Ex-pat groups

[Cendrillon]

As a lowly second home owner who has not left the U.K. and moved over to France or another country then I have no need for an ex-pat group. However suppose I moved to France / China / Brazil or wherever full time and enjoyed singing, acting or painting then I would be open to joining an all British / Eng. speaking choir, theatre group or art group. This would mean I could continue with my interests and make new friends rather than being lonely and sitting at home alone. In France I could cope with the language but in China for example it would be a totally different matter.

[Quillan]

[quote user="Cendrillon"]As a lowly second home owner who has not left the U.K.

[/quote]

You poor old lowly owner you. [;-)]

Actually if you look around there are normally loads of French clubs and you often find there are Brits as members as well. It's great for getting to grips with the lingo. We have an over 50's club (they also organise holidays and days out at cheap prices, I don't go on the holidays because I am not in to big group holidays) with about 20% Brits, a walking club with about 10% Brits, Boule club again about 10% Brits and of course the rugby club. Your local Fete committee is normally desperate for any help it can get which also helps with getting to know people locally, that's how I found my rugby friends.  There is a sort of unofficial dinning club in and around our village, mainly French again but also about 30% Brits. The locals know all the best restaurants out and about and it's great fun. So you don't have to join an Expats club you can join a club that does something your interested in which is basically what you would do in the UK. We also have a Ski club which I have not joined mainly because I do my skiing from the bar. [B] So to my mind your really isolating yourself in a way by joining and Expat club or set because they are generally only interested in one or two things where as if you embrace the French 'club scene' the world is your oyster and it is far more intresting.

[Cendrillon]

edit:

Less of the "old" please Quillan[;-)] As for "lowly" I only put that to show that my second home is certainly not a chateau or grande maison de maitre.

I agree with what you say about joining in with what's on offer. ......and I readily do so when I am in France! (though have not needed to join a club) 

[mint]

[quote user="Ivor Nidea"]

Seems I may be the only to own up to (or not too snobby to admit it) being a member of an ex-pat group. It would appear to me that the other members are mostly like other groups, some I get on with, some I don't and I guess the same goes for them. Even the French members are just like other people...funny that.

[/quote]

I really don't think it's to do with snobbishness, Ivor.

It's just that some of us are more sociable than others.  If you are a natural loner, then any sort of group or club situation is not going to be attractive.

I go to the gym but, mostly, apart from chatting to my neighbours during the short walk there and back, and exchanging polite greetings, it's not a situation where a lot of socialising is possible.

I don't belong to a walking club but I shall be volunteering for leading and marshalling duties this summer for the randos that the commune puts on.  I like to dictate my own terms of engagement and dislike any sort of formal "jollification".

There's a history society near us with what looks like quite an interesting programme and I have looked at their leaflets for months now but still hesitate to join IN CASE I DON'T LIKE THE PEOPLE....yes, totally PATHETIC!!!

Sometime, just sometimes, I do wish I was more clubbable.  

[Patf]

There are 2 expat groups here that I've thought of joining - one for sewing/knitting, and the other for learning french. I think they're both women only. But I've never got round to it. It's quite a commitment as it means driving quite a distance, and I don't like starting something then giving up to soon.

We've met many british families and couples since coming here and keep in touch regularly with a few, and I have one particular friend who lives down the road, but I don't feel the need for the support of a group of people, just because they come from the same country as me.

Sometimes, though, I feel I should make more effort, as it does get a bit lonely at this time of the year.

[Chancer]

I have and still do belong to various clubs and whilst the annual gorgefest is convivial enough I have long realised that around here at least friendships are no made with anyone outside of the family. I spend at least 6 evening and weekend hours every week with various clubs but I doubt a friendship will never be made however I am the eternal optimist.

Part of the problem is people gossiping and backbiting so people never want to be seen to be fraternising with the enemy, and anyone outside of the family is the enemy. The friends that I do have have warned me never to talk of our friendship  or to others and they are very cool with me in public if we meet in the street I know to shake hands not give a bise.

I go to keep fit classes 3 times per week, its the same group of mainly ladies for all 3 classes that I have known for 3 years now, other than a bonjour/bonsoir/bon soirée no-one has or will talk to me yet you see family clans who all turn towards each other and chat ignoring the rest of the class and the instructor which I find totally disrespectfull, you also get pairs of women, usually the younger ones who come just to lounge about on the floor chatting to each other like a slumber party (I dont know if they are family but most people are related) they even spend their time sending text messages etc and will occasionally raise a token leg usually for the preceding exercise.

However joy of joys I have made friends with 3 young girls in the class, teaching assistants at the lycée, one German, one Spanish and une Anglaise, they are coming to dinner tonight for the second time and its a great atmosphere, even they without any prompting from me have worked out to be rather cool and not show any signs of friendship in the keep fit classes.

On the positive side even though I wont make friends and the interactions are at a very basic level I do get out and I do see people which is a great thing for me.

The exceptions to the above and the friends that I have made are all either immigrants or have moved to the area for work and have previously worked overseas.

I have to say that were there a proper organised ex-pats club as opposed to a few opposing cliques it would be very tempting.

[NormanH]

That will keep your pecker up [6]

[Chancer]

I expressed myself badly, what I want to say is that any club that exists with at least a secondary mission of encouraging/enabling friendship would be very tempting, failing that any club with a significant proportion of either immigrants or people from outside the area, if that means an ex-pat club then so be it.

AVF was great for me as it was both, my new diving club has as its mission to be convivial and family friendly, its a great improvement on my last one but a much greater way from my home. I am still the newcomer there so time will tell.

And hey what do you know, the only people there who have made the effort with me is a multi-lingual immigrant couple, he is Dutch and she is Swiss.

[Gardengirl]

Chancer, like you I find AVF to be a great place to meet people, and we have quite a few friends who we met there. The fact that everyone is a newcomer to the area starts you off with something in common, and almost everyone without fail is friendly, whether they are particularly outgoing or not. Our walks into the main square from our home, about 5 minutes away, can take up to 45 minutes and occasionally more with all the handshakes and 3 kisses from the many AVF members we pass.

Our main friends in AVF are from one of the walking groups we go out with, plus some members who went out of their way to welcome us soon after we joined; one made a point on walks of walking along with my husband to make sure he could practise speaking French with her (she doesn't speak any English) - really kind. A large part of our social life is at AVF - walks, French classes, wine tasting, visits, lots of social evenings which all involve wine and food, and we very much enjoy the company of the 25 members of the English atelier we take, many of whom have become friends. I mention AVF to anyone who I meet and who is new to the area.

[Ivor Nidea]

There you are you see, it just takes one person to own up

and the others too afraid of what the rest may think of them admit to either

belonging to or would like to join some sort of similar group.

Following a major change in my life over here I eventually

came to realise that I would have to fight against my natural instincts and get

out to meet more people.  An ex-pat group

was the easiest way to do it.

Now, after a few years have passed, I find some of my

natural cynicisms of such groups were well founded whilst other fears I had

about my fellow human beings may have been misplaced.

Although still happy with my own company the few ancillary clubs

connected with the ex-pat group that I belong to give me the outside interest

that I need.

When I first came here I must admit to having the same views

as others, and couldn't imagine why I would want to join a group of "sad"

individuals that I came to France to escape from. It's then only the unexpected

that forces you to examine your own prejudices. Luckily I still retain plenty

of cynicisms learned over many years of dealing with people, some of them cynics just

like me.

[Quillan]

Well Chancer I never had you down a a sexual predator, visiting all these keep fit clubs watching young women in tight fitting leotards. You make DSK look normal by the sounds of things. Having them over for dinner? You should at least get Wooly over and perhaps he can collect Norms barrel on the way, come on don't be greedy. [;-)]

[woolybanana]

Having leopards for dinner....hmmmm, I rather think they might eat us up and spit us out. But, a night of contemplation would do old Normie good as he gets very housebound in his barrel - he even says he thinks the walls are curved. Must be his pills. Pity he is battery driven these days.

[Val_2]

Unfortunately for me, the majority of ex-pats in this area although very spread out are all mostly retirees over 70 so for me it would be like hanging around with my parents which is not condusive to my life and tastes and I definately don't want to know about their doctor visits and medications they are taking. I have a circle of friends and neighbours who are the same age and a little younger and so far the language has never proven to be any sort of barrier. Since becoming single again I can please myself with whom I go out with and where I go to without anyone nitpicking behind my back which is what happened when we first moved here and got involved with some brits who enjoyed slagging one another off leaving my family in the middle of it all and not wanting to take sides.

[Gardengirl]

[quote user="Ivor Nidea"]

There you are you see, it just takes one person to own up

and the others too afraid of what the rest may think of them admit to either

belonging to or would like to join some sort of similar group.[/quote]

Me? I'm very gregarious, and know lots of people in France, some of them English, American, Dutch.

I was talking about AVF, which has mostly French members - which isthe whole point of its existence. I don't avoid anyone generally speaking, although I won't join the ex-pat clique locally.

[YCCMB]

I guess the real question is when does a group of friends that you have chosen to associate with become an expat clique? When I get together with friends in France, there's often a big group. Are they a "group", though? And does the fact that they generally comprise half a dozen nationalities (including a fair number of French) make then an expat clique? I wonder...

[Chancer]

Quillan 99% of the women in the keep fit classes are about as far away from my memories and your imagination that is possible, the thought of any of them in a leotard just does not bear thinking about.

I am more feminine than the majority of them and I certainly have better legs, DSK would think that he had been sent to hell to repent his sins.

As for me being predatory, never in a million years, I did though start a relationship with one of the girls at AVF which whilst I dont regret I do regret having to leave the group after I seperated from her, she was on the bureau and it was a major part of her life.

Reading the comments here about AVF make me realise how much I miss it.

Re the cliques, ex pat or other, without going into detail what I was referring to is "you are either one of us and think like us or you are one of them" I was definitely classed as one of them and it was said that I had gone native, much the same closed mentality as the "everyone except my family is the enemy".

An ex pat group doesnt have to be like that, a group formed for a reason other than being an ex-pat and that has french members and other nationalities wouldnt be I'm sure but it could still be a clique.

[Quillan]

Re cliques, I love the way that some Brits think the French don't talk behind other peoples backs etc. As my French improved and I could sit to the side and listen in I realised making snide comments and being two faced is not just an English thing. Sometimes I wonder if it is that tiny bit of French blood traveling through our veins that make us do it. They can be quite nasty at times.

[powerdesal]

A number of comments mentioning AVF.

Do you have to be a clique member to know what the letters AVF mean.

[Chancer]

Accueil des villes françaises.

http://www.avf.asso.fr/Website/site/fra_quisommesnous_presentation.php

Quillan I dont labour under that misapprehension.

[idun]

[quote user="Quillan"]Re cliques, I love the way that some Brits think the French don't talk behind other peoples backs etc. As my French improved and I could sit to the side and listen in I realised making snide comments and being two faced is not just an English thing. Sometimes I wonder if it is that tiny bit of French blood traveling through our veins that make us do it. They can be quite nasty at times.[/quote]

Wasn't that my gripe on here years ago, that I would say that France was just a country and french people were just that, and behaved like people. Why all the bonjours and automatic politesse would seduce people into believing that it meant that 'people' were always nicer and more pleasant as a rule, was beyond me. I don't mind people being people.

[idun]

Chancer, why don't you join again? I can understand you staying away initially, but it is some time later and if you enjoyed it, well, join again, or at least test the waters?[:D]

[Gardengirl]

Chancer, maybe you'll rejoin AVF, especially if you enjoyed it and what it offered.

I've been surprised to see how much groups differ; our group gets together with others in the region from time to time, usually for walks. One group who we took on a walk to the Pont du Gard were amazed to find a foreigner in the group - me! All the others were French, and members from the visiting group informed me that they had no foreigners in their group. Some of our members started telling them what a lot they were missing - different experiences wecan share etc, andthe advantage of having language classes taken by native speakers at no cost. For those who don't know AVF, you pay a small annual fee and then all the activities are free, as they are all taken by members (unless there's a food, drink or transport etc element in the activity).

Our group is very 'dynamic', as new members always say; we have 3 levels of French on offer, 2 of English, plus Spanish. Plus all the art and craft activities, 3 levels of walks each week, theatre visits, days out, a wine tasting group (always over-subscribed - can't imagine why  [:D]), various card groups and many other activities I can't think of at the moment. I haven't found it cliquey; there are friendship groups, but everyone is very welcoming; I haven't heard anyone back-biting against another member in the 4 years since I joined - and my French is pretty good enough to catch nuances. I don't mean everyone becomes best buddies, of course.

I don't like cliques of any sort - that to me implies that it's a closed group, so whether it's an ex-pat group or people of any nationality, I prefer to stay outside.

[woolybanana]

Expat cliques are often enough largely made up of one nationality, and of people who would perhaps not naturally choose to rub shoulders but  are forced to because there is little other choice of people. Their common points are usually a way of preserving a bit of 'blighty' (Bobo, I hate that word!) because they are not really able to leave their home culture, their security blanket, and a need to find support when facing the host country. Beyond basics, such groups are always prone to schism, back biting and either to treating the home country as paradise or hell and the host country with hostility or patronage. Best avoided like the plague in my view, but then who wants to be friends with a loada Brits anyway!![6].

 

[Quillan]

[quote user="idun"][quote user="Quillan"]Re cliques, I love the way that some Brits think the French don't talk behind other peoples backs etc. As my French improved and I could sit to the side and listen in I realised making snide comments and being two faced is not just an English thing. Sometimes I wonder if it is that tiny bit of French blood traveling through our veins that make us do it. They can be quite nasty at times.[/quote]

Wasn't that my gripe on here years ago, that I would say that France was just a country and french people were just that, and behaved like people. Why all the bonjours and automatic politesse would seduce people into believing that it meant that 'people' were always nicer and more pleasant as a rule, was beyond me. I don't mind people being people.
[/quote]

Yes and it is also nice to live in a country where there is no crime, well if you only read English newspapers in France that is. [;-)]

[mint]

[quote user="woolybanana"]

Expat cliques are often enough largely made up of one nationality, and of people who would perhaps not naturally choose to rub shoulders but  are forced to because there is little other choice of people. Their common points are usually a way of preserving a bit of 'blighty' (Bobo, I hate that word!) because they are not really able to leave their home culture, their security blanket, and a need to find support when facing the host country. Beyond basics, such groups are always prone to schism, back biting and either to treating the home country as paradise or hell and the host country with hostility or patronage. Best avoided like the plague in my view, but then who wants to be friends with a loada Brits anyway!![6].

 

[/quote]

Good old Wools!  You've said all the things I think and would have liked to have said.  Alas, not having your facility for "telling it as it is", I didn't quite know how to put it so as not to upset sensitivities [:D]