Re: ARE WE ALL GETTING TOO OLD OR DO YOU AGREE WITH THIS?

[YCCMB]

Snarf!

[powerdesal]

Gengulphus wrote:- '' The 'People Carrier' has now deservedly come to the fore as a symbol of wasteful vulgarity. ''

Why ????????

7 seats, allowed the whole family to go out in one car rather than using two, thus saving environmental pollution.

[Chancer]

Did you mean extended family.

Many families of 7 are in your face symbols of wastefull vulgarity, not yours I'm sure though [:)]

[powerdesal]

2 x Parents ( us ) + daughter, her husband and two children, ie 6 people requiring seats - a 7 seater works for this.

The alternative is to use our car + their car, twice the fuel consumption etc etc.

[idun]

Ah powerdesal, that has made me smile. Unless you all live together, which you might, but I actually only know of one family that ended up with their daughter, husband and two kids living with them 'again', then this won't wash.

Both families wouldn't really need more than two small four seater cars. And if these cars were zero emmisions and 70mpg would it matter for the odd trip out that two were used?

And can one manage with one small four seater, well even when our kids were small, that is exactly what we had, got in all our stuff, the fold up cots and pushchair and sometimes, ski gear,  and we were very well travelled, always managed. I admit that we were the first people in the region, maybe most of France and Switzerland, to get a roof box, which was a good way of keeping the car small and having extra storage space during our big journeys.

[Rabbie]

[quote user="idun"]Ah powerdesal, that has made me smile. Unless you all live together, which you might, but I actually only know of one family that ended up with their daughter, husband and two kids living with them 'again', then this won't wash.

Both families wouldn't really need more than two small four seater cars. And if these cars were zero emmisions and 70mpg would it matter for the odd trip out that two were used?

And can one manage with one small four seater, well even when our kids were small, that is exactly what we had, got in all our stuff, the fold up cots and pushchair and sometimes, ski gear,  and we were very well travelled, always managed. I admit that we were the first people in the region, maybe most of France and Switzerland, to get a roof box, which was a good way of keeping the car small and having extra storage space during our big journeys.


[/quote]I suspect that in the real world  and driving on real roads there are no zero emission cars doing 70mpg especially if you take the emissions during the manufacturing process into account. I also suspect than many people driving small cars would rather be driving larger ones if they could afford it.

If we were really environment friendly we would not live in individual house but in apartment blocks with communal heating. However for me, and also for many other people, that is a step we do not wish to take if we can avoid it. 

[powerdesal]

No Idun, we don't all live together.

We did however have a 'people carrier', a Vauxhall Zafira with the capability of seating 7. It was diesel and quite frugal. During visits to us in France we could all go out together, rather than using both cars.

When not in 'people carrier' mode the Zaf was quite roomy for us and allowed the capability of getting 'up' into it rather than down into the seats. Mrs PD could get into a smaller, lower car but would have great difficulty getting out of same without assistance.

We are now even less 'PC' as we have a 4 x 4, how anti-social is that !!!!!!!!

[Théière]

[quote user="Rabbie"]

If we were really environment friendly we would not live in individual house but in apartment blocks with communal heating. However for me, and also for many other people, that is a step we do not wish to take if we can avoid it. 

[/quote]

Don't think so!  I wouldn't want to be burried in one of those, spend my working days in them and all their problems.  Communal heating service charge £53.00 per month and they want to put it up! so for 223 flats thats £11,819 of which the "engineers" turn up occasionally and may carry out some sevicing, repeat may, they usually turn up and sit down in the boiler room for 3-4 hours doing nothing.

Then they pay an inflated energy price for what they actually use on top of that.

That's before you mention the unsociable noise, etc. Nope just build more high spec housing with high levels of insulation and then the price of insulation will fall. I really believe that governments are trying to guide everyone into living in the "Hive" as I call them.  Good little worker bees for whom TV and Simon Cowell are their new messiah with ever dumbed down lives. Yuk!

[Rabbie]

[quote user="Théière"][quote user="Rabbie"]

If we were really environment friendly we would not live in individual house but in apartment blocks with communal heating. However for me, and also for many other people, that is a step we do not wish to take if we can avoid it. 

[/quote]

Don't think so!  I wouldn't want to be burried in one of those, spend my working days in them and all their problems.  Communal heating service charge £53.00 per month and they want to put it up! so for 223 flats thats £11,819 of which the "engineers" turn up occasionally and may carry out some sevicing, repeat may, they usually turn up and sit down in the boiler room for 3-4 hours doing nothing.

Then they pay an inflated energy price for what they actually use on top of that.

That's before you mention the unsociable noise, etc. Nope just build more high spec housing with high levels of insulation and then the price of insulation will fall. I really believe that governments are trying to guide everyone into living in the "Hive" as I call them.  Good little worker bees for whom TV and Simon Cowell are their new messiah with ever dumbed down lives. Yuk!

[/quote]I thought I made it clear I also thought it was a bad idea. My experience of communal heating comes from my time in Sweden when it was less expensive.

 

The does seem to be a lot of misinformation on green matters just now. I recently heard a BBC radio program which claimed that in terms of environmental impact plastic carrier bags were much less harmful than suggested. So often the manufacturing and transport impact is left out of the calculations 

[idun]

I don't get 'cars' full stop and the sort of love affair that people end up having with them.

Need reliable, economic, size for our needs, ie moving and needed a car, hadn't got one at the time, so we got a berlingo as we did a lot of moving stuff from house to house with it and now every week it gets filled with bricks and cement and wood etc etc and is basically a utility vehicule at the moment.

Next one will be small and very economic.

Now friends have bought a big spanking new car........ no idea what it is, only it was expensive. And when I asked 'why' they'd bought such a big car, he asked if I could imagine him in a smaller car! How I didn't laugh out loud I have no idea. No idea how he thinks people see him or is it just how I see him, because I don't believe anyone would ever look at him and think....... he's a big expensive car bloke. And if they did, who would want to be that person?

See I don't get this at all, maybe many people would want to be that person, but something inside me revolts against such ideas. Leaves me as cold as when I was young and young blokes would think that telling me that they had a sports car would impress me, no not for me.

[Tancrède]

[quote user="powerdesal"]Gengulphus wrote:- '' The 'People Carrier' has now deservedly come to the fore as a symbol of wasteful vulgarity. ''

Why ?????   

7 seats, allowed the whole family to go out in one car rather than using two, thus saving environmental pollution.[/quote]

That is an interesting point  -  but I don't think I have ever seen them used for families. 

The tight-faced female who usually drives one just behind me, and who looks like a slightly gone-over footballer's wife, (fur coat and no drawers type) is inevitably the sole occupant.

And is an Olympic standard tail-gater…

 

[Théière]

[quote user="Rabbie"]

The does seem to be a lot of misinformation on green matters just now. I recently heard a BBC radio program which claimed that in terms of environmental impact plastic carrier bags were much less harmful than suggested. So often the manufacturing and transport impact is left out of the calculations 

[/quote]

Yes you did make it clear, I was expressing my agreement with you.

Greenwash does abound these days, mainly through marketing departments spin.

Plastic bags are a great food source for whales and other sea animals

 http://www.realnews24.com/gray-whale-dies-bringing-us-a-message-with-stomach-full-of-plastic-trash/

[Rabbie]

I have never bought a new car and indeed my runaround at present is almost 15 years old and still going strong. Mrs R needs a decent car for her job as she has a lot of equipment and stuff to take round when she visits clients. Her car is younger because clients expect you to have a reasonably smart car. Perhaps a sad comment on present day society but there it is.

For me a car is a tool and not a status symbol but living in the country it is a necessity. When buying a secondhand car it is often more economic to buy a larger car as they often last better.

[dwmcn]

Racer,

We have a lot of cloth bags we bought in Germany, a lot of large heavyweight plastic Super U, Auchan, etc bags, and a large freezer bag we got free at Super U  for spending 50 euros. We have been using them in GB, France, and other European countries for years.

David