URGENT APPEAL: Boy missing in France

[Rachel Johnston]

If anyone is in France at the moment, please take note of the following appeal:

Hants Police are desperately appealing for help in finding a very sick boy who has been taken to France by his parents - they took a ferry to Cherbourg last night (Thursday 28 Aug).

The story is currently top of all news bulletins because if they do not find the boy, called Ashya King, very soon he is likely to die.

The police want people to be on the look out for their grey Hyundai, registration KP60 HWK.

The full appeal can be found here: http://www.hampshire.police.uk/internet/news-and-appeals/2014/august/operation-aquilion-ashya-king-missing-boy

Thank you for your cooperation.

[NickP]

Why is he "missing" he is with his family? I think there is more to this storey than is being reported.

[PaulT]

Perhaps the 'more to the story' Nick is that he needs medication

[Benjamin]

I believe he has a serious brain tumour and his parents took him from hospital against specialist medical advice.

Without treatment he is expected to die.

[woolybanana]

There is reputed to be a Jehovah's Witness involvement too.

What the parents are thinking of I just dunno, seems mad.

[NickP]

What ever you say he is not missing, he is with his family, maybe they were told that he has not long to live and they want him to be in the family environment rather than a hospital ward. Is that such a bad thing?

[Rabbie]

[quote user="Benjamin"]I believe he has a serious brain tumour and his parents took him from hospital against specialist medical advice.

Without treatment he is expected to die.



[/quote]I suspect that he will not live long whether he gets treatment or not. The prognosis for tumours in children is not good. Reading the BBC report it seems the parents are only committing an offence if there is a court order forbidding the removal otherwise they have the right to do so

[PaulT]

He receives food and liquids via a battery powered device and the batteries will now probably be flat so he will no longer be receiving nourishment, effectively, starving and dehydrating - in Nicks words, is that such a bad thing?

[mint]

They have found him and he is alive.

But I still don't agree with how this family have been hounded by police and the media ............... as though they didn't have enough stress and anxiety already[:'(]

[mint]

I have now seen the boy with his father on a video in theTelegraph (sorry, can't do links) in which the father has explained very well why they took the action to remove his son from hospital and what treatment he wants him to have.

I can't get any more disgusted with those who took the decision to pursue this family and I feel so very sad that they have now taken the boy to hospital and arrested his parents to be questioned.  If you saw that child with his dad, you'd know it's the cruellest thing to do to separate him from his family however temporarily. 

[woolybanana]

This story gets nastier and nastier. It seems the hospital is determined to impose their own version of treatment and deny the right of the parents to seek alternatives. What the Spanish court makes of it remains to be seen.

As of now, the parents cannot even see the child who is effectively being kept a prisoner in a hospital whilst receiving treatment.

I am afraid that this one will run and run until the child dies and then the parents will be prosecuted unfairly.

[mint]

Yes and nice, easy targets for the police;  certainly a lot safer than chasing after jihadists and violent murderers.

Nice one too for those statistics they keep for crime-solving [6]

[woolybanana]

What is very disturbing too is that there seems to have been a threat to use the Court of Protection to stop the parents seeking alternative treatments which had apparently been denied by the hospital.

[Rabbie]

This seems to be yet another example of politician double speak. Saying they are opposed to the "nanny state" but interfering at every available opportunity.

These people seem to be responsible parents judging by their other children and I see no evidence to suggest they are acting in any way contrary to what they perceive to being the best interests of their child.

Given the British record in child protection cases at the moment i do nit have much confidence in Social Services ability to do the best for the child.

[Russethouse]

Haven't the parents left to try and get the drug Southampton have refused ?

I have mixed feelings about this, a past poster here used to sing the praises of Southampton hospital esp regarding children. It may be that they genuinely feel the drug would just prolong the child's suffering and be to no avail - but as a parent I know that anyone would go to the ends of the earth if there was even the slimmest hope.

Whatever, no good will come of separating the child from his parents in what may be his last days...very sad.

 

 

 

[mint]

I agree with you wholeheartedly about no good coming of separating the child from his parents.

I understand that the parents are still in custody and that they will be in court in Malaga tomorrow morning.

Can you imagine what agony the parents must be going through because it seems that, until now, the parents have been with the boy all through his hospital stay in Southampton.

And what about that eldest boy (22 or 23) being alone in some hotel looking after his other 5 siblings, one of whom is only 2 years old.

Regardless of the rights or wrongs and who is telling the truth and who is to blame, this is totally cruel and heartless.  Let the parents be with the child, even if they want to post police at the ward doors.

Dreadful to deprive such an ill child of the comfort and security of his parents' presence.  I can't help but think of the ordeal of this family all day long.  How can this be allowed to happen in our so-called civilised society in these supposedly enlightened times?

[Russethouse]

Apparently the family own property in Spain so it may be the other children are there......who knows ? What a mess !

[Clark Kent II]

Indeed it is a mess. But what should the hospital staff have done when they realised a child in their care was missing? Shrug their shoulders and be pleased that another bed was suddenly free?

The decision of apply for a European Arrest Warrant would have been taken a high level, probably within the Home Office.

We are getting rather sentimental about this - the child is with his family and so on - but do we know that this is best for the child? When it comes to his welfare, his rights are more important than his parents' rights. His condition is serious and has been assessed by an appropriately qualified clinician and appropriate treatment prescribed. His father wants him to receive an alternative treatment which is not available in the UK (but suitable patients may be sent abroad to receive it) - we don't know what advice the father has been given.

The hospital - reasonably - believed that the child's life was in immediate danger. It had no alternative. What would you have done?

[Clark Kent II]

Indeed it is a mess.

But what should the hospital staff have done when they realised a child in their care was missing? Shrug their shoulders and be pleased that another bed was suddenly free?

The decision of apply for a European Arrest Warrant would have been taken a high level, probably within the Home Office.

We are getting rather sentimental about this - the child is with his family and so on. But do we know that this is best for the child? When it comes to his welfare, his rights are more important than his parents' rights. His condition is serious and has been assessed by an appropriately qualified clinician and appropriate treatment prescribed. His father wants him to receive an alternative treatment which is not available in the UK (but suitable patients may be sent abroad to receive it) - we don't know what advice the father has been given.

The hospital - reasonably - believed that the child's life was in immediate danger. It had no alternative. What would you have done?

[NickP]

While you can appreciate the hospitals concern that the child has gone missing, I think that the British police's reaction is completely over the top. Putting the father in handcuffs? separating the mother from her children, the Spanish police's reaction is beyond comprehension. Some body needs a kick up the backside and it's not the family, who as has been said; have not done anything illegal. [:@]

[Clark Kent II]

The family may not have done anything illegal (this is a presumption we are making) but they have been very foolish.

[mint]

[quote user="Clark Kent II"]The family may not have done anything illegal (this is a presumption we are making) but they have been very foolish.[/quote]

So nowadays we charge people for being "foolish"?[:-))]

And, in response to your earlier post, CK, it's not about "sentimentality".

It's about using commonsense, discretion, judgement and according human beings dignity and compassion.

Did you hear the statement given by the Assistant Whatever-his-title-is, justifying the police action?  Yes, right, sounds like an intelligent, professional officer, doesn't he?

I think not; sounds exactly like an ignorant, jobsworth with a total inability to see other than just to the end of his own nose.  I'd say he sounds like a donkey (a favourite expression chez nous) except I wouldn't insult donkeys in this instance because, by all accounts, they are intelligent and sociable animals.

[Rabbie]

[quote user="Clark Kent II"]The family may not have done anything illegal (this is a presumption we are making) but they have been very foolish.[/quote]

NickP, Mint I agree with your posts.

Clark Kent  Under UK law a parent has the right to remove their child from hospital unless under special circumstances there is a court order forbidding this. No allegation that there was a court order in this case has emerged and I am sure it would have done, if only to justify the police action.

The parents clearly think they are acting in the child's best interests by moving him to get a treatment not currently available in the UK. IMO the whole case is being condeucted with a regrettable lack of sympathy and disregard for the child's emotional needs. It is clear that the parents may have been over-zealous but they appear to have been acting from the best motives.

[woolybanana]

As I understand this, the parents were effectively seeking a treatment that was denied them, whether on grounds of utility or cost we do not know and will probably never be allowed to know.

That they might have tried to give the child a break whilst they gathered money for the next phase has not been considered.

The hospital clearly tried to act in the best interests of the child in the situation as they saw it. They seem never to have forbidden the parents from taking the child though it seems they did get heavy handed when the treatment was queried.

Ideally the hospital should have given the parents some spare batteries, some medication and a lot of advice, then wished them well, as it seems they could do no more for the child.

Let me tell you a true story. Many years ago I was involved with the treatment of a child who had very bad leukaemia. The medical staff were perfect but the nonmedical staff were intrusive and a damn nuisance, demanding that we quit our jobs and forcing themselves into our flat to see if it was suitable. We told them to rugger off.

We queried the treatment with the chief medic on the grounds that total body irradiation (part of the protocol after nasty doses of chemotherapy) would damage the child physically and mentally and we did not want that, nor did she.

The specialist came back in 48 hours as agreed and said yes, I think we can do this. Ultimately, success, healthy child, now 25ish years on and, uniquely, she has two kiids which would have been impossible naturally had the standard protocol been followed.

Had the doc not agreed, I cant think what would have happened because we were as determined as these parents that we wanted a whole child at the end of the process. Which may sound shocking, but having seen the results of chemo after chemo after chemo in other kids , I dont believe that a kid can ever be healthy or happy, and the burden of knowing what might have been is a heavy one for both parents and children to bear.

This case has turned to tragedy for the whole family and will mark their lives, but there for the grace of Bobo go I, as under those circumstances, I might well have done exactly the same thing.

[nomoss]

I didn't think this kind of thing happened in the UK. Somehow it reminds me of an event in a "less well developed" country.

Several years ago a colleage in Iran had his hand crushed in an accident and was taken to a local hospital in the south of that country.

After some time the hospital had badly set the hand, which was by then badly deformed and immobile, and decided they would have to amputate it.

His company tried to get him an emergency exit visa to be sent to the US for treatment (normally an exit visa took a considerable time to obtain), but this was refused on the grounds that the hospital was perfectly capable of treating him correctly.

Fortunately for him, his company was able to bribe enough officials to get him out of the hospital, and flew him out of the country in their light aircraft from a small airstrip.

He told me the whole tale when I next saw him. Apparently the company had to pay a considerable fine (or more likely, some more informal emolument) for their actions, but his hand was saved, even though the surgeons in the US had to break all the bones again before setting them.