French Identity Card Requirements

[David]

We have lived in France for three years now, and have always carried our passports with us.  We understand that this is a legal requirement, particularly when driving.  We have asked our local prefecture and Marie if we can obtain a French Identity Card, but they say that we cannot, as we have to be French citizens to have one.

Our problem now is that we are considering going overseas for a special 60th birthday holiday, and we may need visas.  Of course to obtain the visas we have to send our UK passports to London (or Paris but that is more difficult) for the visas to be processed.

This leaves us with no legal ID in France.

Any ideas or suggestions gratefully received as we have researched this site, but cannot find an answer to this specific question.

Many thanks,

David

[Will]

Yes, you have to be a French national to have an identity card, but you can have 'titre de sejour', which is an equivalent for foreign nationals. If you have lived here for three years I am surprised that you have not come across this before, as it used to be compulsory for everybody though the requirement was waived for citizens of most EU member states as from, I believe, the beginning of 2004. Although the titre de sejour (often referred to as carte de sejour) is not compulsory for Europeans you are entitled to have one if you request it. Some prefectures will tell you otherwise, probably because they want to avoid the work involved in processing the application.

I would also suggest you contact the British Embassy about your passport/visa question; they must have come across this before.

[maureen]

I recently renewed my Carte de Sejour even though legally it is now not necessary. I went to my local Mairie who told me that it would have to go through the Prefecture in Perigueux, and that I would have to go there. So, I phoned Perigueux, who told me to go back to my local Mairie and tell them to do it. I was told by Perigueux,  that they needed to get out the forms they used before, get the required nos. of photos,  my parents d. of b. the usual telephone or E.D.F Bill et etc. I did this and much to my surprise my new card turned up a short while later.

I have NEVER heard that it is necessary to carry a passport with you when driving. If you have french driving licences, theses can be used as "identity cards" if you are stopped.

French Identity cards are for the french.

Maureen.

[andyh4]

A photocopy of the passport page with your picture and details usually will suffice as proof of identity to all but the most obnoxious member of the gendamerie when you explain why you cannot produce the requuired document.

 

Alternatively (and this is not widely known) you can apply for a second passport - but that will of course cost.

 

[Teamedup]

I am sure that three years ago these were still compulsory and you should have applied for them when you moved to France. Why didn't you?

As has been said, you can still apply for a titre de sejour. If your Prefecture gives you any hassle about this contact the Ministere de l'Interieur or maybe the British Consulate and they will put the Prefecture straight. Incidentally one has to fulfill certain conditions to get one of these, so in that respect they are not automatically issued.

[Pangur]

Regarding the passport issue, my husband recently needed to apply for a passport from the Irish embassy in Paris, but also needed the passport for foreign travel so the six week application time was a problem.  After speaking to the Irish embassy, they allowed him to apply for a new passport by sending off a photocopy rather than surrendering the current passport with the application.  Once the new passport arrived in Paris, they contacted him, he courriered the old passport to Paris and they courriered the new one back, which took a matter of days rather than weeks.  It may be worth contacting the British embassy to see if they are willing to make a similar arrangement.

[Ron Avery]

Andy All a passport tells a gendarme is that you have a passport with your picture in it and date and place of birth, it does not record your address which may be of more interest to M. Flick.

I have just heard on the news a proposal is to be discussed to force all persons from abroad living in France to have a carte de titre in an effort to stop illegal employment and "strangers" being a burden on the State, I think most people on here would welcome and support such a proposal.  Could this bring a surfeit of properties for sale in certain parts of France though?

[Will]

I have always found the British Consulate-General in Paris (which deals with passport applications and renewals for British citizens resident in France) to be extremely accommodating. They can, when necessary, turn round renewal applications in a very short time - I have heard of them doing it even within a day. I would suggest that a genuine reason is needed - if you just turn up and demand a new passport because you are going on holiday and forgot that the old one had expired you will probably be told where to get off. See http://www.britishembassy.gov.uk/servlet/Front?pagename=OpenMarket/Xcelerate/ShowPage&c=Page&cid=1059132503646

[David]

Many thanks for all your helpful comments.  We will try again for a titre de sejour, which the Marie has already refused once.

Three matters arise from your comments.

A) When we arrived in France we applied to our local Marie for a Carte de Sejour.  They were very helpful, filled in the paper work and gave us an attestation that we had applied for one.  Some time later we received an official letter from the prefecture saying that the law was going to be changed, and that our application would be kept in the pending file.  About a year later we received another latter saying that Cartes de Sejour were no longer required for UK nationals, and that they would not issue us one.

B) Again when we arrived in France we asked the local prefecture to change our UK driving licences (old pink ones with no photo) for French ones.  Initially the office were very helpful, and filled out the forms.  Then the lady had one question, so she phoned head office in Niort.  She was told that a change was not necessary, and that she should not issue a French licence.  We are reluctant to force a change of licence by lying and stating that both my wife and I may be subject to traffic offences in France.  Presently we are not, and we hope it stays that way.

C) We thought of photocopying our passports, but the local Marie refuses to endorse them as being a true copy, except when they are for use in the UK.  Apparently this is no longer required in France, it being sufficient to endorse them yourself.  However, some neighbours, when stopped by the gendarms while driving, had much trouble with such photocopies.  They eventually took their original passports to the gendarmerie in the local town, and pleaded for leniency.  They were given a wigging and let go without a fine.

Trust this clarifies our problem, and relieves some of your minds that we were not remiss when we arrived in France.

Thanks again,

David

[Jonzjob]

Just one question David. Is there a particular reason for you to want a French licence? The U.K. one is valid and has been said it is only 'supposed' to be necessary to change if you incure penalties. Even that seems to be in doubt now though and will become clear when the cross border fines come on line completely. Then your U.K. licence can be 'docked' points.

So the only absolute time that you have to change your licence is when it runs out when you get old (can't remember the age, but it must be old 'cause it's older than me??)

John.

[David]

Thanks Jonzjob.  No I don't particularly need a French driving licence until I turn 70.  I was replying to Maureen who suggested I should use a French licence as an identity card.

 

[Frank]

hi david, we also have tried to get ID cards now we are resident in france, but with no luck.  We were told to contact the british consulate, which we did in bordeaux.  We have been advised to phoptocopy our passport for ID to carry around with us on a day to day basis along with some proof of residence, ie lec bill.  if we get asked for any reason to produce documents on the 'spot' the consulate has said this is perfectly OK. The consulate also advised if we were asked to produce the originals by the gendarmes etc, then we have 24 hours in which to do so. They said there is no longer a facility to have an ID in France as it is no longer required.  I will be interested to see how you get on with this and if you are successful in obtaining ID as it would make life easier in the longterm!

kimberley

[Jonzjob]

The reason that I asked is that the French licence is more restrictive than ours. The towing limit is lower at 750Kg, which means that if you have or intend getting a caravan you have to upgrade the French version. The vehicle top weight is lower too than the 7.5 ton allowed on our licence. Either 3 or 3.5 tonnes I believe.

We had a caravan in the U.K. and when we have looked around this lovely part of France will probably want one here. We sold ours before we came over because of the probable trials getting it registered here, plus if it's not used for a couple of years it will go down hill quickly.

We are also looking to get a  Titre de Sejour, with crossed fingers that we don't meet the brick wall that seems to abound.

John.

[maureen]

David - a driving license CAN be used as identity. Have you never noticed in supermarkets that the french often give their driving licenses as identity when they pay be cheque? You are entitled to a carte ( or titre if you like) de Sejour. Go onto the Britsh Embassy website, find the appropriate section, print it off, and take it either to your sous- prefecture/prefecture and tell them what you want. Your local Mairie obviously needs a kick up the bum, or is just being bone idle. Stick to your guns. or do you want to be classed as "sans papiers"!! I didn't.

As for the driving license, I have had mine for nearly 30 years so maybe the rules have changed since then, so no comment. I say that you can still give your driving license as identity if you are stopped by les flics. A passport is a far too important document to carry round with you all the time - the french certainly don't carry theirs. I know my partner is french!!!!

maureen.

[Teamedup]

Not just the Mairie's that can be bone idle, the Prefectures can be too.

[Ron Avery]

Mauren said " I say that you can still give your driving license as identity if you are stopped by les flics"

You have to carry your driving license at all times when driving in France anyway and Les Flicks willl normally ask to see it.  The problem is that until the new European License is rolled out in the next 20 years. if you are a French resident, a UK driving license, which is quite legal to use in France, is next to useless as an identity item because it gives a UK address that is normally no longer the holder's address.  The advice to get a carte de titre is the best.

No you do not have to have one, but you are entitled to one if you live here and this is your only residence.  So insist that your Mairie gives you the forms and processes the application.  Our little Mairie was only too happy to help and we had temporary cartes issued by them, while our applications were being processed.  As part of the application in 2003, the Prefecture at Rodez wanted a letter from our bank stating that we had a regular income here though.

[Pangur]

[quote user="maureen"] A passport is a far too important document to carry round with you all the time - the french certainly don't carry theirs.
maureen.
[/quote]

We live on the Swiss border, so it's very like living in a police state sometimes!  We have regular checks by the traffic police and also by customs hiding behind roundabouts peering in to see if you have any shopping bags from Geneva[;)].  I have never shown my passport to anyone and any time I have been stopped, I have shown my photo driving licence from the UK and nothing has ever been said. 

[Will]

If an official won't give you the form, or doesn't have any, you can get it from here:

http://www.cerfa.gouv.fr/servform/vigueur/formul/20v3243.pdf

You have to provide the usual things like birth certificate, evidence of financial status, medical cover etc.

Before getting my carte I too never had any problem using an old-style British (European) driving licence when ID was demanded. It doesn't show a French address, but neither does your passport so strictly speaking you should carry something like an EDF bill as well. That's not to say, of course, that a driving licence will be acceptable ID to every one of the many awkward gendarmes or fonctionnaires you may come across.

A card is definitely the best solution. Be aware that some prefectures make a charge for issuing one, which won't go down too well with some forum users.

[maureen]

Just remind them that they are civil servants - usually does the trick ..............................

maureen.

[sturner]

Do try to get your carte de sejour if you feel it is necessary, we tried and tried and eventually succeeded and we use it regularly, but not to go abroad with, we still need our uk passports for that. We were trying to start a business 5 years ago and the chambre de commerce said that the last thing on the long list we needed was the carte de sejour, the mairie would not give the carte de sejour as we had no proof of income (impossible without being able to start the business) so we were in catch 22 position. Eventually we went to the prefecture, to a department for foreigners (we were the only europeans waiting in the queue) when we explained our situation the woman made a very impatient phone call to our mairie and the usually butch man there was subserviant when we got back! Our experiences here over the last 5 years have been that it all depends which fonctionnaire it is you speak to and how they have interpreted the laws and which day of the week it is. Smile alot and try to fit in while also trying to get your way, DO NOT just walk away, ever. Also the information about the passport is correct, turnaround is very quick at the consulate and very helpfull.