Daft Doctor Posted June 18, 2012 Share Posted June 18, 2012 RSI are driving me mad. They asked for my wife's passport and birth certificate to verify her état civil, and we sent off a copy of both, with my OH's parents underlined on the copy birth certificate (for clarity, trying to be helpful). We have now received a letter saying that what we sent was unacceptable in that form and have asked for 'Un extrait d'acte de naissance sans rajouts, ni ratures accompagné de sa traduction assermentée par la cour d'appel'.Firstly do they want the actual birth certificate or does an unmarked and unaltered copy still suffice? Secondly, how the heck to I obtain a translation on oath by the court of appeal (if my translation of the last bit is right)? We know a french person who has a translation business in France, but its the legal bit that would be a stumbling block. Is it just a case of trawling the internet and if so, what am I looking for? Any assistance greatly appreciated. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
idun Posted June 18, 2012 Share Posted June 18, 2012 http://www.pagesjaunes.fr/trouverlesprofessionnels/rechercheClassique.doEDIT! Mince, it hasn't worked.......... go on the link and type in 'Traducteur assermenté and in the Ou? type 'haute savoie'Did you send a full birth certificate? They need a full one with all the names of parents on etc. edit again; You sent a copy? that you marked? no wonder you got it back.Now if there is a name change, other than marriage for a woman, you may hit a problem, no matter what that says. I personally know of a few people who have had name changes and they have not been accepted, acceptable. Hence for all they were initially registered as initially as say 'Margaret', when their father came home from a military posting said that he didn't like 'Margaret' and they changed her name to 'Elizabeth', this when she was only a few months old. In France she will forever be 'Margaret' even though she has never been 'Margaret' and no appealing worked!The only person on here who I think had such a problem was Iceni, and I cannot remember what happened with her. Her husband still posts from time to time. I know that some people on here have said that they did not need translations, but we did as did everyone else we knew. We had birth certificates, marriage and divorce papers all done. Expensive, but they did last all the time we were in France and there was never any confusion about anything. Everything clear and simple and in court approved french. sorry about the edits, my cat keeps reaching up and tapping my elbow and I have no idea what he wants, other than 'something'. He has really distracted me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NormanH Posted June 18, 2012 Share Posted June 18, 2012 You need to get a translation made by a traducteur assermenté That is to say a sworn translator (not made by the court, but by a translator accepted by the court) Here is the directory http://annuaire-traducteur-assermente.fr/I did it myself and got a friend who is assermenté to 'tampon' it, but that was because I was working for the same firm at the time.They will certainly want a copy of the full birth certificate as idun says.Usually they accept a certified copy which used to be easy as the Mairie would make one and stamp it as 'certifié', but I think Mairies no longer offer this service, though I may be mistaken.Have several copies made, as you will need them at various times. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
idun Posted June 18, 2012 Share Posted June 18, 2012 Ours had stopped doing certified copies before I left in 2008. However, as I knew them all well and can be good at 'pretty please's', they did some for me....... reluctantly.I certainly wouldn't count on the Mairie any more. I think that notaires would be the people to get these from now, but probably at a price. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daft Doctor Posted June 18, 2012 Author Share Posted June 18, 2012 Yes, sent a photocopy of the full birth certificate, with parents on, the original type, hand written. I obviously misunderstood the original letter, which asked for a birth certfifcate 'avec filiation (Indication des noms et prénoms du père et de la mère)' and thought by indicating by underlining I was helping out, clearly not!!I am always reticent to send original anything anywhere, for fear I'll never see it again and have to replace it. Of course we have to go along with the (unnecessary) bureaucrasy in France and were adequately forewarned of it, but to say that they aren't willing to or cannot extract the mother and father's names from an English birth certificate is qf taking the p155.I will follow your link and find someone local to do this, at a pretty price no doubt. As an aside though, its not just French bureasucrasy that's frustrating. I have tried to change my UK address to the French one with Lloyds bank twice now. They said initially that I'd need a certified copy of my passport (legally signed in France) before they could do so, They then said a Dr could do it and told me on the phone that one of my former UK colleagues would be fine as long as they followed the protocol and had the copies signed and stamped correctly. I did all that and guess what they have refused it again!! When I can be bothered I will ring them again for what it's worth. Thanks for your help Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EmilyA Posted June 18, 2012 Share Posted June 18, 2012 Welcome to the wonderful world of RSI. During the life cycle of our business / retirement / pension, I have made the round trip of 120km approximately six to eight times a year to our regional office. Rule 1 is that you always need to go in person; phone calls don't work, emails ditto (think someone once said a smoke signal would have as much chance), recorded deliveries - sometimes. Rule 2 is that you need a copy all your paperwork every time (went there this week and a man got out of his car with the most enormous cardboard box of paperwork I have ever seen.). Rule 3. Get there early to avoid the queues; the ladies on the desk have always been helpful, we have got quite friendly with some of them. Having said that, although I must have provided about 6 copies each of my birth / marriage certificates I have never been asked for a translation. I have sometimes translated bits myself (er marriage is mariage etc). I can see the underlining would upset them, so I would try going in person with a fresh copy. It has got to be cheaper than a translator and it will help you to get to know them.There is a lot on this forum and others that will give you a flavour of what you are likely to encounter with this "organisation".Good luck. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
andyh4 Posted June 18, 2012 Share Posted June 18, 2012 Nothing to do specifically wth RSI since CPAM have requested the same from me recently - AND - they think they need the birth certificates legalised! Fortunately I have found a Government site that sows this is not required. I wonder if there is some tightening up of the systems that is being put in place. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wilko Posted June 18, 2012 Share Posted June 18, 2012 Am just going through that here with RSI. Emily A gives the best advice you have to go and see them then it'll work. I wasn't asked for anything to be translated but they would not accept my "short birth certificate". I contacted UK and some very helpful woman arranged for a copy of a full BC for around £10 which arrived 10 days later. Took it to RSI and everything is now working...............I am pursuing medical payments incurred prior to receiving my CV.Lesson is in France go and see 'em........only way it works, also keeps 'em in their job.W Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
idun Posted June 18, 2012 Share Posted June 18, 2012 But DD is in the Rhone Alpes, as was I, and compared to what I have heard from posters elsewhere in France, the authorities are often 'stricter' about paperwork. Still going in to see them is a good idea. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daft Doctor Posted June 18, 2012 Author Share Posted June 18, 2012 Thanks for all the useful advice. As we have the full and original birth certificate, I think a trip to Annecy would be worth doing, maybe combine it with a bit of shopping. If that's no good there are 10 court approved traducteurs in Haute Savoie, including one only 10 miles away in Chamonix, so we can jettison a load of euros to translate those difficult mother and father words, so tricky for the French!Our local CPAM certainly accepted mine and my son's birth certifcates without question and without translation when we registered our S1's (my wife is an AE hence involvement of RSI for her). They gave me copies at the time then sent the originals back to me about 2 weeks later. On that subject, CPAM have now asked me send photocopies of our passports and at the same time forward a completed 'Declaration de Choix du Médicin Traitant'. My understanding is however that I will have to make a Dr's appointment at a cost of 22-28 euros just for the priviledge of getting him to agree to take me on. I'm a just retired GP for goodness sake, I don't need to see a Dr and less need to spend the money! Can I not just go in, talk to reception (if there is one) and ask to get the Dr to sign it? Must I consult when I have no need? Couldn't I just take the copies of the passports with me and drop by CPAM in Annecy when we're visiting RSI and just tell them I'll send the signed form when I actually need and have seen a Dr on a medical pretext? Insight on that one welcomed too! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wilko Posted June 18, 2012 Share Posted June 18, 2012 DD............for 22-28 euros go and see the Dr and then go to RSI.............logic isn't something that works in a situation like this in France. Paying 28 euros is going to save you a lot of time.......and time is money.When in Rome !!W Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
idun Posted June 18, 2012 Share Posted June 18, 2012 PLEASE do not even suggest that GP's in France get receptionists, please do not. They are........ well, I have an extreme case of hating them and all their works. And how could a french GP afford one to start with. They only get approx 23€ a consult and no one else pays them. I like the french system. I like the way we keep our own medical records and xrays and lab results and the way the pharmacie works. I like it a lot. Now my GP in the UK, with their salary which I know is exceedingly higher than my french GP's, as my french GP had quite a few comments about it, charges exhorbitant sums for any signed paper work. Whereas my french GP never charged a sou and in France we needed quite a lot of signed stuff. (and yours may not charge either)http://vosdroits.service-public.fr/R10884.xhtml Just download and print this form and then when you really need to see your chosen GP, get them to tampon and sign it and send it off with your feuille de soins, as I imagine it will take some time for a carte vitale to get to you, so you'll be paying up front and reclaiming. Incidentally you don't have to have a chosen Dr. It's just that they don't reimburse as much if you don't. Everything is on the ameli.fr website. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NormanH Posted June 18, 2012 Share Posted June 18, 2012 Go and see your chosen GP. It costs 23€ (not 28) and you will be reimbursed most of that anyway.You may even be able to make some sort of social contact.It is also useful to start up your (self-held) medical history in France.French people have a 'carnet de santé' a book with all their vaccinations treatments etc which they keep and produce when necessary, as well as all the X rays IRM scans etc.It's quite useful to set the ball rolling with that. Obviously you know about medical matters, but I have the impression that you have the 'English disease' of wanting to do things in the English way, i.e. with our logic.As Wilko says, just do it the French way and obey [:)] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daft Doctor Posted June 19, 2012 Author Share Posted June 19, 2012 Hi Norman, I see your point but I don't necessarily think of it as having an English 'disease' but rather still having an English way of thinking, i.e. try to do things efficiently and logically. Having said that, you are absolutely right, it's best just to play the game and get on with it. I'll go and see the local doc and get him to sign the form. As for the traduction of my wife's birth cert, if its under 60 euros it might be worth doing rather than trailing to Annecy with the English original just to be told 'non'. I'll ponder further. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NormanH Posted June 19, 2012 Share Posted June 19, 2012 As I said before I did it my self.Have a look at this site and read the guides (it is from Cambridge University, intended to help their language students on their year in France as assistant(e)s)The following documents have been provided by the British Council to help students needing to translate their Birth Certificate into French:http://www.mml.cam.ac.uk/ya/yahelp.htmlYou could always sign yourself (being a Doctor I am sure nobody can read what you write) but you will be floored if they ask for a 'tampon' or official stamp.It has worked for some... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daft Doctor Posted June 19, 2012 Author Share Posted June 19, 2012 Thanks Norman, that is fantastically helpful. I will try that route first and revert to professional help if that too is rejected. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
derf Posted June 19, 2012 Share Posted June 19, 2012 You could try THIS Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daft Doctor Posted July 20, 2012 Author Share Posted July 20, 2012 Just an update, got the birth certificate translated by a traducteur assermentée and returned to me for 20 euros, an excellent service. If anyone wants the contact details, please pm me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Russethouse Posted July 21, 2012 Share Posted July 21, 2012 FWIW Official copies of English birth certificates are fairly inexpensive and if you phone the place where your wife was born you can sometimes pay by cc. I've always found the staff very helpful.You then don't have to worry about the original being lost or damaged. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
idun Posted July 21, 2012 Share Posted July 21, 2012 There can actually be a problem with the dates on the copies. A french birth certificate is only valid for 3 months, or at least it was. And sometimes fonctionnaires like to see them that are less than three months old. Daft Doctor, you did well, you paid less than us thirty years ago! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daft Doctor Posted July 22, 2012 Author Share Posted July 22, 2012 Having been reliably informed that the moderators won't mind a genuine 3rd party recommendation and having checked it is ok with the traducteur assermentée that I used, the contact name is Pascal Amann and his email address is [email protected]. As I said, he provided a quick and curteous service for me so hopefully that might be useful to others. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LaBouche Posted August 23, 2012 Share Posted August 23, 2012 If you already have a pension scheme in the UK then you can tell them to take a hike. Under European law ANY pension scheme from within the EU is acceptable and is all you need. Just keep telling them that. We did. Eventually after two years of asking us to provide documents that do not exist outside France they gave up. This was 9 years ago. The French seem to think that the documents they issue are also issued by all countries around the world....you have to stand up to them and explain this is not so. There is a point where you have to say 'Non, c'est impossible'. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NormanH Posted August 23, 2012 Share Posted August 23, 2012 Can you help us by quoting the European law that says that translations of documents are not required?Can you also explain the odd phrase 'take a hike'?This is what it means to mehttp://www.takeahike.org.uk/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Russethouse Posted August 23, 2012 Share Posted August 23, 2012 I can't help with the reference, but " take a hike" means " get lost" as far as I know. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NormanH Posted August 23, 2012 Share Posted August 23, 2012 I thought it meant go walking in the country. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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