SIDA

[idun]

It always seems to me that many people on this forum have lived and worked in many different countries and some still do.

I was in France when all the programs started about AIDS/SIDA. They started after french researchers had found the virus. (Well that is what I remember being said that they had done). There were phone in programs, I cannot really remember any prior to this, programs discussing it and the research, interviewing people in towns and cities in France too. There was much on french tv then and sometimes the questions asked of the researchers appeared to embarass them sometimes, which was quite sweet really.

I remember best the people of Clermont Ferrand being interviewed and saying that there would never be any SIDA there, they were not 'that sort of people in Clermont Ferrand' apparently!

I know I found myself feeling rather lucky, well eventually, as I had my son in 1982 and lost a lot of blood  and my gynaecologist said that I was not to have a transfusion, but to take iron tablets, and I cursed him for several weeks as I was weak as a kitten, but he could well have saved my life as the blood in the banks was certainly contaminated at that time, although no one  knew it was then.

 

So if that was going on in France, what was being broadcast elsewhere on the planet. I have no idea as to how the whole thing was handled elsewhere, how the information was reported and how people were informed. Can anyone remember? For no logical reason, I keep wondering.  I only had access to french tv and radio then and the BBC world service was barely audible so we didn't bother with it apart from duing the Falklands War.  

[LAiffricaine]

[quote user="idun"] ...  I remember best the people of Clermont Ferrand being interviewed and saying that there would never be any SIDA there, they were not 'that sort of people in Clermont Ferrand' apparently! ... [/quote]

 

Not that sort of people  [:-))]  ! 

I use to live in Clermont-Fd back in the 1970's and the 'night' life was very healthy  [;-)] indeed.

So whom ever they interviewed must have been going to church once a day and twice on Sunday where the communion wine doesn't reach the parts that other wines would  ...

 

 

[idun]

They interviewed quite a few people in Clermont Ferrand and they were all of the same opinion. It would not happen there.

[Sprogster]

If I recall correctly the heterosexual HIV infection rate in France is worse than the UK. Something to do with an aversity to using condoms.

[Chancer]

What year are you talking about Idun?

You mentioned your hospital stay in 82 so I am assuming you are talking about then.

At that time in the UK myself and my potes were having one night stands with anything that moved that didnt have the sense to say "No!"

There were absolutely no worries other than STD's, I reckon that it was around 86/87 that the media started to suggest that the person that you choose to have a casual sexual relation with might be a carrier.

I think it was the death of an American movie star that first brought it into the limelight, I recall the joke being "how did AIDS get into America?

Answer "up the Hudson"

[andyh4]

I seem to remember it being a bit earlier than Chancer but only 3 years at most.

And like the CF example, it was clearly a problem of homosexual males, so could not happen here (unless you were a homosexual male of course).

[pachapapa]

I can only remember hépatite C being a problem not SIDA.

In the period from 1972 to 1978 I lived in Central Africa and at this time SIDA was not an issue.

However there was some concern about "green monkey disease " MHF and the possible spread from Zaire into the copperbelt of Zambia.

But I do remember in the 80s Brazilian prostitutes in Buenos Aires writing" I got SIDA" messages in lipstick on the mirror in the hotel bedroom before departing.

Certainly made the hangover seem worse.

[Rabbie]

I was living in Sweden thoughout the Eighties and the first mention of this new mysterious disease among the gay population woud have been about 1983. The real hysteria did not really happen for a few more years.

[Cendrillon]

Elizabeth Luard wrote an excellent book "Family life, birth, death the whole damn thing" which I think was published in the early 1990's . She describes how they coped when one of her daughters got aids after a casual affair.

I agree Rabbie, initially most people thought it was just the gay population that were in danger of getting aids.

[idun]

Rabbie was there hysteria. I just remember all the tv programs in France and I did watch them, probably around 1984/1985, maybe slightly later. I remember discussions, not hysteria.

 Paul Michael Glasers wife had it and she had had her babies approx the same years as I had mine.  She had had a tranfusion which one way or another had also infected both children and cost all their lives.

I do remember homosexual men being mentioned most, and the questions would be asked how hetrosexuals could then catch it, and then the questions if hetrosexuals had anal sex if they were more at risk, and that was appeared to embarrass the researchers most, and to me at least, seemed un-prepared for such questions and how many people were asking. 

Later there was the scandal in France of the  'sang contaminé'. Even though the authorities knew that some of the blood in the blood banks was infected, they were still using it. I also do not know if that happened in other countries either.

[Rabbie]

British goverment propaganda about AIDS at the end of the eighties suggested we would have an epidemic with very high death rates. My opinion then that this was hysterical has been confirmed by events.

[Clarkkent]

DONT DIE OF IGNORANCE intoned John Hurt in sepulchral tones over a black and white image of a tombstone.

But I don't actually recall the reason for death being mentioned. (I may be wrong.) But I do recall a small child, when asked if he could name some diseases included ignorance in his list. He stated, quite reasonably, that people died from ignorance so it must be a disease.

And the moral righteous declared AIDS to be God's punishment for practising unnatural acts - which must have been of great comfort for those who were infected by contaminated blood supplies.

The conspiracy theorists maintained that AIDS had been manufactured in a secret US laboratory and had been a weapon intended to be used against the Soviet Union, but it "got out".

If I recall correctly, the director of the French national blood transfusion service was jailed for allowing contaminated supplied to be used, but it was believed that his protestations had been overruled by politicians who used him as a scapegoat.

[idun]

Yes, the alarm was raised, the politicians told him to get on with his job and shut up. Laurent Fabius was questioned? arrested? but like most slippery politicans, I cannot remember anything happening to him.

EDIT that is the thing, I remember what happened in France, I really do not know what happened elsewhere.

I can imagine John Hurt in an advert, he has a wonderful voice.

[Christine Animal]

[quote user="Cendrillon"]

I agree Rabbie, initially most people thought it was just the gay population that were in danger of getting aids.
[/quote]

And those using drugs passing the same needle around.

 

[5-element]

I was not in France in the early 80's. I was living in England (London) and this is when the National AIDS Helpline was set up. Early 80's, when male gay friends started getting ill and dying, as well as needle-sharers. We had to get thorough training to man the phone Helpline, including all the latest research about the HIV virus and modes of transmission - the level of ignorance in the general population was abysmal, as many people thought that you could "catch it" with sitting on lavatory seats (mind you, some still think you can also get pregnant that way!), kissing, shaking hands, using the same phone, even being in the same room etc... it was amazing how few people had the faintest notion about "exchange of body fluids".

Mind you, as well as some heartbreaking stories, we also had our share of pranks, and of truly unbalanced characters with extremely convoluted and unexpected stories which might even involve abduction by aliens.... Not just that, but it was highly educational when it came to sexual practices - I really did learn a few things from that job, even though I thought knew it all. 

I think the UK was quite ahead in those early 80's, with offering free telephone counselling. I don't think anything of the sort ever existed in France? As far as I know, there was never the same scandal as in France regarding contaminated blood used in transfusions. A distant relative of mine died of AIDS, apparently.

[Clarkkent]

[quote user="idun"]

Yes, the alarm was raised, the politicians told him to get on with his job and shut up. Laurent Fabius was questioned? arrested? but like most slippery politicans, I cannot remember anything happening to him.

[/quote]

Be careful what you say. At the time of the last presidential contest Laurent Fabius came third in the Socialist campaign behind Sego and ... wait for it ... DSK. Fabius is still a relatively young man. [6]

I seem to recall that the disgraced (and possibly fitted-up) Blood Transfusion Service director left France to work in England.

[idun]

I know Fabius should be called Monsieur Tefal, as getting anything to 'stick' is very hard.

DSK, yes in politics I suppose he is relatively young. Maybe he will be occupied on the other side of the Atlantic for some time to come, who knows?! If there is a trial and if he is found guilty I just hope that they don't allow him to do time in France, well all know what that means. Alain Mafart and Dominique Prieur are supreme examples of french contrition and justice at work. And still the NZ lamb keeps rolling in.[:@]

[5-element]

[quote user="idun"]

I know Fabius should be called Monsieur Tefal, as getting anything to 'stick' is very hard.

[/quote]

I was the only passenger on a coach recently, the driver started chatting and told me all about his sister, who had contracted HIV through a blood transfusion, and was very ill, still struggling with the virus after all these years. The whole family had ended up really loathing Laurent Fabius, as the ultimate person responsible for the contaminated blood cover-up.

[idun]

5E I'm sure that there are many people who have lost relatives or even been contaminated by relatives during that time. Shameful it really was.

I never knew of help lines in France, there may have been some at the time, I actually wouldn't like to say that there weren't. I know the whole debate about condoms and in fact male contraception is not something 'liked' in France. I have friends who had, what is in fact major surgery to get their tubes tied, as their 'men' would never in a million years have considered a vasectomy. I thought once all the men were going to faint when I mentioned it and the only one I now consider a 'man' was a greek and he thought it sounded a sensible idea.

[Frenchie]

I was a student in the 80s, and the first time I heard about AIDS was when Klaus Nomi died. ( Don't remember the year .)

We did not really worry about it, as we thought ( silly !!!) that it was mainly restricted to the big cities ( Paris, Lyon ..) , and mostly among homosexual men ...

I lived in London for a year  ( 1985/1986 ) , I don't remember anything about Aids .

I had my son in 1994 ; and had a blood transfusion,  lucky me, that was just after the end of the " sang contaminé" story.

Now, it seems that young people worry less about AIDS , as they assume you can still live almost normally with it, thanks to the " trithérapie".

That's without  considering all the sides effect of it .

I talked to my son , then 14, about the absolute necessity to use condoms when it is time for him to have sex, he was embarassed, and said " he knew" ... 

He also got a lot of information in school about it . ( How people can get contaminated/ how to use a condom, etc...)

But I'm not naive, I know he may forget about protection when he really wants a girl...

Worrying ...

[5-element]

Idun - vasectomy:

GULP!

In France, it only became legal....in 2001!!!

http://www.bonjour-docteur.com/article.asp?IdArticle=263

 

[idun]

My husband had a vasectomy in 1993 in France. It was done in a maternity clinic. When he first broached the subject, they said that he needed to see a psychiatrist. He didn't see one in the end. Our GP was not happy about it either, but he still refered him to the Dr that did it. The women who worked at the maternity clinic were also very disapproving, I had to add that, as they were.

With regards to my sons, they were my captive audience when I would be their taxi, I lectured about condoms etc from a fairly young age. In very simple terms in relation to their lack of  or limited knowledge at the time. And so it went on, Maman Poule and her talks about drugs and cigarettes and condoms until they were 'adult'.

I know that both my sons have been tested for STD's including AIDs/HIV. Both made the choice to do this after long term relationships were over. Seemed sensible to me to do that.

Apparently the over 50's and over 60's and over 70's  is more at risk of STD's these days. Well those who have affairs or are un attached and having casual sex or just finding someone new. Since my mother died, my father has had quite a lot of lady friends, I have no idea as to whether he realised he was in an 'at risk' group. And for all I could discuss such things with my kids, somehow, I just could not, AT ALL, with my father! He is now in his late 80's and when he went on holiday a few weeks ago, he came to my house to iron his clothes, and I could only wonder who he was meeting. My Dad never irons anything, ever! so who was he trying to impress?

[Clarkkent]

I had my vasectomy in 1986. It was done by a member of the GP practice and cost about £60 (including inspection of two samples after the event).

I took the afternoon off for the procedure, which took about 30 minutes, and went back to work the following day. I was fine, very little discomfort (even though a couple of days later my left one would have won prizes in the aubergine section at the local produce show) and there was only one of my regular activities which I could not immediately continue.

What never fails to amaze me is the French are even squeamish about having their male pets done!

[Pommier]

I took our puppy for his vaccination recently and the vet, after examaining him, asked if we were going to neuter the pup because if so it should be done before the first heat.

He was exteremely embarrassed when I pointed out that we actually have a male puppy, especially when I told him that yes, of course we'll be getting him castrated!

[LAiffricaine]

[quote user="idun"]   My husband had a vasectomy in 1993 in France. ... When he first broached the subject, they said that he needed to see a psychiatrist.  ..... [/quote]

 

Why is it that when one is absolutely sure in their mind that their family unit is complete and they want to have sterilisation/vasectomy/hysterectomy, then they are refered to a psychiatrist ?...

I had a hysterectomy (in UK) just before my 40th. I was adamant that I would not have a 3rd child as I could barely cope with 2. I also suffered with endometriosis so the best solution for me was to have the 'op'. I too was refered to a psychiatrist because I was deemed, at the time, far too young [:-))]  to fully know what I needed. Surely when you reach 40, had 2 children, run a business, look after an elderly parent, you are able to make some kind of sensible decision  [8-)] ...

 

and to cap it all, my husband had to sign his consent for the 'op' to proceed. Never was I so humiliated in my life  [:@]