can ex-pats renew UK driving license

[AnOther]

It's not multilingual nor does it need to be, it's a standard format letter stating the groups you are entitled to drive (which are harmonised across the EU) and is procured by a simple phone call to DVLA and £5 off your credit card, including posting to France or wherever. It is valid for 3 months from date of issue. No sample as it not available online but my OH has one tucked away somewhere which she got but never needed in the end.

[quote user="Benjamin"]There's a wider issue here. We would all like to opt in/out of the laws of whichever country we live in. Unfortunately the result of that is anarchy.[/quote]A harsh an frankly insulting generalisation, I think you'd best speak for yourself on that one. And in any case the law - if it is a law - which is being broken is a UK one not French which is where we live [;-)]

[Daft Doctor]

I'm moving to France next year and it so happens that my photo needed renewing last month. That gives at least 10 years before I need to renew again, as the DVLA website clearly states that you do not need to inform them of a change of address if you are moving abroad.

It so happened the timing was perfect for me, but I'm not sure whether you can voluntaily update the photo on your licence (the DVLA website doesn't make that clear). If you can, it would make sense for all moving abroad to do so, thereby delaying any difficulties in renewing the licence or photo later on.

As an aside, I think there is a big difference between failing to complete and return a statutory form such as e.g. the UK Census or the Valuation Office form mentioned above and putting a 'convenient' UK address on a driving licence renewal. The latter may or may not be illegal but it harms no-one in my opinion and is hardly a hanging offence. Those who do that are probably simply trying to avoid (often hideous) foreign bureaucrasy and if they are willing to take the small risk of a fine or a reprimand that's up to them. Self righteousness is a very dangerous game, as many a politician and American evangelist would say. I wonder for instance if Benjamin can say that he has never exceeded a speed limit? Best not to criticise others, that's my opinion.

[Will]

Unlike several people here, I do not pretend to be a lawyer.

But as far as I am aware, a licence from one EU state can be used in another EU state as long as the licence remains valid (before it expires you need to change it for a licence issued by the country in which you are resident). DVLA asks you to renew the photograph every few years (10 I think); although I haven't found anything that gives chapter and verse, I agree with Powerdesal that all the indications are that an out-of-date photograph does not, or should not, affect the validity of the licence itself.

I think you would need to ask the DVLA about whether or not you could get a new photocard sent to an overseas address, or if they would send it to a UK forwarding address.

I can't find any information about an 'international driving licence' as such - all I can find is an 'international driving permit' which is requested by some countries, and is issued as a supplement to a (not a replacement for) standard national licence.

[Benjamin]

[quote user="Daft Doctor"] I wonder for instance if Benjamin can say that he has never exceeded a speed limit? Best not to criticise others, that's my opinion.[/quote]

That's the normal tired old statement that gets dragged out in these circumstances. Where do you draw the line?

Bending the rules to obtain a replacement driving licence, speeding, a bit of "harmless" shopliffiting, driving without insurance, fiddling benefits?

[Benjamin]

AnOther

We're clearly going to disagree on this one and I see little point in kicking it backwards and forwards all day long. Thank you for the trouble you've gone to to investigate your side of the argument. In the circumstances regarding bending the rules concerning convenient addresses I still can't see DVLA being all that co-operative.

[Gardener]

From the daily mail recently about expiring licences.

Motorists who fail to renew their licences in time are allowed to continue driving but the

"DVLA says they could be charged with 'failing to surrender their licence', an offence carrying a £1,000 fine. ..

A spokesman said: 'It is important that photocards are updated every ten years to ensure the police and other enforcement agencies can identify whether a driving licence is being used fraudulently.'

The agency is sending reminders to drivers whose photocard is due to expire, and no one has so far been charged with failing to surrender their licence.

The Association of British Insurers and the Department for Transport said that insurance cover was not affected if drivers failed to update their photocard."

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1054636/More-40-000-unwitting-motorists-face-1-000-fines-thousands-photocard-driving-licences-expire.html#ixzz1Rauqeesj

If I hadn't changed to a French one I'd take my chances with an expired licence rather than make a false declaration about an address.

[Daft Doctor]

Where do you draw the line in your personal activities Benjamin, since you are the one 'throwing stones'. How much glass is there in your house?.

There is a huge difference morally IMHO between shoplifting, speeding, fiddling benefits and driving without insurance, all of which have or have the potential to adversely affect others (physically, financially or other) and using a friends or relatives UK address to avoid the pain of trying to renew your UK driving licence. What possible moral harm can that do?? I didn't say that it was not illegal by the way, nor did I endorse the practice, just said that it is dangerous indeed to pass judgement on others, though Benjamin you are of course absolutely entitled to your opinion.

[Salty Sam]

[quote user="AnOther"]

The rules say 'holds, or has held and is not disqualified from holding' a driving licence so the only way you would actually be driving without a licence is if you were disqualified or it had been revoked or suspended which can happen if for instance you have been convicted of an offence but have failed to submit your licence for the endorsement to be entered on it.

To the best of my knowledge there are no other ways in which they can take away your right to drive.

Anything else, such as an expired photocard or failure to notify a change of address (or even supplying a false one), is simply a potential fine.[/quote]

It is important to know when your driving licence expiry date is (or was), as it is illegal to drive without a valid licence. Although the DVLA may send renewal reminders prior to the expiry date, it is your responsibility to make sure that your licence is up-to-date, including getting renewal forms if necessary. Driving without a valid driving licence can result in a fine of up to £1,000, and between three and six penalty points on your licence. Your car can also be seized.

If your Photo Driving Licence has expired, you can be fined up to £1,000. It should be renewed every 10 years, but if you fail to do so, it can result in your driving licence becoming invalid. You can choose to update your photo sooner than this if your appearance changes significantly. This can be done online via direct.gov.uk or by filling in the DVLA's D1 application form, which you can get online, from the DVLA form ordering service or from certain Post Office branches.

Renewing a Driving Licence that has been Expired for Some Time
If more than two years has passed since your driving licence expired, you may be made to retake your driving test in order to get a new licence. This is especially the case if your licence has expired due to age (driving licences need to be renewed when you reach seventy) or medical reasons. For these, you may also have to pass a medical. In other cases, you can simply apply for a new licence without problem, although the DVLA will often want to know why your licence has been expired for so long.

[Gardener]

The licence remains valid until you are 70.

It is the card which expires after 10 years.

Which is probably why on the snippet I posted from the Daily Mail ( not the most relaible source granted but they have quoted direct) that even if your card is out of date, it doesn't affect your insuarance. If both your card and licence were out of date eg a person had failed to have it renewed at 70, then it almost certainly would invalidate your insurance.

[Salty Sam]

Drive without a valid licence and you drive a motor vehicle other than in accordance with a licence authorising you to drive a motor vehicle of that class. Contrary to section 87 (1) of the Road Traffic Act 1988 and Schedule 2 to the Road Traffic Offenders Act 1988.

THE ROAD TRAFFIC ACT STATES:
 (a) The ability to fine a customer who does not update his or her photograph is captured under Section 99(5) of the Road Traffic Act 1988 c.52. Section 99(4) also includes image/photograph.
 (b) Section 99 (5) states " A person who fails to comply with the duty under subsection (4) above is guilty of an offence
 (c) The related offence description and fine is given under RTA section 99 of the Road Traffic Offenders Act 1988 c.53 :
 (d) RTS section 99 states "Driving licence holder failing, when his particulars become incorrect, to surrender licence and give particulars" .The level of the fine is £1000.

The Road Traffic Act is Law!

[Gardener]

Yes agreed. But no one here afaik doesn't have a valid licence. They may not have a valid photo card.

"Why do I need to renew the photocard part of my driving licence?

You need to renew when the photograph on your photocard driving licence is nearly 10 years old – because the photo is not recent, it may no longer be a true likeness of you.

Photocard driving licences were first introduced in 1998 and everyone needs to renew their photo every 10 years – except for drivers over 70 and others with a short period driving licence.

It is only the photo on your card that expires, not your entitlement to drive."

So whilst you may get fined up to £1000 for not updating your card. This has nothing to do with the actual driving licence or your entitlement to drive.

[nomoss]

I sometimes get the feeling that some contributors here, in another life, used to sit behind desks and hand out forms to fill [6]

[Mr Coeur de Lion]

I'm so happy I still have my old paper licence which doesn't have the need to have my photo on it and thus never needs to be updated til I turn 70.

Mind you, it gets some laughs over here when I open it up!

[Salty Sam]

[quote user="Mr Coeur de Lion"]I'm so happy I still have my old paper licence which doesn't have the need to have my photo on it and thus never needs to be updated til I turn 70. Mind you, it gets some laughs over here when I open it up![/quote]

[:D]

That's the subject of a new thread!

[Mr Coeur de Lion]

It's like opening up a treasure map.

It's held together with sticky tape. I've put it away in a safe place now to preserve it :)

[AnOther]

You mean you don't carry it with you when driving [:-))]

[Cendrillon]

re. paper driving license

I've got one of those too! Hands up all of you who still have the vintage version[;-)]

[Mr Coeur de Lion]

Mine's the "newer" paper type (about 20 years old), pink in colour because I sent it back for them to take the points off they'd written on it.

If I carried it, it would fall apart in no time. Fortunately I carry my New Jersey licence with me :)

[pachapapa]

[quote user="nomoss"]I sometimes get the feeling that some contributors here, in another life, used to sit behind desks and hand out forms to fill [6][/quote]

whilst wearing a peaked cap with a yellow band, no doubt.

 

[Chancer]

Mines an original green one and I have no intention of changing it, I may live in la la land according to some who dislike my username but un con I am not.

My fathers driving license was my favorite, he just handed over his half a crown at the post office and "le voila!" he had a driving license valid untill he was 70, he said it cost the same as a dog license but it may have been a fishing permit.

[Benjamin]

And there was me thinking my little billet doux had missed it's mark JRs.  [:P]

[idun]

[quote user="Benjamin"]And there was me thinking my little billet doux had missed it's mark JRs.  [:P]



[/quote]

 

You have just made me feel very old now Benjamin. There was a really good series on french tv called Billet Doux, with Pierre Mondy. I just looked it up and it was in 1984, I don't remember it being so loooonnnnggggg ago[8-)]