alittlebitfrench Posted October 10, 2016 Share Posted October 10, 2016 How about this for a cheap holiday home.Now, I know this place and the countryside around this little town is beautiful. Also, it is is not in the SW which means your neighbours will not be British.https://www.leboncoin.fr/ventes_immobilieres/1030531230.htm?ca=15_s Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chancer Posted October 10, 2016 Share Posted October 10, 2016 Thats double what its value is! Le prix indiqué comprend les honoraires à la charge de l'acheteur : 50% du prix du bien. Refreshingly honest hein! You can't even buy a decent second hand car in France for €4500 [:(] Lovely staircase as well! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alittlebitfrench Posted October 10, 2016 Author Share Posted October 10, 2016 Ok, OK , OK. Well offer 2000 euros and nick the staircase.This is for you Chancer...your own tower block in the Vosges. You are good at this type of thing.https://www.leboncoin.fr/ventes_immobilieres/753903827.htm?ca=15_sWhat is the catch with this one ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chancer Posted October 10, 2016 Share Posted October 10, 2016 On the face of it its cheap but...............Looking at it i would say that it was one of the new build Scellier or Robien immeubles where the individual apparts that were sold by sharks in smart suits to naive investors all of which will have lost their shirt and their fiscality. There are probably scores of identical untenanted blocks all around it, the area will have been saturated and their will probably be 10 new apartments for every potential renter most of which probably wont have the means to pass by an agency. The duped investors will have paid €120K plus with the promise of sky high rents which would pay for the place plus a big defiscalisation, the latter they will have lost if they didnt find tenants within 12 or 24 months. So on that basis, without even knowing what rent the apartments may bring in, are they worth €54K each? There are 2 big blocks like that in my local town that have stuffed the non meublée market, initially up for €1200pcm now they are down to €350 and still half unnocupied, many have never ever found tenants. And yet I am expecting to sell for more than that, perhaps significantly more for a 90 year old building a fraction of the size. If you have a good search around your rubrique on the impôts website you will find a but that searches for property sales prices in your area, search for results of "immeubles de rapport" and it will give the sale price, the date, how many apartments, the total superficie and the year of construction, it will show some really surprising results, new builds like that for next to no money and much smaller old building like mine for a fortune by comparison. Bottom line is it is worth a multiple of what it will bring in after costs, money is cheap to borrow and there is practically no return on savings so prices of building that have high occupancy and high rents are high, those like the one linked are cheap for a reason. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pierre ZFP Posted October 11, 2016 Share Posted October 11, 2016 Well it's not far from La Bresse so you could have weekends skiing and wonderful walking country in the summer.It is in need of complete renovation though and the perceived wisdom here is that you have to budget for a grand per sq metre. so 90 sq Metres and you're in for €90K on top of the purchase price. Can't see anyone recouping that in this lifetime Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NormanH Posted October 11, 2016 Share Posted October 11, 2016 And you'd need your winter woolies.On Fr2 news last night it was reported that the first snows were already falling on the les Ballons.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pierre ZFP Posted October 11, 2016 Share Posted October 11, 2016 Very true. I've had to scrape ice off my windscreen twice in the last week and the forecast is even colder Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chancer Posted October 11, 2016 Share Posted October 11, 2016 [quote user="Pierre ZFP"]Well it's not far from La Bresse so you could have weekends skiing and wonderful walking country in the summer.It is in need of complete renovation though and the perceived wisdom here is that you have to budget for a grand per sq metre. so 90 sq Metres and you're in for €90K on top of the purchase price. Can't see anyone recouping that in this lifetime[/quote] What can you see from the photos and (lack of) description that I can't which tells you it is in need of total renovation? It looked to me to be in very good order and possibly never ever occupied. And €1000 per m2 for a renovation of a naked unfurnished apartment that doesnt even look like it needs repainting? €90K per apartment? there are 10 apartments!!! I know that French paint is expensive but for €890K even I would take my rollers down there!!!! And as for not recovering this notional €90k investment in renovation, my building is a tiny fraction of that size and number of apartments and I recovered a larger investment in 2 years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alittlebitfrench Posted October 11, 2016 Author Share Posted October 11, 2016 I am a great fan of the Vosges region. Being going nearly every year for the last 20 years because there is a family house about 10 mins from that appartement.Not a popular area with British expats for some strange reason. And before you say it, yes it is very hot the summer so it can't be the weather. Just as cheap and better food as well. No duck on the menu.I just don't get why the majority of British expats head to the SW all the time when there are equally (dare I say better) places to live. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pierre ZFP Posted October 11, 2016 Share Posted October 11, 2016 Am I looking at the correct advertisement?The one in your link gives me a 'maison de ville à rénover' and the pictures show it is in need of much more than a lick of paint.Also, no mention of 10 apartments Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chancer Posted October 11, 2016 Share Posted October 11, 2016 https://www.leboncoin.fr/ventes_immobilieres/753903827.htm?ca=15_s 3rd posting, marked for my attention. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chancer Posted October 11, 2016 Share Posted October 11, 2016 Any ex-pats in France will have no choice where they live, they will have to be close to their employer who will probably have included their accomodation as part of the package. Why do you insist on calling these imagined British living in SW France "ex-pats"? They are not! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loiseau Posted October 11, 2016 Share Posted October 11, 2016 Hah! Must have driven past that place last Friday, after spending a lovely few days near Colmar.Angela Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alittlebitfrench Posted October 11, 2016 Author Share Posted October 11, 2016 @ ChancerwiKi "An expatriate (often shortened to expat) is a person temporarily or permanently residing, as an immigrant, in a country other than that of their citizenship. The word comes from the Latin terms ex ("out of") and patria ("country, fatherland")."What is the word in French then ? Like this I might get the point you are making.@ LoiseauIf you came back from Colmar through Kaysersberg then over the top of the mountain down towards Saint-des-Vosges then on towards Epinal vai Baccurat (where the Crystal comes from) you quite possibly did. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chancer Posted October 11, 2016 Share Posted October 11, 2016 [quote user="alittlebitfrench"]@ Chancer wiKi "An expatriate (often shortened to expat) is a person temporarily or permanently residing, as an immigrant, in a country other than that of their citizenship. [/quote] I dont agree with the above but accept that its only my interpretation, others may differ. To me permanantly residing means an emigrant, someone without the intention to return to the country of their birth, certainly someone that took citizenship of their new country could not be called an expatriate. As Norman has said there are colonial associations with the word and its interesting for me to observe that many who once like me objected to being referred to as expatriate are now calling themselves exactly that since the Brexit referendum! I tend to judge UK emigrants by how they refer to the country of their birth, if they say "how often do you go home?" or worst still "back to blighty?" then its clear to me what they are. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pierre ZFP Posted October 11, 2016 Share Posted October 11, 2016 [quote user="Chancer"]https://www.leboncoin.fr/ventes_immobilieres/753903827.htm?ca=15_s 3rd posting, marked for my attention.[/quote]Ah! now the postings make sense - I was still looking at the link in the first post [:$] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alittlebitfrench Posted October 11, 2016 Author Share Posted October 11, 2016 It is a sticky wicket all this and really no that important in the grand scheme of things.No one can say for sure they will never go back to their country of birth. The world is a changing place. Who knows what France will be like in 10 years time. One might have to/want to.If you apply for French citizenship does that mean you can never go back to your country of origin ? How does that work then ?Those applying for 'French citizenship' are doing so (from what I have read) for their own security rather that wanting to become a 'French citizen'. To be fair, apart from the administrative side it changes nothing because you will never be perceived as being French. So you ask yourself what is the point ?I am an expat. I can't say for sure if I will or will not return. I am guessing there are many that have been forced recently to return because of the plunging exchange rate who may have said before that they would never return.In that respect, expat' is about right for most if not all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YCCMB Posted October 11, 2016 Share Posted October 11, 2016 Ah, the Vosges. Like Manchester only with slightly warmer summers. Exactly why (like Nw England) it was the centre of the French cotton spinning and weaving industries. Very pretty if you like hills and drizzle. And before you ask, I've lived there. In Epinal, to be precise. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NormanH Posted October 11, 2016 Share Posted October 11, 2016 [quote user="alittlebitfrench"]@ ChancerwiKi "An expatriate (often shortened to expat) is a person temporarily or permanently residing, as an immigrant, in a country other than that of their citizenship. The word comes from the Latin terms ex ("out of") and patria ("country, fatherland")."What is the word in French then ? Like this I might get the point you are making.@ LoiseauIf you came back from Colmar through Kaysersberg then over the top of the mountain down towards Saint-des-Vosges then on towards Epinal vai Baccurat (where the Crystal comes from) you quite possibly did.[/quote]So you reckon that those who voted for Brexit objected to European 'expats' coming to the UK?[:D]I have only seen the word immigration/immigrant used in that contect. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chancer Posted October 11, 2016 Share Posted October 11, 2016 I definitely wont be in France in 10 years time, at least if I am for whatever reason it wont be here. All being well I will move away within a couple of years, circumstances may even dictate that I return to the UK albeit temporarily, but I definitely do not see myself as an expatriate. I just feel that those who do consider themselves to be expatriâtes, who speak of "going home" or "back to Blighty" never ever really left in their hearts despite what they may say, that they were never fully committed to making a life here. My friends who worked in the 80's in Saudi Arabia, some for 10 years or more were definitely expatriâtes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alittlebitfrench Posted October 11, 2016 Author Share Posted October 11, 2016 Maybe it is an age thing or the age it which you arrived in France or wherever.To be fair I have always said (when asked in French circles) that I was European. I am guessing now that is not going to work. LOLNevertheless, the only people who get their knickers in a twist about this subject are the British. Nobody else in the world cares one jot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NormanH Posted October 11, 2016 Share Posted October 11, 2016 Nevertheless, the only people who get their knickers in a twist about this subject are the British.Because it is only the British abroad who claim the word for themselves, as opposed to the immigrants whom they have left the UK to avoid, as I have head it said.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alittlebitfrench Posted October 11, 2016 Author Share Posted October 11, 2016 I see your point now Norman.I would again say that this is an age thing. People of my age (hopefully) don't leave for another country because of immigration within their own country. (Is that the point you are making ???) If they do then they are sad as ####. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Patf Posted October 11, 2016 Share Posted October 11, 2016 ALBF - another reason why I'm an immigrant and not an expat - the quiet countryside and beautiful scenery. I know it exists in UK, but not in such large amounts. And I do like french people.Also the price of coffee. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alittlebitfrench Posted October 11, 2016 Author Share Posted October 11, 2016 So Patf, you are an immigrant if you move to the French countryside and like coffee and French people and an expat if you move to a city and like kababs ?What about Betty who lived and worked in Epinal ? Expat or immigrant ?It is quite rural Epinal but has a nice Carrefour mind you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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