an upper limit on the CMU payments for a family unit. ams Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sunday Driver Posted January 23, 2008 Share Posted January 23, 2008 Check out [url=http://www.ameli.fr]Ameli.fr[/url] for details of CMU payment.I note from your previous posts that you are living in your principal residence, so not sure why you are enquiring about capital gains tax.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woolybananasbrother Posted January 23, 2008 Share Posted January 23, 2008 If selling a second home, the rate of capital gains is 16% for non-French residents of the EU. According to my local tax office the social charge if not payable any more. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
groslard Posted January 23, 2008 Share Posted January 23, 2008 Surely CSG is payable on all 'unearned' income?there is a very useful 'ready reckoner' here:http://www.anil.org/guide/calculs/plusvalue/pluvalue.htm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woolybananasbrother Posted January 23, 2008 Share Posted January 23, 2008 Well, I did fone the tax office and they went higher to get advice and came back to me. The guy said he hadnt know it himself. And he was the CGT specialist Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ams Posted January 23, 2008 Author Share Posted January 23, 2008 What response did he give. I am just back from the CPAM office, I posed the question about the upper limit and the response was, you will pay none as according to their records we will not be in the cMU after the end of march 2008. I gave up and left without bothering to ask any further questions. ams Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ams Posted January 23, 2008 Author Share Posted January 23, 2008 If you looked at other post you would have seen that we have a number of investment properties. One of which is causing us a great deal of problems as we have a non paying tenant, and according to the bailiff it will take a minimum of 18 to 24 months to evict them. So what we would like to do is sell all of our properties , put the funds into guaranteed bonds and live stress free. ams Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woolybananasbrother Posted January 23, 2008 Share Posted January 23, 2008 yes i saw that. seems a very sensible thing to do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ams Posted January 23, 2008 Author Share Posted January 23, 2008 talked to the french/english helpline at 0 820 904 212 and asked them about an upper limit to CMU de base payments. I was assured their is no limit. In order to avoid giving the french government 46% of any capital gain it is necessary to do the following. 1. Have a E121 and thus no CMU payments are due. 2. Sell any properties after 5 years to avoid paying 19.6% vat on the capital gain. 3. Sell any properties after 5 years to avoid paying vat at 19.6% on the full sale value of the land. 4. Sell any properties after 15 years to avoid fully and capital gains tax and social security payments. 27%. In order to avoid stress connected with non paying tenants, become a french citizen, run for president, change the stupid legislation. Alternatively win the euro lotto. ams Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ams Posted January 23, 2008 Author Share Posted January 23, 2008 Thanks for the site, hit it and telephoned the office and asked the same question regarding maxamum payments. she thought that maximum limits did exist, so she is investigating the matter and will phone me this afternoon. ams Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BJSLIV Posted January 23, 2008 Share Posted January 23, 2008 The maximum amount of 8% worth's you can be required to pay is currently 8 644 € per year. http://www.cmu.fr/userdocs/232-6_2007v2.pdf Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caramac Posted January 23, 2008 Share Posted January 23, 2008 [quote user="BJSLIV"]The maximum amount of 8% worth's you can be required to pay is currently 8 644 € per year. http://www.cmu.fr/userdocs/232-6_2007v2.pdf[/quote]I read this to be the figure above which one begins to pay the 8% ?[8-)] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ams Posted January 23, 2008 Author Share Posted January 23, 2008 That is correct, the exemption figure is €8,644. i just received a call from the french english help line. Apparently their is no limit, however if we so desire, we can write to our local CPAM office and tell them that we want to leave the CMU and they will do it for us. ams Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cooperlola Posted January 23, 2008 Share Posted January 23, 2008 This is why the wealthy are glad to leave CMU behind and buy PHI is it not? Assuming they have no pre existing or chronic conditions of course, in which case they are stuck with it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ams Posted January 23, 2008 Author Share Posted January 23, 2008 Common sense indicates that their should be an upper limit. If their was then a lot more people would be willing to contribute thus giving the system the ability to transfer funds to the most needy. However the system as it stands is a nonsense, the same with the wealth tax, it has driven out a huge number of people from the country. ams Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BJSLIV Posted January 23, 2008 Share Posted January 23, 2008 I read this to be the figure above which one begins to pay the 8% ? Yes you are right! Thats what happens when I do things in a rush!It's actually the wrong limit. I was trying to find the other plafonde which says that if you don't supply them with evidence of your income then they will assume it to be 160000 and calculate the 8% based on that. However it isn't actually a limit just an incentive to get your paperwork in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ron Avery Posted January 23, 2008 Share Posted January 23, 2008 [quote user="ams"]If you looked at other post you would have seen that we have a number of investment properties. One of which is causing us a great deal of problems as we have a non paying tenant, and according to the bailiff it will take a minimum of 18 to 24 months to evict them. So what we would like to do is sell all of our properties , put the funds into guaranteed bonds and live stress free. ams[/quote]So how many properties can you rent out without registering that you have a letting business then? I thought it was only a chambre d'hote in your own house that was exempt from registration. So you can run a business and still be in the CMU then? We keep being told the CMU was set up for the poor French, not for the benefit of rich land owners from abroad.Perhaps you should get a French accountant to answer your questions? Surely being a finance and tax expert yourself wouldn't you just hate it if your clients listened to advice from mere peasants on a Forum.[kiss] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ams Posted January 23, 2008 Author Share Posted January 23, 2008 Ronny old chap, Nothing like a bit of the old green sniping, i would be surprised if you actually did anything else. kind regards, ams Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ron Avery Posted January 23, 2008 Share Posted January 23, 2008 A simple enough question I would have thought! How many properties can you rent out without registering that you have a letting business then ?????? Less than you have or more? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ams Posted January 23, 2008 Author Share Posted January 23, 2008 I have a very high regard for the vast majority of posters on this board, their are exceptions, one comes to mind, i think he considers himself a self proclaimed "peasant", generally is not helpful and likes to attack people to try and demonstrate an inferior intellect. A quick glance at his posts says everything. This is the last post to you as you clearly have a problem which i can not resolve, and i do not wish to lower the tone of this excellent board by responding to your little digs. very kind regards, ams Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Will Posted January 23, 2008 Share Posted January 23, 2008 But he's dead right to suggest you speak to a proper, qualified, advisor on French tax. Stuff gleaned from forums is very useful as a guideline or to give a basic idea, but everybody's situation is different and there are many, many, variables to take into account. Even a minor error or misunderstanding can have serious and expensive consequences where French tax and - particularly - social security are concerned. I see you have been asking a number of tax-related questions, so if these are important things in your life rather than hypothetical situations you would be well advised to invest in good professional advice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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