Russethouse Posted October 12, 2011 Share Posted October 12, 2011 I don't agree, I think in most cases those senior civil servants know exactly how to deal with Ministers who are not doing the right thing, how to spell out exactly what is permissible and to bring into play the Ministerial code.Having read the BBC link I suspect a lot of this is hot air but there are a few incidence that cause concern.......what to do about is another matter.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mint Posted October 12, 2011 Author Share Posted October 12, 2011 [quote user="Russethouse"] I have heard that within the MOD he is personally popular, even though he has been the bearer of bad news re the defence cuts...[/quote]Ah, he's "personally popular".....so that makes it all right then?As for the responsibility for national security, I think you'll find that that is one of those areas where departments have overlapping responsibility. What about when the army is brought in at times of national emergency, to give one extreme example. And, BTW, I'm not the one overplaying the terrorism bit; it's Cameron who bangs on and on about it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quillan Posted October 12, 2011 Share Posted October 12, 2011 The thing is has he signed the official secrets act and if so at what level. I rather suspect he has but at what level I wouldn't know. If he hasn't then he should not have been there and should not have taken part in any discussions re the countries security in any way what so ever.Think we have to wait till we get the facts before jumping up and down too much but it is all rather smelly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Russethouse Posted October 12, 2011 Share Posted October 12, 2011 No, of course it doesn't make it alright, but its a shame if someone has the support of those he works, which makes life a lot easier, if he has to go. Also advisors who might put the knife in don't seem to be really keen to do soActually I just heard something that I do think is very odd: apparently when Liam Fox was the Health Minister Adam Werrity started a business in that field, now Liam Fox is at the MOD Adam Werrity has a Defence industry based business - that strikes me as being someone who is hanging on to Fox's coat tails for all he is worth. IMHO Time for Mr Fox to choose friend or career...Yes, I'm sure the roles of Minister of Defence and Home Secretary overlap to some extent. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Home_Secretaryhttp://www.mod.uk/DefenceInternet/AboutDefence/People/Ministers/SecretaryOfStateForDefence.htm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mint Posted October 12, 2011 Author Share Posted October 12, 2011 More Liam Fox, so look away NOW if you don't want to know!http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2048131/Liam-Fox-rumours-He-loves-wife-says-MP-Chris-Grayling.htmlLike, idun, I don't really want to know about his sexuality, I just used a title that I thought would get people reading! Yes, I'm sneaky like that.....[:P]At the very least, it seems that some taxpayer money was involved, if only for Fox to "tag on" private breaks with his best mate on his official overseas trips.And, also that foreign officials WERE led to believe that the chap was from Fox's office and therefore linked to the government. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Russethouse Posted October 12, 2011 Share Posted October 12, 2011 And, also that foreign officials WERE led to believe that the chap was from Fox's office and therefore linked to the government.Wasn't that the crux of the matter to start with ? I'm not really so concerned about tagging on holidays as long as the tax payer only paid Liam Foxes fare (and possibly his wife's fare if that was appropriate) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LAiffricaine Posted October 13, 2011 Share Posted October 13, 2011 [quote user="Russethouse"] ..... Liam Fox ... his wife ... [/quote]Where is she ? What does she looks like? Has anyone seen a photos of her ?... Or does he keep her in the cupboard to be taken out only on a sunny day. There has been photos of the Werritys in some of the UK papers and also on the BBC 24 hours news channel but Mrs Fox remains an elusive one... Maybe she's a vixen ... so beware ... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quillan Posted October 13, 2011 Share Posted October 13, 2011 There are quite a few on the web just do a search on "Liam Fox wife photo". I see some are going on about "when did you last see Liam Fox's wife alive", so the tabloids are almost accusing him of murdering his wife now. Talk about guilty till found innocent. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clarkkent Posted October 13, 2011 Share Posted October 13, 2011 L'AiffricaineWhere is she ? What does she looks like? Has anyone seen a photos of her ?... Or does he keep her in the cupboard to be taken out only on a sunny day. There has been photos of the Werritys in some of the UK papers and also on the BBC 24 hours news channel but Mrs Fox remains an elusive one... Maybe she's a vixen ... so beware ...Why don't you just go to the Daily Mail link that RH provided. There is a photo of Mr & Mrs Fox on their wedding day. I suspect that Mrs Fox is keeping her head down as Director of the Roy Castle Lung Cancer Foundation.I have little time for Liam Fox's political views - but as for his sexuality? The Mail article reeks of sly innuendo. What grown adults choose to do with the contents of their underwear is none of anyone else's business. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mint Posted October 13, 2011 Author Share Posted October 13, 2011 I agree with Clarkkent; no need to drag the wife into this.As long as there is no cover-up as to the ins and outs, the rights and wrongs of this business, that should satisfy even the most sceptical amongst us. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NickP Posted October 13, 2011 Share Posted October 13, 2011 [quote user="Clarkkent"] . What grown adults choose to do with the contents of their underwear is none of anyone else's business.[/quote]Sorry you are wrong, it does matter if it appears to affect the security of my country and of course if my tax is supporting a public servant's mates "jollies" then I care very much, and I have every right to demand an explanation to then decide if it's my business or not. I hate the likes of the Daily Mail etc. but remember that if it wasn't for them we would never know what goes on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pickles Posted October 14, 2011 Share Posted October 14, 2011 Well, I used the words "corruption" and "disdain" previously, and with the latest offerings on the matter it just gets worse.http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-15302045The people in the Westminster village (ALL parties) need to realise that they are not above the law and that they need to act with propriety to earn the significant benefits that they receive for representing us mere mortals.RegardsPickles Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mint Posted October 14, 2011 Author Share Posted October 14, 2011 I don't really know how these underhand and nefarious dealings of Fox came to be in the public domain as I haven't followed the story to its source.Do you know, Pickles?Does anybody else? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woolybanana Posted October 14, 2011 Share Posted October 14, 2011 Guardian journalists seem to have followed him everywhere round the world and staked out his flat, asked (bribed, paid?) people for information. And perhaps there is an insider leaking. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mint Posted October 14, 2011 Author Share Posted October 14, 2011 Hm.....unconventional methods then, Wools?[:D] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hoddy Posted October 14, 2011 Share Posted October 14, 2011 I think the main question is who was paying Werrity’s expenses and why. We have a right to know if he was gaining from his friendship with Fox. The question of his sexuality is irrelevant. If he had been travelling the world with a woman sixteen years his junior questions would have been asked much earlier. There is something very odd going on here. And now we have Letwin throwing papers away in public litter bins. I think our whole political class is a shambles.Hoddy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Russethouse Posted October 14, 2011 Share Posted October 14, 2011 I think there is something of a campaign against him, he certainly thinks so. Last night the program after Question Time, discussed the rise of Special Advisors in government, I think their role in somewhat murkey......actually I knew about the people paying Mr Werrity a couple of days ago, it seemscompletely wrong to me..one thing to meet with people who have different views another to have someone so close. If this turns out to be true, and I think it will, then I do think Fox should go Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mint Posted October 14, 2011 Author Share Posted October 14, 2011 You mean the Fox's goose has been cooked? Aaaarrrrggghhh.....sorreeeee......the sun's gone to my head! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Russethouse Posted October 14, 2011 Share Posted October 14, 2011 There is an official enquiry, from what I gleaned last night, apparently he has ideas which DC may not share and is not a best chum, plus its said he isn't totally confident in some of his MOD staff (maybe he questions their loyalty) so Mr Werrity took the role of sounding board I guess.Its a muddleSweet, is there actually any politician you like, of any hue ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pickles Posted October 14, 2011 Share Posted October 14, 2011 [quote user="Hoddy"]I think the main question is who was paying Werrity’s expenses and why.[/quote]I agree. The growing evidence is that these people are seeking to have an influence on Govt policy that they could not get by other means - or as cheaply![quote user="Hoddy"]We have a right to know if he was gaining from his friendship with Fox.[/quote]There's a couple of "timeline" articles that I came across - either BBC, Grauniad or Indy - which I found illuminating. Fox becomes shadow health spokesman, suddenly Werritty becomes head of a health-related company; Fox becomes Shadow defence spokesman, suddenly Werritty is heading up defence-related businesses.[quote user="Hoddy"]There is something very odd going on here.[/quote]Indeed. And the fact that Fox is trying to behave as if there is no case to answer brings me back to my previous "disdain" comment.[quote user="Russethouse"]so Mr Werrity took the role of sounding board I guess.[/quote]There are people that I use as sounding boards. They are my friends. I don't pay them and they don't expect to be paid. The more I read of Werritty and Fox, the more annoyed I become.RegardsPickles Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cooperlola Posted October 14, 2011 Share Posted October 14, 2011 I admit I haven't read this thread or really kept up with the story but, Sweet 17, what's the point of a scandal without the sex? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pickles Posted October 14, 2011 Share Posted October 14, 2011 And he has finally seen sense and resigned ...http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-15300751RegardsPickles Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Russethouse Posted October 14, 2011 Share Posted October 14, 2011 And would you use your friends as sounding board if you were defence secretary, not very wise dinner table conversation is it ? At last he has done the honorable thing I remain concerned about these 'political advisors' and their role .... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pickles Posted October 14, 2011 Share Posted October 14, 2011 [quote user="Russethouse"] And would you use your friends as sounding board if you were defence secretary, not very wise dinner table conversation is it ?[/quote]If he were discussing matters covered by the Official Secrets Act with ANYONE who was not duly authorised to be in receipt of that information (IIRC, regardless of whether that person had signed the Act), then this would be a serious breach of the law. There is no possible argument for saying that Werritty had a "need to know" ANYTHING that would have come under Fox's remit. There aren't many people that you could use as sounding boards for defence matters - the Official Secrets Act is there for a reason.[quote user="Russethouse"]At last he has done the honorable thing[/quote]It took him long enough ... why did he have to be told that this behaviour was unacceptable? He should have known that it was dodgy and LOOKED bad right from the outset, yet he tried to carry on as if nothing was wrong.[quote user="Russethouse"]I remain concerned about these 'political advisors' and their role ....[/quote]Seconded.RegardsPickles Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mint Posted October 14, 2011 Author Share Posted October 14, 2011 [quote user="Russethouse"]Sweet, is there actually any politician you like, of any hue ?[/quote]Yes, Dennis Skinner [:D] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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