New project Guitar

[Dick Smith]

I've ordered a can of clear lacquer from Steve in Manchester, I'll just spray (and sand - a few coats I suspect) and tell you how I get on. I can't lay hands on flour paper at the moment - Melvyn has let me down!

[Gastines]

A pal of mine in Bournemouth has just made one,;a guitar; in clear perspex for a window display at Harrods. It apparently took him a week to do it. I was hoping it would be "available" but the artist who did the rest of the window display has collared it. As an add on ,in the days when I used to specialise in Bad Taste Items, mostly for the Arab market,we made a large pedestal desk in red perspex with gold plated fittings and diode lights. We also used to do a radio in a clear perspex pyramid, so all the works were showing + flashing diodes. I've grown up a bit since then but it was quite fun at the time.

Regards.

[Will]

Perspex guitar? They have them at one of our local music shops http://www.hobgoblin.com/local/bigpic.php?ID=GR5524A.

There was also the Ampeg/Dan Armstrong solid acrylic guitar from the 70s, http://www.guitarplayer.com/story.asp?storyCode=4364, said to have the 'densest' sound ever.

[Dick Smith]

I've got most of the yacht varnish off by sanding and scraping - anyone need a litre of the stuff? I've got some spare - just waiting for it to harden before sanding off the last of it. I've had some advice which is to use a couple of coats of sanding sealer and then spray with nitrocellulose (several coats), cut back with extreme wet and dry (wet) and then buff. Not sure if this means with wax, but I'll whack some Turtle over it and polish my lickle heart out. I think I'll swap out all of the fittings to black, for contrast. Then call in a friendly guitar tech.

Then a Candy Apple Red Strat?

[ali-cat]

Hi all.  Alicat's OH here.

Not a kit story but a refinish.  When I bought a Japanese Squier Strat in the late 80s it was fire engine red.  Very Hank Marvin.  Unfortunately Hank isn't my cup of tea and I HATED the colour.  Spent several weeks grinding,  nitromorsing and sanding the tough polyester finish off until it was down to the bare wood,  fine sanded the body and then sprayed it with a few coats of artist's acrylic fixative spray - available from any art shop.  Twenty years later the acrylic finish is still there despite the fact that this was my only guitar for ten years or so.  Another option if you like to see the wood is an oiled finish - very easy to apply.

http://i42.photobucket.com/albums/e332/Livingstone_Mark/AlfaSquier006.jpg

Sorry about the yacht varnish episode Dick.  Unfortunately nitro can also be tricky as it requires a few weeks to cure and tends to be a fragile finish thereafter - easily damaged by contact with chemicals, plastics, rubber etc. Alicat had to makes this fetching denim stand cover for me to protect another one of my toys.

http://i42.photobucket.com/albums/e332/Livingstone_Mark/DSC00003-1.jpg

PS - If anyone fancies revisiting their youth for little outlay but doesn't fancy the kit route - these are apparently the bees knees - even according to vintage Fender owners (I'd quite like one myself but I've run out of wall and floor space).

http://www.dolphinmusic.co.uk/page/shop/flypage/product_id/10477/a/r/e/base

Keep on strumming! [:D]

Mr Cat.

 

 

 

 

[Dick Smith]

Hi Ali, Mark.

From what I've read, nitrocellulose is the way to go, as apart from looking so very good it improves the tone - and having seen what the yacht varnish did, I would believe it. It would be like playing an instrument coated in rubber. No way to promote sustain!

Apparently nitrocellulose does harden out (usable in a week, fully hardened in 30 days, totally hardened in a few years) but I've not heard of any problems with it coming in contact with plastics - after all, a lot of guitar fittings are plastic.

For an oiled finish (mellow tone?) I'd have to chemically strip off a couple of layers of sanding sealer, which I don't want to do. I am reserving my opinions on a honey 'burst finish at a later date.

Then the CAR Strat (s)...

[f1steveuk]

At this rate every kit produced will end up in France.

I have heard that quite a few builders rub the sanding sealer off regardless, but they have also said, it is bl@@y hard work! Boreing though it sounds I think I am going the sea foam blue route, or black with a polished ali' pickguard, but I'm sure once I am standing in front of the paint rack I'll see something else and go for that! Number one son heard I was doing mine as a single pick up Esquire, and has already asked for it when finished. YEAH RIGHT, he's had three guitars out of me each time I have finished them.

I have also been told by Paul at Music King, there is a Thinline Tele (semi acoustic version) a 335 semi acoustic and  a SG coming soon!

No one doing red white and blue then????!!![+o(]

[Dick Smith]

On a woodworking forum I hang out at there is a term for the collection of many planes and other tools - 'the slope'.

I reckon we're on it...

I've always wanted a Thinline - blonde of course - with black pickguard.  And an SG in dark red. And a green Tele.

You're right about the sanding sealer - even worse when there's a coat or two of gloop over it, as I have now. Did your blokes just slap the nitro over bare wood?

[Will]

I ordered my PB today. But it will be a while before I fnish it, it's more a medium-to-long term job. I fancy fitting a Seymour Duncan pickup and a decent bridge like a Badass, and maybe better tuners too (will have to see what those supplied are like).

Those new ones sound very tempting. I always liked the look of the hollow bodied Teles, particularly in white. The 335 sounds like a very interesting project, particularly if it is solid wood rather than laminated. An SG would be a must. My first electric 6-string was an Avon SG - I noticed that the guy behind the site recommended by Steve (lots of useful info*) said he started with an Avon LP. My old Avon SG played beautifully, but was let down by a dead-sounding plywood body (not a lot you can do with that) and rubbish electrics. The SG, with a reasonable solid wood body and decent pickups, would be a great follow-up to the PB. My old one was dark red (aren't they all?) but I am thinking in terms of a walnut-type lacquer.

*the info includes quite a lot about applying nitro-cellulose.

[Dick Smith]

I must recommend the Manchester Guitar Tech. I ordered some nitrocellulose on Thursday and it arrived today.

Whoooh!

[Dick Smith]

Update - I've sprayed 2 coats on the body, and it looks too light and anaemic. Also shows flaws - look like dirty marks, but no idea where they have come from. Have ordered tinted clear lacquer to beef it up a bit. If that doesn't work, honeyburst (but cost of lacquer will have equalled cost of guitar kit!)

[ali-cat]

Hi Dick

If you haven't already done so there are many forums (fora?) on the web dealing with instrument construction and finishing including applying nitro.  From the little I've read I'd be careful as it's apparently pretty toxic stuff.  Apparently also Tung oil can be applied over a stain so you're not stuck with a natural finish if you use it.  Hope it works out.

PS - It's a slippery slope indeed. Ali now very much regrets pointing this thread out to me (a 335? [Www])

http://i42.photobucket.com/albums/e332/Livingstone_Mark/DSC00037.jpg

 

[Dick Smith]

That's pretty nice.

Did I mention that I can't actually play guitar?

Well, a bit of folksy stuff, but a bad wrist for a few years mean that I haven't done anything for ages. Looking forward to practicing in retirement.

[ali-cat]

Did I mention that I can't actually play either - at least that what Ali says.[:D]

Joking aside after 20 odd years of 'self-taught' playing I've started going back to scratch and trying to learn some theory.  Never to late to learn and the Fender Forum (Chop Shop) is ideal for this.  Playing is a nice hobby.  Good for manual dexterity and mental agility - bad for the eardrums.

Cheers

Mark

 

 

[ali-cat]

Or - just hang your new Les Paul on the wall,  relax and pour a nice glass of wine or cold beer and play this instead :

http://www.desktopblues.lichtlabor.ch/

 

[f1steveuk]

Bottle neck has to be the way forward then, because to get the bottle necks, you have to empty the bottles!!!!

A room with all those guitars, that's what I call a lounge!! Maybe needs just one or two more...

Back home in Belves, lid still taped on the box, for now!

[Dick Smith]

Further update: painting finished - in the end I used clear nitrocellulose, didn't like it, gave it several coats of tinted clear, which leave sit blonde but interesting. Polished with Martin guitar polish and Golden Neck Oil, bought a set of better strings.

Major construction work is done, a few snags but nothing serious. One neck screw hasn't 'bitten' properly, so I will take the neck off and pack the hole out for a better grip. Some small screw holes slightly inaccurately drilled, but nothing serious, the fingerplate needs a little trimming (ditto), one of the tailpiece pegs is a very tight fit, may need a Birmingham Screwdriver. Apart from that, just needs the electrics finished, a little soldering to do, and then awaiting a friendly guitar tech to come and string it and set it up.

Two gripes - the jack socket plug is the wrong type (!) and there are no strap buttons - both easily sorted, but a bit annoying.

Photos follow.

[f1steveuk]

Funny there were no strap buttons in mine either!! Maybe that's where they save all that money!!

I knew from experience that the Tele had the wrong jack plate, so I sourced the right type, Ebay is a marvelous thing!! I was all set to get going, and the old B&D workmate broke (it has had a very hard life!) so I'm not going to cut the headstock until I can hold the neck properly, espcially as my jigsaw has a habit of undercutting. I'm currently looking around at materials to make a custom pickguard from. Weldom have some sheet machine plate which may work!!

[Dick Smith]

That sounds just a bit industrial...

Birthday yesterday, and No 1 son gave me a Roland Cube practice amp. He still denies taking my old amp. The Roland is an excellent little thing, so I've been playing (around) with effects and having great fun. Cheap enough to have one in England and one in France - but he suggested that because he wants to play when he goes out himself... even has a tuning fork included. Well recommended. [:)]

[f1steveuk]

Still limping, still can't get into my garage, lid still on the box, go back to UK for three weeks Saturday. Fed up? YEP

[Gluestick]

[quote user="Dick Smith"] painting finished - ......................................, and then awaiting a friendly guitar tech to come and string it and set it up.

[/quote]

Just a basic tip, Dick. If building or re-building any electric solid or semi-accoustic guitar (unless it is a quick refinish job), always but always leave finishing the neck until after someone has completed the set up.

The reason for this is that the frets are always set into the fingerboard in their precise mathematical (i.e. tuning) position, but not for their optimal string stopping height.

Setting up the fingerboard is done by stringing the instrument to proper pitch (thus ensuring that the neck is pulled into its tension position), adjusting the truss rod to correct neck tension (bearing in mind that different players use widely different string gauges) and then finally carefully filing each fret, string by string, to create the best "Stop" that is free from fret buzz, that the precision and quality of the neck can allow.

With cheaper instruments and most kits, it is necessary to carefully clean up the neck slot in the body, to ensure that the neck sits in its optimal position.

Setting up via the individual bridge screws is a  final tweak, not the correct way to approach the problem. All this tends to do is raise the string from the fingerboard along its whole length making it harder to stop the string and much harder to play!

As for finishing, I re-finished a number of original gig-battered Strats in the 60s and always used multiple costs of clear Polyurethane lacquer for the neck and automotive cellulose paint for the bodies; multiple coats, rubbed down with wet and dry inter-coat and finally compounded with automotive Farecla compound (up to three grades!) finishing with Brasso! These days you can use T Cut.

It is possible to use wet and dry for cutting the raw paint finish, rather than the coarsest grade of compound (600-800 grit) but this does tend to leave minute lines.

In any case, if inter-coat flatting leave the paint for 48 hours to really harden off.

Leave the paint for at least one week and ideally two, before compounding.

Automotive paint is excellent 'cos they already have thousands of colours! The one we used to use to match Fender red was a Roots Motors colour. Boy, that shows you how long ago it was!

BTW, my very early 70s Japanese re-issue Strat, to me, is indistinguishable to my original early 60s American maple necked/rose wood fingerboard Strat to play and in sound. (Wish I still had the original!).

A chum of mine builds handmade concert flatop accoustics and is building a name amongst concert guitarists. he also restores guitars and builds clones using some of the suppliers below.

He also plays a mean rock riff!

Didn't realise that there were so many old rockers on this forum! [:D]

And one lives only a village away from us when we are in France....................................[6]

http://www.luthierssupplies.co.uk/

http://ukmg.altrion.org/faq.html

http://www.kevinchilcott-luthier.co.uk/private/links.htm

http://www.wdmusic.co.uk/pages/about.php

http://www.wdmusic.com/

http://www.stringsdirect.co.uk/

 

[f1steveuk]

I have cut the plug for the bridge pick up, because none of the books I have looked at tell me if the Esquire had a cavity for the bridge pick up or not, so I am going to assume not, and glue the plug in, and sand smooth. I also ahve to get my head around the wiring for the Esquire, as the selector switch alters the tone settings. I wont be painting it for a while, shame[:(]

[Gluestick]

One of my guitar reference books has a number of original circuits, Telecaster, Strat, LP Gibson. If this is any help let me know and I could scan and email to you.[:)]

 

[f1steveuk]

Cheers. I managed to get an Esquire wiring diagram, now when we go back to the UK I need to get some capacitors, and find my soldering iron! I have now read about 15 books about Telecasters, and not one knows if there was a unused void for the bridge pick up, or if it was put in when Leo decided to sell it as the two pick up Broadcaster.

As there seems to be a bit knowledge reading this, than I have, would I get a change in sound if I plug the void with a more dense wood?

[Gluestick]

The original Telecaster was always two pickups: the bridge, or "Riff" pickup and the neck or" Harmony" pickup.

Here's a pic of Townshend and one of his 1952 originals:

 http://www.thewho.net/whotabs/equip-52telecaster.htm

Please forgive me if I am already telling you what you already know (Grannies/Eggs!).

The standard guitar pickup is simply a series of coils of copper wire surrounding a magnet or magnets. Whilst its primary purpose is to pick up the minute EMF (Electro Motive Force: Faraday's Principle) generated by the strings - conductors - cutting the magnetic field, all such pick ups also have a microphonic effect and pick up complimentary vibrations through the body of the instrument.

That's why the sound of a solid is totally different to an accoustic or semi-accoustic.

Purists maintain that differing tonalities are achieved by using differing wood for the body.

Undoubtedly, the wood used for flat top concert guitars and Spanish Flamenco guitars if critical. Spanish makers demand spruce or some pine (for the top and thus the sounding board), and stoutly maintain it takes a few years of playing to become more resonant!

However, I did have access to a guy's PhD thesis a few years ago which was focused on the guitar and resonance, harmonics etc. He was a lecturer at (Swansea?) and was also a guitar nut. he used a lab with an anachoic chamber and etc, spectrum analysers, frequency analysers etc and ran an intensive series of tests, all aimed at reaching some serious conclusion about guitar design.

I believe the bottom line for you is that if you left the bridge pickup void and simply covered it with a scratch plate you or indeed anyone, honestly, would be hard put to detect any difference in tone!

Personally, I would fit the bridge pick up, 'cos it will be hard to obtain the harsh sound essential for riffs from the higher pick up.

Tone controls: be careful with creating tone control from passives (i.e. capacitors and resistors) as you actually drastically reduce the frequency response doing it this way. It was conventional in the early 50s, of course, since transistors were only invented in 1947 and were very rare and very expensive and very limited! Chips were still a distant dream..........................[geek]

It is far better to have an active tone control in line between the guitar and the amp.

Here is a US outfit with loads of genuine Fender spares!

http://www.angela.com/catalog/guitar-parts/tele.html