Self Employed Artist

[Dantes mum]

I have just posted a query under the Art section, but wonder if it might be more appropriate here?  I know that there is an enormous raft of information in all the various posts as I have just spent hours combing through them, but please forgive me if I ask a few questions which may be repetitive.  Basically, my husband and I finally made it to France late Oct. to settle permanently in what has been our holiday home for the past 5 years.  Just as we were preparing to leave the UK, the health situation exploded, but we really had no choice but to carry on at that stage.  We are now here and I understand that, as we are early retired, we are inactifs.  We do not hold any get out of jail free cards, like E106 or E121, and as a result have not made any moves yet to make any permanent statements of domicile etc.  We do still have a UK address which we use (rented, not our own) so for now, are still in the UK NHS but definitely do want to regularise our situation.. Now (finally!)here is the question:  my husband is an artist (painter) who has, over the past few years, sold a few pieces of work, but on a "hobby" basis.  He now wants to devote himself to this full time, and so we understand he needs to register here as a self employed artist.  One post says definitely do not go near URSAAF, but organize things through the Maison des Artists.  I have been to their website and can download application forms etc, so that would be a start, but what happens then?  How do you actually get from filling in a form to being a legitimately registered self employed artist, and make cotisations to the health service?  Is this going to be possible?  If anyone has any information at all, I would be deeply grateful!

[Benjamin]

The first thing you need to do is either read the thread(s) on current healthcare for inactives as you appear to have moved here just before the cut-off date in November (although how you prove it I have no idea!) or get a Moderator to move your posting over.

Secondly, unless your husband is exclusively a portrait painter won't he be needing a bit of time to be building up some "stock" whilst you examine where you stand health coverwise?

In other words don't go rushing off anywhere until you establish your residence status.

 

[Dantes mum]

Thanks for your reply.  I have read pretty much everything re health care and don't think there is much doubt that we do not qualify.  We don't have E106,109,121 etc. etc. - my husband actually retired (early) a few years ago so has not been paying NHS contributions in UK so can't get any of these.  I imagine we could "prove" we have been here since Oct as still have receipts etc. for travelling here but we have hesitated to commit ourselves to anything at all as we have been so overwhelmed by the deluge of information/misinformation in the press etc. re the health situation.  Private insurance doesn't seem to be an option due to a couple of pre-existing conditions. 

As far as "stock" goes, no problem as he has been doing a lot of painting over the past few years (landscapes).  So now we are back to the original question:  is it going to be possible to register as a self employed artist, making contributions to the French system, as we wish to, and if so, do we start with la Maison des Artistes, or URSSAF?  Any ideas?

[Benjamin]

If you're asking the question of how to register as an artist purely to gain access to the French healthcare system because otherwise you would be classed as inactives, then I think you need to look at going down the route of establishing your residency in France before the November cut-off date. There are others on here who are far more knowledgeable than me (where are you when you're needed Cooperlola?) and hopefully you'll qualify that way. You won't need any E forms to qualify and your UK NI record doesn't come into it. It's purely residency and your ability to pay the relevant French social charges.

If on the other hand you want to register as an artist irrespective then my paragraph above just doesn't apply.

I think we have a resident artist (artsole?) who'll no doubt be along shortly.

[Will]

He won't, he appears to have been banned. But a search for his past posts will provide some relevant information about registering as an artist. You do have to prove that you are a working artist to take advantage of the special status that allows.

[Dantes mum]

Many thanks for your reply.  The ultimate goal is to register as an artist, but there is now an element of urgency about it due to the need to resolve the cotisation issue.  I am very uncertain as to whether we would be able to establish our residency as predating the Nov cut off date as unsure what final "proof" would be requested.  After all, we know we have been here - but as we were in such a dither about everything, we didn't actually do anything other than just arrive.  Perhaps advice from an artist would help to clarify things, if there is one out there?

[Clair]

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[Dantes mum]

Now I am intrigued to know what was the thread that got removed!!  This is a final call for help:  are there any self employed artists out there who have gone the route of registering with the Maison des Artistes and then on into the system, paying cotisations etc.?  I would be eternally grateful for your advice on how to proceed because I am getting more confused by the minute.  Thank you!

[Russethouse]

Have you looked at this thread ? http://www.completefrance.com/cs/forums/4/1170105/ShowPost.aspx#1170105 esp a posting on the 22nd? Does that help at all ?

[Dantes mum]

Thank you for that link.  The plot thickens ... This morning I went to our mairie where I requested, and received, an attestation saying that we have been in residence here since October 2007, and have been house owners since 2002.  Next stop Maison des Artistes, though it appears we may need to have CPAM numbers etc. etc. before we can get too far with that.  Still, it is a start and at least I feel I have accomplished something apart from just sitting here tearing my hair out!  Any further advice/comments gratefully received.

[raindog]

Dante's mum - keep checking for pms from me....I'm doing my best to help.

(this thread is getting more and more weird)

[cooperlola]

Dante's Mum, I think you are quite wrong.  You do not need to have an E106 to gain access to CMU, only proof that you were resident before November.  Take all the evidence you can lay your hands on as to your removal date (including your travel documents!) - electricity bills and any other utilities you might have used to your local CPAM and apply for CMU entry - you really should have done this earlier, but you still should qualify, imo.  And next month, complete your tax returns from your removal date.  There is no need for you to have had any E106 entitlement - you just have to have been a resident before the cut off date, and be able to prove it.

[Clair]

[quote user="raindog"]Dante's mum - keep checking for pms from me[/quote]To check your PM box, click here: http://www.completefrance.com/cs/user/PrivateMessages/

[Dantes mum]

Thank you for your reply.  My husband does want to be a registered and fully-up-to-date-on-paperwork artist, so this should mean that he will in fact be able to get all relevant numbers etc.  We shall push on with this.  Sorry to be dim, though, but what does "imo" mean?

[Cat]

imo = in my opinion

[Dantes mum]

Of course!!  That was a bit thick of me - obvious now that I see it written out.  Merci beaucoup!

[cooperlola]

Otherwise known as a neat get-out in case one turns out to be wrong!  Seriously, I do try to avoid being too categorical about things, particularly where bureaucratic systems are involved....

[Meg]

Reading all this is confusing me even more!!! And reminding me i really ought to get on with registering myself! Fortunately i'm already in the 'system' for health, through my OH, although it may end up complicating it even more?? So planning to go and find a 'grown up' to speak to, armed with all my papers etc. Might try and speak with someone at the ANPE.

Good luck Dante's Mum.  I'll post when i mange to get any info that may help, you or other people trying to register with MDA.

[Dantes mum]

That would be great and I will do likewise.  We are planning to sit and go through the forms this weekend and perhaps ask help from a local artist whom we have recently met.  Also there is apparently a sort of cultural attache at the mairie so perhaps she would be another person to ask if in difficulty.

[Dantes mum]

Well, here we are a week down the line and not making too much progress.  Here's the question du jour:  if my husband goes ahead and manages to get affiliated with the Maison des Artistes, and starts paying cotisations to get into the health system, are his contributions going to be affected by the fact that he has another income, ie his pension?  The reason I ask is that somewhere recently, in the reams of info I have been sifting through, I read about a French author/artist who was having to pay double cotisations, tax etc. on the basis that he had two lines of work and thus two sources of income.  Any ideas?

[jon]

What was the exact cut-off date...by the way?

[Dantes mum]

We seem to be going round in circles here so sorry to keep banging on!  We are trying to find out whether registering with La Maison des Artistes will have any implications for my husband's pension, but meantime read cooperlola's post above.  That was quite cheering and for a few hours we thought maybe we could just do that - but then rang CNAM's English line who advise that, as we do not have E106, we may not enter the CMU.  The woman was quite certain that CPAM would turn us down and that, although we would have the right to request them to reconsider, ultimately it would not be of any use to us.  My brains are nearly fried with trying to see a way through all of this - anybody got any idea about this, or about whether registering as an artist would cause problems due to existing pension (from early retirement)?  Thank you in advance!