13 amp aga

[Lotmontel]

Hi

Does anyone know if it is possible to install a 13 amp aga in France?  AgaFrance only sell 16 amp ones.  What is the difference between 13 and 16 amps?  Obviously, I'm no physicist!

Many thanks if anyone can advise me!

Lot 

[napoleon]

I am not sure of the answer but here is a possible explanation.

In the UK it is convenient to specify "13A" so that the appliance can be plugged into any 13A socket which is part of a 30A ring main. In France there is no such socket available (or needed). The appliance is therefore specified for connection to a standard 16A radial circuit with its own MCB at the consumer unit.

Without knowing for certain, it would appear that Aga simply rebadge the same cooker so that it is recognised as usable in the two countries.

Alistair

[Owens88]

I am not an electrician but..

 

Even if there is a difference between the two Aga's' the 13 amp one should only 'pull' what it needs. The 16 Amp circuit can deliver more but won't force the 13 A device to take it.However you might check other threads about voltage variations Uk and France and whether an AGA is senstive (I doubt it).

Your cooker 'socket' may be a hard wired type or one with a ginormous plug.  I think mine in france has a ginormous plug.

 

John

 

 

 

[powerdesal]

[quote user="Lotmontel"]

Hi

Does anyone know if it is possible to install a 13 amp aga in France?  yes

AgaFrance only sell 16 amp ones.  What is the difference between 13 and 16 amps?   3 amps

Obviously, I'm no physicist!  Agreed

Many thanks if anyone can advise me!  I assume the 16 amp French rating is because the Aga in France has to be connected to its own dedicated disjoncteur (double pole mcb) of not less than 16 amps ( not more either, use the correct one ). I assume the UK one can be plugged in to a standard 13 amp socket outlet in the kitchen ring (or wherever the AGA is).

Lot 

[/quote]

[pip24]

Hi,  Usually appliances are power rated in watts not amps.

However the power formula is volts x amps = watts 

In the U.K the voltage is 240v.   Therefore 240v x 13a = 3120 watts power consumption. (U.K aga may be rated 3kw)

If this was installed on a French system it would be 3120watts divided the voltage of 220v  = 14.18 amps. This is less than the 16 amp French rated unit 

You say the aga in France is 16 amps.

If the voltage in France is 220 volts and the French aga takes 16 amps the power consumption would be 220 x 16 = 3520 watts (The French aga may be rated 3.5kw)

I suspect that the performance would be slightly less hot than the French unit.

I hope this is of help to you

 

[Théière]

Most of the time the voltage in the UK is also 230 or there abouts. We buy a lot of it from EDF in France.

http://wiki.answers.com/Q/What_is_the_household_AC_electrical_power_mains_voltage_in_the_UK

[Pierre ZFP]

I strongly disagree with the above.

The UK hasn't been on 240 volts for years

The whole of Europe is on 'Eurovolts' (for want of a better word) which is a nominal 230 volts.  Yes it does vary a bit but 'must' stay within pretty strict limits just to prevent the kind of issue that you describe.

[pip24]

Hi Pierre, 

                 I have just checked the voltage in my socket and it is 247 volts  would you like to strongly dissagree with that ?

[powerdesal]

[quote user="pip24"]

Hi Pierre, 

                 I have just checked the voltage in my socket and it is 247 volts  would you like to strongly dissagree with that ?

[/quote]

Following voltage harmonisation all electricity supply within the EU is now nominally 230 V +/− 10% (though some countries have stricter specifications: for example, the UK specifies 230 V +10% -6%).

In practice this means that countries such as the UK that previously

supplied 240 V continue to do so, and those that previously supplied

220 V continue to do so.

So your 247v is within spec, but all Europe is 'supposed' to be harmonised.

[pip24]

Thanks for that  info powerdesal.

If you read the thread from the begining you will see That I was trying to help someone by giving a simple example.

I did not expect to be shot down by Pierre with a "I strongly disagree" and rant on voltage. I do know what the voltages are supposed to be. I think that a post like Pierre's did not help the original posters problem one tiny bit. It would have been more constructive to help, not give an opinion.

Obviously you have an interest in electricity, Maybe you are qualified to help the original poster.

 

[Théière]

[quote user="pip24"]

I did not expect to be shot down by Pierre with a "I strongly disagree" and rant on voltage. I do know what the voltages are supposed to be. I think that a post like Pierre's did not help the original posters problem one tiny bit. It would have been more constructive to help, not give an opinion.

[/quote]

A rant, hardly a rant, Peirre was only adding to the thread. I posted the wiki info to shed some light.

It would not make any difference if it was plugged into a potential 16 amp supply the heating elements only draw what they need and they are fused just above that in case of a fault in the circuit somwhere. Its the same as plugging a 60 watt lamp into a 30 amp ring circuit, the lamp only draws what it needs. I thought you explained it ok.[geek]

My only concern is does the AGA have a certificate for use in France? a CE stamp for example.

[powerdesal]

'Obviously you have an interest in electricity,'........I think the 'power' in powerdesal might be a bit of a give way   [:P]

In terms of the OP,......I cannot imagine that AGA are building units which are specific for UK and separately specific for France. It would not be cost effective, particularly as voltages are (supposedly) harmonised. Therefore the OP has no problem fitting a UK AGA in France, as long as all the connection is properly to French Codes and Normes.

It should perhaps be pointed out that an electrical AGA is really a 'fake AGA' as AGAs are supposed to be solid fuel units. It would seem that Tradition has been sacrificed on the altar of yuppie expediency. [:(]

My original answer to the OPs question of the difference between 13A and 16A ....(3amps) was, I admit, a little cheeky.!!!

[Pierre ZFP]

Sorry if it came over as a rant, wasn't meant to be.  I'm happy to be corrected as I thought the tolerance on 230 volts was much closer than it obviously is.

Anyway, another thought strikes me.  I always imagined AGAs to be big beasties, not the sort of thing that you would just plug into a 13 (or 16) amp socket ??

[CeeJay]

Forgive me if I am talking absolute rubbish but I was under the impression that all cuisinieres had to be wired in 6mm cable on a dedicated circuit back to a 32A disjoncteur. A separate four can be wired in 2.5mm, or 4mm depending on the output,  but must be on its own circuit and back to a 20A disjoncteur. Thereagain I might be totally wrong!

[powerdesal]

Ceejay, I think you are right, I cant check my books because they are there and I am here, but I seem to remember something of the sort.

I am a tad confused about the ''13Amp AGA'' even after looking at the AGA website. I get the impression that, rather than being a 'conventional' type of electric cooker, it has, instead, some heating elements that continously keep the stove 'mass' warm (cast iron) and kick in to a higher power as required. All electronically controlled by an 'AIMS' controller. Presumably, in this way they can keep the power requirement down to less than 3kw and hence the 13Amp reference.

[Lotmontel]

Thank you for all the replies (even the cheeky one!!).  I find amps / volts / watts really confusing - don't know how I managed to pass O'level Physics!  I think I'll discuss this with our electrician.  One of my concerns was that if we bought the Aga in France (16 amp), it may not be suitable for the UK (should we ever go back).

Thanks again for the helpful replies.

Lot

[Théière]

Lotmontel, the fact you passed O'level physics is because you were able to regurgetate what you had learnt on demand and not that you understood what was being taught, hey ho that's our school system. [:D] (no offence meant)

If you purchase in france and go back to the UK it will be fine, cookers are on their own dedicated circuit here too. Think electric shower 43 amps, 10.5 kw. Unheard of in France but common place in the UK

Its all to do with heat, an appliance (3kw, 12.5 amp ish) causes the cable to get warm, if the cable is rated high enough (6mm=40 amp) no problem. if the cable is not rated high enough (1.5mm=18amp) it gets too hot.

If your appliance is rated at 16 amps they would apply a 100% saftey margin i.e. 32amp and then go to the next cable size up hence 6mm cable.

Cookers should not be plugged into ring main circuits in the uk, they should be on a dedicated circuit, part of the reason why the ring circuit may eventually be outlawed in the UK is, if a break in the ring circuit were to occur you could have a cooker or electric fire or both running on a 2.5mm cable (24 amps) and that would be getting quite warm. Although from my example above (1.5mm = 18 amp rating you technically could run the cooker off that  DON'T)

(cable ratings are BASEC uk standard and may be rated differently in France. Adopt only the regulations of the country you are in)

[BJSLIV]

Cookers should not be plugged into ring main circuits in the UK

I agree entirely with your thoughts but it's interesting to see that Aga's installation instructions state.......

Designed for connection to a normal 13 amp domestic electrical supply. A 13 amp safety plug may be used providing that this is of a high quality to British Standards 1363, but direct wiring to a double pole switch is to be preferred.

http://www.aga-web.co.uk/agatech/inst4b-13a.htm

[Théière]

A testament to how good our good quality plugs are, (no poundland rubbish). Better keep a supply of 13 fuses nearby 5% tolerance on fuse rating I believe = 12.35 amps

Keep the number of your local takeaway nearby too [:D]

[powerdesal]

I still maintain that a non-solid fuel AGA is a yuppy fake  [:P]

[napoleon]

[quote user="powerdesal"]I still maintain that a non-solid fuel AGA is a yuppy fake  [:P]
[/quote]

You are surely right about the solid fuel AGA but, although I fail the yuppy test on all but one of the test questions, I am happy to stick to the convenience of our gas Aga and leave the logs and coal for the multi-fuel burner in the next room.

Alistair

[Jerac]

In all of this no-one has asked, or answered, the question as to what type of Aga it is - gas, oil, solid fuel. If it is described as 13amp it cannot be all electric.  I suspect that it derives its heat from combustion and only requires mains power for something like pump / flue fan / igniter / timer, in which case it will be perfectly happy just plugged into a mains outlet of whatever nationality.

[BJSLIV]

No its 100% electric. Its a specific model "The 13 amp Aga".

It works a bit like a night storage heater.

http://www.tncook.co.uk/newelectricaga.html

[Théière]

It's a Sunday, be nice to every body on a Sunday [:D]

Please re read the posts Jerac,

Cookers should not be plugged into ring main circuits in the UK

I agree entirely with your thoughts but it's interesting to see that Aga's installation instructions state.......

Designed for connection to a normal 13 amp domestic electrical supply. A 13 amp safety plug may be used providing that this is of a high quality to British Standards 1363, but direct wiring to a double pole switch is to be preferred.

http://www.aga-web.co.uk/agatech/inst4b-13a.htm

Or this page of AGA's information

Fan, igniter or timer would only require the appliance to be fused at 3 amps.

[just john]

I really don't get some people's bad humour on this forum generally, perhaps its best to ignore it,
or maybe they should take a pee before peeing people off.

Back to reality, an ad in Sat's Torygraph for the Aga 20:20 EcoVision (designed over 20 years ago) to run on Economy 7 for those in love with off peak electricity, the offer is for 20% off of the 30amp night storage AGA cooker fo the next 20 days. see www.economy7aga.co.uk before 21st March.

Usual disclaimer, I have absolutely no interest in this promotion (unless there's a verrrr verrrr large drink in it for me)[8-|]