Re: Carte Vitale

[Carina]

Hello - some questions if I may on the French health service:

• am I right in assuming that to qualify for a Carte Vitale you have to be in reciept of a state pension from the UK? 
• If a wife is 60 and the husband 62 do both recieve free health. 
• Do you still need top-up insurance i.e. how much does the Carte Vitale cover. 
• Lastly (I fear only for now) does reciept of Incapacity Benefit qualiry for a Carte Vitale.

Profuse apoligies for the number of questions - we have now bought our house near Bagnoles De L'Orne in Normandy and hope to move over in July, we are early retired (me 57 and wife 55) and any other advice particually on Taxation and health would be gratefully recieved.  I am seriously Diabetic injecting insulin and taking about 18 pills per day so would particually like to hear from any diabetics out there that could help.

Thanks all for interesting contributions

Very confused Paul

[suein56]

... am I right in assuming that to qualify for a Carte Vitale you have to be in reciept of a state pension from the UK? 

I can only answer the first of your queries by saying that my OH and I are both 57, so we are not in receipt of a UK state pension, but we both have carte vitales. We do not work in France so we contribute to the 'sécurité sociale' by virtue of quarterly payments to URSSAF who take the money and put (some of it?) towards our health care cover by CPAM.

We also pay into a top-up to cover what CPAM do not.

Sue

[Ron Avery]

[quote user="Carina"]

Hello - some questions if I may on the French health service:

Am I right in assuming that to qualify for a Carte Vitale you have to be in reciept of a state pension from the UK? 

No, everybody is entitled to a Carte Vitale it is social security card, which makes paying and receiving back payments easier. What is important is the paper attestation that comes with it, that gives you your entitlement.  There are numerous ways to an Attestation and Carte Vitale, in your case it would be either by cover from the UK by an E 106 form for a maximum of two years then entry and payment into the French Health care stystem or the invalidiity may qualify you for cover under an E 121 form, others will know if diabetes is considered a qualifier for an E 121 or not, but either way you must sort this out before you leave the UK.

If a wife is 60 and the husband 62 do both receive free health?

 If your wife is in receipt of the UK OAP you would not have to pay into the French Health system, this is another "qualifier" for an E 121 but health care is not free in France, the E 121 only covers you for typically 65 -70% of costs, you will have to get a top up for the rest. 

Do you still need top-up insurance i.e. how much does the Carte Vitale cover. See above

Lastly (I fear only for now) does reciept of Incapacity Benefit qualify for a Carte Vitale.  See above about Carte Vitale, IB etc.

Profuse apologies for the number of questions - we have now bought our house near Bagnoles De L'Orne in Normandy and hope to move over in July, we are early retired (me 57 and wife 55) and any other advice particularly on Taxation and health would be gratefully recieved.  I am seriously Diabetic injecting insulin and taking about 18 pills per day so would particually like to hear from any diabetics out there that could help.

Thanks all for interesting contributions

Very confused Paul

[/quote]

[Benjamin]

Your receipt of Incapacity Benefit should qualify you for an E121 but to make certain contact Newcastle and ask them (sorry but I can't put my hands on the 'phone number at present).

At your ages budget around 1000€ per annum for thhe top-up insurance.

I know someone on this forum has severe diabetes and hopefully they can confirm that your diabetes will be reimbursed 100% )but only the diabetes.

For the tax questions trawl through the French Finance section and then come back with any specific questions.

Best of luck with the move.

[Benjamin]

Found it [:D]

The Pension Service

Tyneview Park

Medical Benefits

Newcastle upon Tyne

NE98 1BA

Telephone 0191 21 87547

email [email protected]

[steve tachauer]

Ron, we recently arrived in France (Dept.62) and signed up with the local doctor. He gave us a signed form which he told us to send off to the local CPAM office in Boulogne. They sent it back saying that we weren't registered with that office. Our near neighbours got a form from the same office with an immatriculation number already printed on it and ready for signature by the local doc. We've already filled in and returned the form to the Mairie telling them that we are living here permanently - where have we gone wrong? Have we short circuited the system somehow? I'd be very grateful if you or someone else could help with this as my wife needs regular medication and has only a months' worth left.

 

With thanks in advance, PP.

[Sunday Driver]

It sounds like you haven't yet registered with your local CPAM.  You need to visit them and sign up for your state healthcare insurance (CMU).  They'll issue you with an attestation of cover containing your new social security number - you enter this number on your doctor nomination form and return it to CPAM (not your Mairie).

Once you're registered, the state insurance will cover around 70% of your treatment costs (eg, your wife's medication) so you'll need to purchase a commercial top-up insurance policy to cover the remaining 30%.

If you search the forum, you'll find fuller details of the CPAM registration process.

 

[steve tachauer]

A thousand thanks (or a 'susan' as my neighbour pronounces it), PP.

[Ron Avery]

The forms that you are being given are for registering with a doctor, as SD says, if you were registered with CPAM, you would send them to CPAM and they would register you with that doctor, if you do not sign up with a doctor you will pay more for each visit and will not be reimbursed as much.   What did you pay the doctor for the visit or was this just to "sign on" with him?

As SD says you have short circuited the system by a big margin, you should do as he says about registering and top up insurance  but you cannot get a top up until you are registered

Look through the Health section on here, including the FAQs and read up on the CMU stuff and also the  E forms from the UK and about the assessment of payment levels into the French health care system  You can also look at the work and pensions site in the UK for info on E forms, do a google on "E106" for a starter.

When you register, if you are not covered by an E form from the UK, you will have to produce evidence of your last year's income.

[Ron Avery]

[quote user="Benjamin"]Found it [:D]

The Pension Service

Tyneview Park

Medical Benefits

Newcastle upon Tyne

NE98 1BA

Telephone 0191 21 87547

email [email protected]

[/quote]

Benjamin Phone number has been changed to  0044 (0) 191 2181999

[steve tachauer]

Thanks, again, for the info. The visist was actually also for our 6 year olds' benefit as he had had a minor op. before coming to France and there was a small problem - so we did pay for the visit but it was't a great deal and I still have the receipt. We're going to visit the CPAM office next week. My wife has an E106 but I don't as I retired more than 5 years ago so I'll make sure I take my last P60 with me (I have a government pension) and hope that everything will be sorted. Many thanks, PP.

[Carina]

Hi Benjamin

After a phone call to Newcastle they confirm that as a reciever of Incapacity Benefit I qualify for an E121 - my wife also can become a dependant on this E121.  So good news and a saving of 8% of income!!  Apparantley when one of us is of pension age we then have to apply for another E121 to continue.

Thanks for your help - what would us Brits deperate to get out do without you people eh!!!

Paul

[suein56]

[quote user="Carina"]

Hi Benjamin

After a phone call to Newcastle they confirm that as a reciever of Incapacity Benefit I qualify for an E121 - my wife also can become a dependant on this E121.  So good news and a saving of 8% of income!!  Apparantley when one of us is of pension age we then have to apply for another E121 to continue.

Thanks for your help - what would us Brits deperate to get out do without you people eh!!!

Paul [/quote]

That's good news Paul.

Did you not receive my reply to the email you sent me?

Sue

[Benjamin]

Thanks for that Paul. Happy to help out as people helped us when we were starting out. [:D]

I've just had a look on the CPAM (Caisse Primaire d'Assurance Maladie) web site for the information on diabetes. Both types 1 and 2 are covered for 100% reimbursement on what is known as the liste des A.L.D. 30.

Do bear in mind that you will only be reimbursed 100% for that specific condition; all others will require top-up cover.

[Carina]

Hi Benjamin

I think I now understand the forms I need just 2 things I think are still confusing me!

I ahve now been told I will get an E121 sent to my French address soon after I move there.  Can you please tell me (or anyone else that reads this) what do I do with it.  Do I take it to a Doctor or to the local CPAM office.  In other words what order do I do things - Doctor then CPAM or CPAM then Doctor. Bearing in mind as I am Diabetic I will have to visit with a Doctor faily quickly to obtain the drugs/insulin that I need.

Also where do I find the address for the nearest CPAM office, we will be living near Bagnoles De L'Orne, Orne, Normandy.

 

Thanks again everybody (hope one day to be able to help as well)

Paul

[cooperlola]

CPAM first.  Probably Alencon, but I'll check.  Take with you also, proof of address, passports and a RIB from your bank.

EDIT Yes, Alencon

http://www.ameli.fr/assures/votre-caisse-orne/nous-rencontrer/les-points-d-accueil-permanents_orne.php

[Benjamin]

Cooperlola has provided you with the address of your local CPAM office together with the documents you need to provide so when you receive  your E121 take it straight to them. I would be wary about how soon is soon after you arrive. Keep on checking with them if you do not receive it quite quickly after you arrive in France.

As you say you will need to see and register with a Doctor as soon as you arrive. You will need to complete a form to register with the Doctor as your Medecin Traitant i e the equivalent of  registering with a G P. If , as time goes on, your are not happy with that doctor then you can easily re-register with another but cross that bridge if it arises. [:D]

Until you have registered with CPAM you should keep any receipts for payments to the Doctor and to the Chemist for medecins. These can retrospectively be reimbursed. Take your current medicines to the Doctors with you as most medecins in Europe now "cross borders".

As small tip; if your French is a bit sketchy ask at your local Town Hall or Chemists if they know of a local Doctor who speaks a little English. This can help enormously initially.

[suein56]

In all this please don't forget TU's mantra - keep at least one copy of any piece of paper that is at all important to you - especially something like an E121.

Sue

[Benjamin]

[quote user="Spg"]

In all this please don't forget TU's mantra - keep at least one copy of any piece of paper that is at all important to you - especially something like an E121.

Sue

[/quote]

I think, and this is only from memory (which ain't what it used to be [:)]) that you are sent two copies anyway, only one of which needs giving to CPAM.

[Sunday Driver]

One small point on registering with a doctor.  You can choose your doctor and obtain treatment/prescriptions from day one.  Once your CPAM application has been processed, you'll receive a paper attestation outlining your cover, together with a doctor nomination form.  Get your doctor to sign this, then return it to your CPAM together with your accumulated claim forms (feuilles de soins). You'll need to enter your new social security number on the doctor form and claim forms - it's on the attestation.

As mentioned above, the attestation of cover is a key document, so keep it safe.

 

[BobDee]

Just a post regarding our experiences.

We are UK pensioners who arrived here in late January. We visited the local Doctor to get a regular UK prescription that my Wife needs for eye drops converted for the French system. Found an excellent English speaking Doctor in Nerac (47) who gave my wife a very thorough examination, a prescription for her eye drops, the address of the local CPAM, and charged 21 Euros.

We sent off our E121's to this address and about three weeks later received a letter containing our E121's (returned) and a questionaire to fill in. This was returned to the CPAM together with a requested Bank RIB, a copy of our Birth Certificates  and the E121's.

Four weeks later we have now received our individual Attestations that show our French social security numbers, Also included was the "Declaration de Choix du Medicin Traitant" form.

We will now visit the Doctor again with this form, or perhaps we can just post the forms and then we will hopefully get our Carte Vitales.

It all takes time and I guess one should allow around three months for the whole process to complete. No doubt we could have saved a couple of weeks at least, by visiting the CPAM personally but the aggrevation of finding the offices in Agen, checking when they open etc was at least saved by the posting method. 

Regs

 

BobD

 

[Sunday Driver]

Another small point to help anyone starting down this route.

CPAMs have representatives who visit the local towns on a regular basis to sort out resident queries.  If you check with your mairie, they'll tell you which is your nearest centre socio-medicale where the rep calls.  Saves a long trip to your CPAM office and you get help on the spot.

 

[monaco]

The doctor's fee is fixed at 21 euros.  I was over 60 when I became resident in France so it was much easier.  My local mairie told me when the representative of the CPAM in Carcassonne visited Axat, Aude.  I took ALL my documents - I have got in the habit of carrying birth, marriage, divorce, change of name, passport, utility bill, proof of house purchase, in a folder in my car as I found several times that I was missing one of them.  They are needed for all kinds of things in France, such as buying  a mobile phone!

I give my Carte Vitale to my doctor to be swiped and the CPAM reimburses me 13 euros (70% less 1 euro admin fee) into my bank account within a month.  Pharmacies seem to work in two different ways - some charge me only 35% of the cost of my medication and some charge me full price and leave the CPAM to reimburse me.  What I need to get now is the document  to obtain free health care throughout Europe, as last time I needed to see a doctor whilst I was visiting the UK I was told that there was a £90 consultation fee since last April.  As I still pay tax on my UK government pensions I was a bit annoyed - how come immigrants from non-EU countries seem to get free medical care , or is that only when they become residents of the UK?

I have only a small mutuelle, just to cover me for hospitalisation (horrible word) - I pay 18 euros a month and get 150% of the costs of any hospital stay, plus 56 euros a day during my stay in hospital.  I think at my age, 66, that is very good value.  I was paying £45 per month in the UK into the Civil Service Health Scheme.   As I normally enjoy excellent health, apart from a little athritis, I never used the service although I paid in for eight years, but I suppose that is the nature of all insurance - you hope you never need to use it!

Incidentally, my doctor kindly gives me a prescription for diclofenac for three months, so my visits cost me only  4,33 euros a month!

[Laine]

    I read your post with interest as we have been thinking about getting a mutuelle for some time.  It has always seemed expensive but, as you say, this is the nature of insurance of all kinds!  In fact we have lived in France for nearly 15 years (I am 61, my husband 58) and have managed without the traditional ''top-up'.  My husband is diabetic and is covered 100% for anything associated with this condition and I am in good health (touch wood!!)  However, if you can get a basic mutelle for 18 euros a month then that seems very reasonable - I really thought it was much more expensive than that!! Could you please let me know what insurance company this is.   Many thanks.

Kind Regards,

[Will]

You do get what you pay for. 150% sounds good, but that's 150% of the basic 'convention' cost and the real cost at many hospitals, specialists, surgeons etc will be rather more than that. It's impossible to say for certain because it all depends on the scales of charges at the hospital you would be likely to use (but then if you were taken ill in Paris where would that leave you?). It's quite likely that the minimum cover will offer all you need, but you have to make an informed decision, based on more than just monthly premiums.

Somebody also said that doctors' fees were fixed at 21€, which is not strictly true. That's the fee on which your reimbursement for a visit to the GP is fixed, doctors can actually charge what they like though most charge the basic fee.

For full cover you need to be looking at, say, 300%. And if you want to add certain therapies, many out-patient treatments, optical and dental cover, you are looking at a lot more than basic hospitalisation cover, which is where the more expensive policies come in. Insurers will, of course, want to sell you the highest level of cover if they can, and only you can decide what you really need and what level of risk you are prepared to cover yourself.