Thought I saw the light at the tunnels end.

[dexter]

Two years ago I retired from the Police service, I had over 30 years of NI contributions so no longer had to pay them. I then started on what had been my long time dream of a permanent move to France.

The house went up for sale and within a month the property market crashed. I had been very close to signing for a house in France but (fortunately) backed out due to the total lack if interest in my UK property. Now, almost 2 years and only 10 viewings later I have at last a very firm offer on my house and can once again look forward to a move to France, (I`ve not been idle in the last 2 years, I`ve brushed up on my French and been to view quite a few properties).

This  afternoon I contacted HMRC in Newcastle to enquire about my eligibility for an E106 when I finally make the move. They were very helpful but perhaps I have been a bit naive. I was told that the E106 is based on the previous 2 years NI contributions and as I hadn't paid any then I wasn't eligible. "But I`ve paid all the contributions I needed to" said I, "Those are the rules I`m sorry" came the reply.So no option but to obtain Private Health Insurance immediately I move to France.

Perhaps my experience will be of benefit to other forum members in a similar position. Just when you think things are on the up eh!

I know many of you will quite rightly point out that I should be able to afford Private Health Insurance from my pension, but I thought that I might have had 2 years grace with the E106.

So, can anyone tell me what a 52 year old single male in good health might be expected to pay for said insurance?

Dexter 

[Théière]

Cheer up, on the plus side Dexter 2 years of not paying NI contribution will go towards your private scheme [:)]

[JohnRoss]

I have no doubt that there will a reply soon from someone who knows a lot more about the current situation re not having an E106 than me but meantime you could always talk to someone like Soficas, English speaking Assurance agents in France. Ask for Tony Mason who will know doubt be able to advise you as to your options, worth a look and you don't have to commit to anything. They deal with AFPS and Swiss Life and no doubt other companies as well. Their information on the current situation in France should be up to date at least. Good luck................................JR

http://www.soficas.fr/

PS Lots of sites like this http://www.justlanded.com/english/France/Articles/Health/Moving-to-France Would it be worth talking to PPP or BUPA in the UK?

Could you pay 2 years contributions and then get an E106 or am I being stupid? If you could would it be less than buying full cover health Insurance for two years?

[britgirl]

Could you pay 2 years contributions and then get an E106 or am I being stupid? If you could would it be less than buying full cover health Insurance for two years?

 

Sorry to be a killjoy but as far as I am aware the only N.I. contributions  Dexter could pay are Class 3 (non-employed) and I was told that these do not count towards an E106. [:(]

[JohnRoss]

Ok so I was being stupid, oh well just a thought...................................JR

[woody234]

but when you move to france you will become a french citizen so will you still need an E106

[JohnRoss]

I think he will be a British citizen resident in France............................JR

[gosub]

[quote user="JohnRoss"]I think he will be a British citizen resident in France............................JR[/quote]

Also. Without an "E" form  he/she will need to provide proof of health insurance to be legally resident, and continue to do so, until he/she is eligible for an "E" form or have 5 years legal residency which ever comes first.

[AnOther]

[quote user="woody234"]but when you move to france you will become a french citizen so will you still need an E106
[/quote]Since when and why would you need an E106 simply because you had become French resident ?

Dexter, sorry to hear of your problem but just for clarification 30 years NI are what are required to qualify for a full UK state pension and are nothing directly to do with eligibility, or otherwise, for an E106. That, as you have unfortunately discovered, is based on you having paid class 1 NI contributions in the previous two full tax years prior to your application.

Not actually relevent now but as a non employed person your application for an E106 would be made to DWP not HMRC but the rules are the same.

Good luck.

 

[dexter]

Hi AnOther,

I paid full NI contributions for over 30 years so will I get my full pension and a bit more!?  Nah, didn't think so.

Rules, rules, rules, where would we be without them. I fully accept what I`ve been told, be it from HMRC or DWP and as I said in my original post I hope that my experience will be of some use to anyone else in a similar situation who is thinking of moving to France. I started to look for PHI last night and the only site that would give me an immediate quote was AXA, that came in at £120 per month. It certainly makes you think a bit more about your finances when you add that amount on,and that was a discounted introductory rate.

Still, I fully expected to have to pay PHI for at least 3 years after my now non existent E106 ran out so whats another 2 years. (about 4 grand!!!)

Hey Ho, all part of life as we know it.

Dexter

[AnOther]

You have to be thankful it's changed from 44 years I suppose, I've done that many now, and it looks like I'll be doing a few more, yet I won't get a penny more than you for it but then nobody said it would be fair !

BTW: £120/mth for 2 years comes to £2880 by my reckoning, not 4 grand [;-)]

 

[ebaynut]

Perhaps you should consider yourself lucky that you can still make the move. We would be more than happy to pay the private healthcare insurance premium you speak of, but due to my wife's long term disability, it is now against the law for us to move to France, due to the changes introduced two years ago.

Our house at that stage had a buyer, we had found a house we wanted, then the change in the rules.

Don't talk to me about discrimination against the disabled, we are more than aware of it.

 

[NormanH]

"I started to look for PHI last night and the only site that would give

me an immediate quote was AXA, that came in at £120 per month. It

certainly makes you think a bit more about your finances when you add

that amount on,and that was a discounted introductory rate."

In any case you would have to pay a contribution towards the cost of your health care, based on your pension  plus a "Mutuelle" (mine is about 70 euros a month)

I think £120 a month looks cheap.

eBay

I don't understand your point about it being illegal for you to move to France.

[AnOther]

Although I understand exactly where you're coming from ebaynut I think it's more correct to say that is not against the law for you to move to France, rather that currently you are not able to comply with the rules for doing so which is not quite the same thing.

As I understand it what happened 2 years ago was not actually a change in the rules but a change in the way they had been applied one aspect of which was that people who had hitherto managed to affiliate to the French health service with a letter of refusal of an E106 were no longer able to do so and in fact should never have been allowed to in the first place.

Depending on age and other factors there are potentially several ways for anybody to legitimately move to France, even with medical conditions which preclude private insurance.

A job here would be one, or starting up a business. A part time job in UK where you pay class 1 NI is another and you'd only have to do that for a maximum of 3 years. I'm not suggesting that any of those are easy or necessarily options for you, just pointing out that possibilities exist.

The basic issue is that systems were never geared up to cater for those taking early retirement be it through illness, disability, or choice. Once either of you reach UK retirement age, or more precisely are in receipt of a UK state pension, however small, then you will be able to move freely as you will be covered under an E121.

[NormanH]

An excellent balanced post AnOther.

[Iceni]

[quote user="ebaynut"]

we would be more than happy to pay the private healthcare insurance premium you speak of, but due to my wife's long term disability, it is now against the law for us to move to France, due to the changes introduced two years ago.

 

[/quote]

I predict a Daily Mail article - never let the truth get in the way of a "good" story.

John

[ebaynut]

[quote user="NormanH"]"I started to look for PHI last night and the only site that would give me an immediate quote was AXA, that came in at £120 per month. It certainly makes you think a bit more about your finances when you add that amount on,and that was a discounted introductory rate."


In any case you would have to pay a contribution towards the cost of your health care, based on your pension  plus a "Mutuelle" (mine is about 70 euros a month)
I think £120 a month looks cheap.

eBay
I don't understand your point about it being illegal for you to move to France.
[/quote]

To comply with French residency rules, we would need three years private health cover before we could join the French system, ( I have paid stamps so would be entitled to an E106 for the first two years) unfortunately due to my wife's condition this would not be an option as no company would cover her with her problems. So we cannot move at present and if we did  move to France it would be against the law.

[AnOther]

If you are entitled to an E106 then you can move to France tomorrow, the problem will come when it runs out in Jan 2012.

[ebaynut]

[quote user="AnOther"]If you are entitled to an E106 then you can move to France tomorrow, the problem will come when it runs out in Jan 2012.

[/quote]

Well done Ernie [I]

[AnOther]

[quote user="ebaynut"]Well done Ernie [I][/quote]Apologies for pointing out the blindingly obvious but it was to counter your erroneous statement:

"we cannot move at present and if we did move to France it would be against the law" [;-)]

[ebaynut]

[quote user="AnOther"][quote user="ebaynut"]Well done Ernie [I][/quote]Apologies for pointing out the blindingly obvious but it was to counter your erroneous statement:

"we cannot move at present and if we did move to France it would be against the law" [;-)]

[/quote]

Well OK,  [:D]  perhaps I should have replied to Dexter,

 

" At least you can still move to France permanently  as an early retiree without it being against the law, unlike us."

 

With regard the other points you raise, and I have to agree with Norman about it being a well balanced post, having read the threads on this and other forums  about starting a business in France, with all the problems and such small returns, if this was the only way that your wife's future healthcare could be covered, with the risks involved, would you consider it?  I think I would prefer your journey to work. [;-)]

Even Norman said in his post on another thread this morning,  (no pun intended), and I quote,

 

[quote user="NormanH"]

I can't imagine anyone moving to rural France to make a living, unless in some countryside- related business.


[/quote]

[dexter]

AnOther,

You are quite right of course,    £120 x 24 months = £2880.  But as this was a quote with the "special introductory discount," I fully expect as with most offers like this, that my premiums in year 2 would be considerably higher.  That being the case, is it the norm for the members on here who are subject to paying PHI to shop around year on year to get the best deal possible as with other insurance?

Dexter

[AnOther]

ebaynut,

Normans point is well made and very true, it is hard to make a living in France, however nothing you have said indicates that you need to do that so one presumes that you would intend living off pensions and/or savings. That being the case an auto-entrepreneur business of some sort could be a way into the health system for you and I wouldn't dismiss it. You would have a breather of 2 years, courtesy of your E106, to decide what to do and set it up and if you timed it so that it commenced roughly at the same

time as your E106 expired you'd only have to tick along with it for those 3

magic years after which you'd be home and dry.

Apparently Gites and Chambre d'hotes can qualify you and I don't know if your plans, as they were, included anything like that but there are a whole range of other activities which fall under AE so I think it's well worth investigating but others will be far better place than I to further advise on it.

Regarding my own journey to work I do count myself fortunate to be in a job which allows me to live just about anywhere I choose so long as I'm prepared to put up with the travelling. Ironically it takes me no longer to get to and from France than it did where we used to live in UK, and is marginally cheaper too !

 

[ebaynut]

AnOther,

Thanks for the ideas.

We had thought of perhaps Gites, never did fancy CDH, (I really don't wish to have strangers in my house), but under the current circumstances it means we would HAVE to run them rather than doing them as a side line, just for the health cover, which others like Dexter can enjoy for a small outlay each month on insurance.

And as for all the running around to comply with Monsieur jobs worth who needs everything in triplicate to comply with some strange rule, I think it would all be too much.

After reading as I do, posts on here from people who do run Gites and tails of woe, from members like Dave's "I am giving up Gites" thread, although very funny  to read, I wonder if I even wish to try this.

All we wished to do was move to France, like the OP is doing, not get involved with a whole new set of rules regarding running a business we are not really interested in.

I don't blame France for changing the Healthcare rules, I just wish the UK would do the same.

 

 

[AnOther]

I totally agree with you about Gites and CdH, I'm afraid my cup of human kindness would very soon become depleted and in fact I think John Cleese probably took his clues for Basil Fawlty from me [:D]

I do think you dismiss the idea of an AE business too lightly, it's not the beureaucratic costly nightmare that an ordinary enterprise is, but I suppose it depends on how serious you really are about moving to France.

Good luck anyway.