Bird Flu

[Ron Avery]

According to the experts , the flu is transmitted between birds by contact not by droppings that is why chickems etc are to be kept under cover, not necessarily  indoors though.

[The Riff-Raff Element]

Our mairie has destributed documantation entitled:

"Information à tous les éleveurs et détenteurs de volailles et oiseaux"

The high points are as follows:

- All birds must be confined. A buliding is preferable, but a netted run is acceptable PROVIDED that a "bâche" (I take this to mean a tarpaulin) is placed over top to prevent wild bird pooing through into the run;

- Food and water must be inaccessable to wild birds;

- Water used for washing out buildings and rearing equipment must NOT

be allowed to run away on the surface - it must go into a drain;

- If birds cannot be connot be constrained (and valid reason must be

presented as to why not), then feeding and watering must be done under

cover AND a monthly visit from a vet will be required. This relaxation

will not be applied in any of the 128 communes that have been declared "en zone humide." 

- Vaccination of ducks and geese  in  humid zones and

elsewhere will be considered an acceptable  alternative to

constraint, but only for commercial flocks of more than 100 birds.

 

[Cat]

You're right Jond, bâche is a tarpaulin.

Just seen that a number of dead turkeys have been found at a turkey farm in Ain, they are culling all surviving turkeys, but the test results will not be known until Friday.  If H5N1 is confirmed it will be the first case of the virus spreading to domestic farm birds in the EU.

http://today.reuters.com/news/newsArticle.aspx?type=worldNews&storyID=2006-02-23T155717Z_01_PAB002370_RTRUKOC_0_US-BIRDFLU-FRANCE-FARM.xml&archived=False

 

 

[Weedon]

[quote user="RayB"][quote user="Monika"]This ban has been in Switzerland since autumn 2005 but most people get over it by netting over the chicken/duck/geese "outside space", so they still can be outside which I think is so much better than locked indoors.[/quote]

Netting won't work.  Flu is transferred through droppings.


[/quote]

I'm alright then Ray...I hate chicken droppings, nuggets yes..whatever the part of a chicken they are.[*-)]

[RayB]

>>whatever the part of a chicken they are.<<

Chicken lips compressed into blobs, rolled in sawdust and boiled. 

It's the dip that makes the difference.  Happy eating!!

[Deimos]

I saw last night that the UK gov. were paying two medical

companies to develop human vaccines for the H5N1 virus i.e. not for the yet to

mutate human/human transmittable form (which seems the more dangerous risk).  Report was saying that whilst it might be a

waste of money, if the gov. did not do it they might be accused of inactivity.

At a time when people in the UK are being refused pretty

proven anti cancer drugs on the grounds of cost that the gov. will spend

millions on a potentially useless precautionary measure.  Not saying they should not develop the

vaccines, but if money is limited for treating ill people, who is deciding on

the priorities and balance and is “how the papers report it” the deciding

factor.

In addition to the breast cancer drug “issues”, last night I

also saw a somebody suffering brain cancer being refused a drug that could

significantly extend his life expectancy – on the basis of cost (the treatment

would cost £40000).

Ian

[andyh4]

Ian

how things are reported has always been a major influence on political action.  And polititians have always used this as a means of influencing/manipulating the masses.

 

Did you really think differently?

 

[Cat]

As the H5N1 virus has yet to mutate, surely it would not be possible to develop a vaccine against a mutated strain? 

This is about prevention, and not cure. If those at most risk (people routinely handling or slaughtering infected birds/poultry, or living in close proximity) are given a vaccine against the current strain, would this not help to prevent a possible mutation by lowering the number of available human "hosts" to H5N1?

It's not just the papers that are driving the priorities, the authorities here in France are taking this very seriosly too.  If anyone is on very friendly terms with their local maire, they might like to ask about the directives they have recently been given regarding available cemetary space and buildings suitable for use as temporary morgues (I don't think I'm supposed to be aware of this, but I am).  This is the first time in 35 years that they have recieved such directives, it seems to be rather more than simple scaremongering.

I'm usually the first to scoff at drummed up reporting of health scares, and ate my beef rare throughout the mad cow panic.  I'm still eating chicken and duck... but I am worried.

 

[Quillan]

Well this was bought up at our local council meeting last night of which I am a member (the token Englishman). We have recieved no such information neither have we recieved anything (yet) about keeping poultry indoors. Our mayor will be talking to the mayor of Quillan on Monday to see if he has anything, I might have a word with him at the rugby on Sunday so if I hear of anything I will let you know. Our local firemen don't know anything either. IF this is a rumour (and I am not saying it is or it is not) then it's a bit sick.

[Teamedup]

In spite of what the PM is saying and how well prepared France is supposed to be. I cannot but think that information has not reached paysanne level yet. AND that these great protection/security things that are being put in place are for the big cities and their banilieu rather than everywhere.

 

[RayB]

[quote user="Teamedup"]

In spite of what the PM is saying and how

well prepared France is supposed to be. I cannot but think that

information has not reached paysanne level yet. AND that these great

protection/security things that are being put in place are for the big

cities and their banilieu rather than everywhere.

 

[/quote]

God forbid that an individual would use their own common sense to protect their fowl without a government directive!  Sigh!

[Cat]

The maire of a local village told my french OH this a few days ago ( they are very good friends).  So unless he was joking (and that WOULD be sick) I think it is to be believed. It is not the kind of thing that they would make public, as it would serve no useful purpose to the general public and would only cause panic.

It may be that only maires in areas deemed to be at greatest risk have recieved this information so far. Here in the Lot we have literally hundreds of elevages of ducks and geese, due to the Perigordine canard and fois gras industries.

The part about buildings suitable to be used as temporary morgues is actually published on the internet, on the french government health site, and is part of their January 2006 plan should any flu type pandemic occur.

http://www.sante.gouv.fr/htm/dossiers/grippe_pandemie/reco_orga_soins.pdf

Given that the Spanish flu in 1918/19 wiped out around 40 million people (between 2.5 and 5% of the world population at the time) and Hong Kong flu killed around 750,000 people in 1968 (both mutations of a bird flu virus) it is only natural that a very serious view is being taken of the need to make these kind of provisions should the virus mutate.

 

 

[Teamedup]

God forbid that an individual would use their own common sense to protect their fowl without a government directive!  Sigh!

 

Well the ignoramuses in our village will need policing. They may keep poultry, but 'caring' for them, well there are several families who most certainly do not 'care' for their charges now, why would they if told to.

[Quillan]

Any one watch the program on Channel 4 tonight?

It would seem that there are around 175 people who have caught it so far and around 95 have died. It attacks young adults (whew that stops me from getting it) up to the mid 30's. It is virtually identical to the flue of 1918/1919 which killed over 50M people. What it has not done yet is to mutate in to a form that can move from human to human, you can only catch it from birds (cats can't pass it between cats either). If it does mutate it will take roughly 50 days to peak thoughout the population. To find out if it was the same as the 1918 flu they re-enginered it in laboratories in the US. Thats all I can remember thats of interest, the rest is all about how it works and the fact it's not the actual flu that kills you but your own antibodies.

Seeing how they have reproduced the 1918 flu in the US I wonder how long before the nutters get going "It was a US plot to attack China because they own all the US oil and half the industry as well. They made the flu and droped it out of toilet windows on jumbo  jets as they flew over China.". Well we al know it was the US that started the aids thing to kill of the communists. Sorry about that but we were talking about David Ike (ex footballer and theman that said the royal family were giant lizards from outer space on Wogan) and I just couldn't help myself.

[Dick Smith]

I saw a bit of that programme. I had thought that the 1918 'flu had been identified and wasn't anything to do with bird 'flu - but that was a few years back. Perhaps they need a handle for the programme, or the research budget.

And yes, you are right, I imagine the conspiracy theorists are at it already.

[The Riff-Raff Element]

[quote user="Dicksmith"]I saw a bit of that programme. I had thought

that the 1918 'flu had been identified and wasn't anything to do with

bird 'flu - but that was a few years back. Perhaps they need a handle

for the programme, or the research budget.

And yes, you are right, I imagine the conspiracy theorists are at it already.

[/quote]

Nope - you are right: the virus that caused the 1918/19 pandemic was a

strain now refered to as H1N1, not the H5N1 currently causing sweated

brows. H1N1 reappeared in the 1970's but didn't take hold again. The

microbes are different, but H1N1 almost certainly started life as a

bird 'flu. Most 'flu viruses do.

Labs in the US have not "recreated" the virus from 1918, but they have

been able to sequence it's genetic code from fragments recovered from

frozen victims of the 1918/19 affair. This is not the same as making

the virus, though it might give some clues as to what it was about that strain's protien coat that made it so infectious. That, in turn, might give some clues about how H5N1 might behave. It's all a bit speculative, but probably better than doing nothing.

[Iceni]

Notwithstanding government directives our area is paddling its own canoe.

A census is being undertaken to determine how many birds, of what type, where/how they are housed or not, are we registered with any organisation etc and when I returned my signed form to the mairie last week I was at the end of a long queue. In my fractured French I explained that my flock of 4 is fed and locked away at night but roam in an enclosed but uncovered space by day - seems to be the norm for households around here - and was assured that this is fine. My farmer neighbour - a big cheese in the local NFU - also confirmed this approach as ok. BTW we agreed that the only migratory species here is the English and everybody knows they only carry big wallets.

John

not