Some shops stop me using my visa card

[Georgina]

 I am posting this in general because I think it is of general importance. I have used my Nationwide visa card here for two years.  Recently the supermarket manager of Intermarche in town told me he could not accept the card anymore as the bank had started charging him about four euros per transaction.  I tried to use it in another Intermarche today only for the card to be refused twice.  This will really pee me off if it happens everywhere. Not only do we have to suffer the rate of exchange, now we won't be able to choose when to change money again.  I have used the card successfully in another store but I am worried this is going to become a regular thing now in France.  I think it will apply to all visa cards that are not French.

[Quillan]

Can I ask if you are resident in France or just have a holiday home here? If its the latter how many months of the year would you say you come over?

[Georgina]

I have been resident since 2003.  Why?

[Mr Coeur de Lion]

Why don't you get a French bank account and transfer larger amounts of money from your UK bank? Problem solved.

[Quillan]

I was thinking why not use TAPS (Transcontinental Automated Payment Service) from RBS to move a fixed monthly sum to France then use a French bank card. You get the market rate and it costs very little (fixed charge) for the transaction, much less than a normal transfer charge. I think, but I am not sure, that the Halifax offer a free service if its transfered to one of their own banks or associated bank abroad. Might be worth a bit of investigating perhaps. Hope thats a helpful.

[Clarkkent]

I find this rather strange. I have looked at the Wikipedia entry for VISA and found the following:

 

1 With respect to VISA credit cards

 

Costs to merchants

Merchants are charged many fees for the privilege of accepting credit cards. The merchant may be charged a discount rate of 1%-3%+ of each transaction obtained through a credit card. Usually, the merchant will also pay a flat per-item charge, called an interchange rate, for each transaction. Thus in some instances of very low value transactions, use of credit cards may actually cause the merchant to lose money on the transaction. Merchants must accept these transactions as part of their costs to retain the privilege of accepting credit card transactions. Merchants with very low average transaction prices or very high average transaction prices are more averse to accepting credit cards. But rates are often reduced in an attempt to include more of these types of merchants.

 

2 With respect to VISA debit cards in France

 

Many smaller merchants in France refuse to accept debit cards for transactions under €15 (equivalent to 100 French Francs) because of the minimum fee charged by merchants' banks per transaction. Merchants in France do not differentiate between debit and credit cards, and so both have equal acceptance. However, Visa's and MasterCard's regulations prohibit merchants from setting minimum charge amounts. American Express's policy is to discourage any merchant practices that create a "barrier to acceptance" and setting minimum charge limits is such a barrier. Amex does prohibit "discrimination" against the Amex card, which means they cannot have minimum charge for Amex but not for Visa and MasterCard but they cannot have a minimum charge for Visa and MasterCard because Visa and MasterCard prohibit this.

 

I suspect this may have more to do with a particular company’s response to difficult trading conditions. It does, however, reflect once again the apparent difficulty some elements of French service industries have with the concept “customer”.

[virginia.c]

A few weeks ago, I posted that both my mastercards were being refused in various outlets. There was no consistency in that I could successfully pay for petrol one minute, only to be refused moments later in a nearby shop. I had to reactivate an old barclaycard and, so far, have had no problems, although I don't use it very often. Barclaycard is Visa of course. I do wonder what the real reason is for these current problems when trying to pay by credit card. I have never had a problem with any credit card in Europe until this year in France.

[Pickles]

[quote user="Georgina"] I am posting this in general because I think it is of general importance. I have used my Nationwide visa card here for two years.  Recently the supermarket manager of Intermarche in town told me he could not accept the card anymore as the bank had started charging him about four euros per transaction.  I tried to use it in another Intermarche today only for the card to be refused twice.  This will really pee me off if it happens everywhere. Not only do we have to suffer the rate of exchange, now we won't be able to choose when to change money again.  I have used the card successfully in another store but I am worried this is going to become a regular thing now in France.  I think it will apply to all visa cards that are not French.[/quote]

We frequently use a non-French Visa credit card (occasionally Nationwide, though rarely and not recently) and a non-French Maestro card, and haven't had problems with either. Were the amounts small? Was it the Nationwide Visa credit or Visa debit card? With regards to getting a French card, for us at least, having managed to get our French bank charges down to 12€ pa, we don't feel inclined to bump them back up by acquiring a French Visa card.

Regards

Pickles

[Pickles]

[quote user="virginia.c"]A few weeks ago, I posted that both my mastercards were being refused in various outlets. There was no consistency in that I could successfully pay for petrol one minute, only to be refused moments later in a nearby shop. I had to reactivate an old barclaycard and, so far, have had no problems, although I don't use it very often. Barclaycard is Visa of course. I do wonder what the real reason is for these current problems when trying to pay by credit card. I have never had a problem with any credit card in Europe until this year in France.[/quote]

From what I have read, this COULD be down to the type of terminal in use: those that are permanently on-line may be able to authenticate the card immediately, whereas others which are not may be set up simply to reject those "foreign" cards requiring authentication.

Regards

Pickles

[Georgina]

The point I am trying to get across here, is that the rules appear to have changed.  Intermarche is not a small supermarket chain.  It is a large one and both have refused my debit visa card recently on amounts over E15.  I have been using my card without problem for two years simply because changing money and paying it into a french bank account equals big losses when the rate is down. Nationwide card is a debit card which I have used in all other shops until this week since 2006.  So, has anyone else had this problem.  The Intermarche is town is a tourist supermarket, so I really think someone has got their wires crossed.  If Visa does not allow them to charge extra fees, then I need to get my facts right before approaching the manager.  I too have never had a problem before.

[Quillan]

The only thing that I can think off is that the reason given was just a smokescreen. I say this because I have heard and I must stress this is second or may be even third hand that some people are refusing UK cards because of recent bank problems and that whilst the electronic machines are supposed to tell them straight away if the card is OK and there are funds they don't trust them. I have again heard that in Spain (from my brother-in-law who lives there) people are having their passport photocopied at worse or just the number taken when they use a UK card. I have to stress that this is hearsay. I have several UK cards but I hardly ever use them, the last time I did was 6 months ago to buy a washing machine online in France and there was no problem. I can imagine having your card refused when you know everything is OK (and I bet there were loads of people in the queue behind you, its sods law) is not only aggravating but very embarrassing.

[Georgina]

Thanks Quillan, you could be right there. No I was not embarrassed but felt that he was not lying to me because I had a long conversation with him about it and he assured me that the bank charged him extra for the transaction.  Actually dealing with French banks myself, that would not surprise.  But for big shops to refuse Visa cards, I find it hard to accept as visa is known all over the world.

[just john]

I have been using my UK Nationwide credit card en France for the last month (especially in Intermarche and Bricomarche for fuel, food and building materials,) with only one problem, when attempting to pay a deposit on a hire care; after calling the number on the back of the card it was explained that there were occasional credit checks but since I had called the transaction would complete. Have you tried calling Nationwide?

[Scooby]

I have had this happen before because the card is 'foreign'.  I just put it down to French lack of understanding of credit cards / protectionism and use my carte bleu.  Failing that you could always walk away and leave them to put all the groceries back.  There must be at least 4 euros worth of labour charges to do that...

[Chancer]

Other than initial problems with merchants guarding the terminal as if it were gold and it timing out while they ponder over the choisir langue message I have never had a problem, I use my Nationwide card for pretty much all of my purchases except for bread, in intermarché and all the other suypermarkets large or small.

In my intermarché it is the customer that puts his card in the machine so how would they know that it is a foreign card?

Even most of the petrol stations now accept UK cards and the machines will even talk to you in English should you require, acceptance of foreign cards is increasing not decreasing.

It is a Visa card first and foremost, the Visa clearing system is pan european.

Perhaps the "its because the card is foreign" comments result from the mentality of the cashier, the terminals seem to reject just as many French cards especially at busy times.

I remember a charming slapper at the Tesco photo/fag/lottery ticket counter once telling me "its because you aint got no money in your account" when the transaction failed the first time with my then French visa card. My questioning of her double negative wasnt really appreciated.

[Scooby]

But I have had my Nationwide visa credit refused a few times - when I know we have available credit of >£5k.  On a couple of occasions the girl at the checkout has said it was because the card wasn't French.  The refusal has never been an issue because we have always been able to use our carte blue - but if it was we would resort to plan B...

[WendyG]

Hi all

Whilst purchasing a couple of items in a book shop in Spain recently, 35Es, I produced my British Visa card and was promptly asked for my passport!

I used the same card throughout Spain in hotels without any problem.

I too always carry a carte bleu just in case.

 

WendyG

[Quillan]

So it appears its not hearsay then. I wonder if this is starting to happen in France but a bit more slyly?

[andyh4]

[quote user="Quillan"]. I have again heard that in Spain (from my brother-in-law who lives there) people are having their passport photocopied at worse or just the number taken when they use a UK card..[/quote]

 

This has been happening to me at various locations and occasions for the last 14 years using a German card in France (mainly) and other countries (including Spain), so I see nothing strange or sinister in it - nor ideed anything to do with being anti-British or the credit crisis.  It is simply a way for a company to track down an individual in the event of the transaction not being honoured - at least they think it is - because of course, unlike many countries, the UK does not keep official tabs on where its citizens live - beyond an electoral register.  Many a chashier has struggled to find my town of residence on the passport.  Of course it is not there.

[nomoss]

I was told by a friend with a restaurant in Spain that there are a lot of stolen and counterfeit cards around. He says he has been refused payment by the bank for many card transactions in the past because of this, they said the signature on the chit didn't match that on the card. He now checks the name on cards against a passport or other ID as well as the signature.

 

 

[MrCanary]

This thread is now causing me to telephone my bank, HSBC, before I set off for France on Sunday...

I will report back!

[MrCanary]

HSBC have told me they have had no reported problems from France. However, they do often make security checks on the use of their customers cards in France (or other countries) when they have not been notified of travel plans.

HSBC also said they are aware that Nationwide have been updating their systems over the last week - as all banks do from time to time. This can sometimes (but rarely) cause problems for customers both in the UK and abroad.

[velcorin]

I worked in Barcelona for a few years. Any purchases by credit/debit card ALWAYS required your ID card (DNI for us), before we got our DNIs it was a passeport. Maybe Las Costas Ingles are implementing what is standard in the rest of Spain?

I've had Spanish, German, UK and French cards refused on a regular basis, don't take it personally[:)]

My staff have the misfortune to have to deal with company card payments for very large transactions. Historically Visa and Mastercard have had massive problems with card fraud in France, on 2 occasions in the last 20 years they have withdrawn use of their cards in France. Chip and pin was bought in 20 years ago as one security effort, recently transactions over EUR1000 require 24 hour clearance. I'll never get a straight answer from our bank, but I would guess there is another card security scare, and the terminals are timing out waiting for extended payment authorisation. This isn't something you would come across in Germany or the UK, as the fraud levels are relatively low, therefore the card issuers are content to waive extended authorisation. For some reason the French financial system always keeps schtum when something bad happens, unlike in Germany where it's all over the media.

[ernie]

Down to 12 € !!!  May I ask how you did that please ?

Thnaks from ernie

 

[Pickles]

[quote user="ernie"]Down to 12 € !!!  May I ask how you did that please ?[/quote]

I think the above comment is aimed at me. The main cost saving is that we don't have any French cards - not even an ATM/cashcard. We just have a cheque book and withdraw money over the counter of the account-holding branch. Bills etc are paid either via online banking or direct debit. Money generally goes in electronically. We DO have other, non-French cards including Euro-denominated accounts.

regards

Pickles