Debit Card Fraud

[JohnH]

We have a joint Britline account, which is used fairly infrequently - the odd cheque to pay bills and the debit cards for shopping during our half a dozen or so visits to France in the course of a year. Everything was progressing splendidly, or so we thought, until the arrival of a statement showing a number of withdrawals, on two separate days from two different cash dispensers - in AMSTERDAM! Since both of us were at work in the UK on the two days in question and neither of us has been to Amsterdam for several years, these transactions tended to stand out from the rest of the statement.

In total, exactly €900 had been removed from the account, a figure which was remarkably symetrical considering that it included not onlt the six transactions but also the bank charges incurred.

It would appear that one of our debit cards has been cloned. Neither card has been out of our possession, or even out of our sight to be swiped behind a counter, so how and when the details were captured is unclear.

So far, the attitude of CA has been sympathetic, although I can sense a small tidal wave of bureaucracy approaching. I was, for instance, told to obtain a crime report from the police in the UK ( ! ), a request that caused no little amusement when I went into the local station.

This is still a developing situation and I'll post updates, from time to time, when something/anything happens - meanwhile I'd be interested to discover how the situation was resolved by anyone else who might have experienced a similar situation.

[Rob Roy]

Sorry to hear about your cloning. I have no personal experience of such a scam, but 2 of our sons have both been victims in the UK, one of them twice[:(]. They are fairly sure their cards were cloned at ATM machines - and perhaps this is what happened to yours? Luckily their banks reimbursed the monies taken - I think they are both with Nat West. It is worrying to know this is now happening in France. Good luck with your discussions with CA!

[Gardian]

Not good.

What was the time gap between the last time the card was used and the dodgy transactions turning up?

Do pls post updates. 

[JohnH]

The gap between the last genuine use of a card and the first fraudulent transaction was about three weeks. Between times we had received a statement, which, naturally showed nothing untoward.

We have on-line access to our account but, since we weren't using it in the following weeks, I had not logged on to check balances - I felt I had no reason to do so. One learns from experience and, learning from this experience, I will always check on-line accounts in future on a regular basis.

Today, on request from the bank, I cut the two cards through the middle and posted them to CA - I was told that forensic examination of the shards might reveal something. Yeah right!

[lizzie15again]

"So far, the attitude of CA has been sympathetic, although I can sense a small tidal wave of bureaucracy approaching. I was, for instance, told to obtain a crime report from the police in the UK ( ! ), a request that caused no little amusement when I went into the local station"

Have you read my thread "money gone missing"? Someone stole 13000 euros from my CA account  20 months ago and despite winning the court case we brought against them ( CA) we still haven't got it back ! The first contact with them after the event wasn't too bad but after that things changed, they treated  US like the criminals, in other words they closed ranks. Is their system any worse/ better than others ? I don't know.  One of my questions is- how did someone know I had that sort of money in my account?  We went to the local gendarmerie and filled in a crime report too- we've never heard back about that either ! When I went to CA last week to eventually close my account they refused, telling me they would ring me up to explain- they didn't. A phone call to our solicitor did the trick- I was able to go in and close the account after all, hmm. My advice would be pester CA- don't let up, assuming they are trying to put things right, they may not be !  Good luck [Www]

[JohnH]

Thanks for the advice Lizzie - I certainly will continue to pester CA. As for the crime report, the amusement at the local nick was caused by the thought that anyone would be foolish enough to think that they would be interested in dealing with a crime committed in another country! The guy on the desk suggested that I should report it to the French police, because the card cloning took place in France and to the Dutch police, because the theft of money took place in Holland. He was totally unimpressed by my suggestion that, as a UK resident, I might expect a little assistance. "We don't have a procedure for that!" he said, when I suggested that he might look at the documentation I had with me and write a note to the effect that, in his opinion, an offence had taken place. He was, however, most impressed by the ingenuity of whoever it was had copied the card!

[alnmike]

John - I'm so sorry to hear about this, I've had various cards cloned,

through purchasing on the web despite being what I thought was 'web

savvy'. (In one case I bought something once from a well known

catalogue which Ronny Corbett is currently advertising, and their site

appeared to have been hacked and my details stolen) I now check the

accounts daily, and whilst this won't help in your specific situation,

I have a credit card with a £250 limit I just use for my web purchases.

Good luck - as a fellow CA account holder I await the results with

interest.

[JohnH]

We now have new cards and new PIN numbers - we're still missing our €900, but the bank keep telling me that it's only a matter of time. Exactly how much time seems to be something of a moveable feast, but several different people have told me that the whole process 'usually' takes about four weeks. Once the dust settles on this episode, I'm going to try to get them to change the account number. I found it a wee bit worrying that this didn't happen automatically, since the current account number has, obviously, been compromised.

[JohnH]

This morning, all the fraudulent transactions, together with the resulting bank charges, were reversed - at last!

At one stage I thought it was all going to turn to rat poo, when the CA fraud department threw the file out because I didn't have the necessary crime report, but, thanks to the efforts of Sian at Britline, who persuaded her boss to take up the case, it's all fixed.

That's it!!

[Will]

That's good - it's nice to read something positive about Credit Agricole on a forum for once.

[Kevinmc]

I too have been a victim of illicit withdrawls on my CA card, but the withdrawls took place in the UK. Going through the procedure at the moment and awaiting the written crime report from Thames Valley police. although I hardly ever use the card in the UK, both incidents occeurred here, so the UK police are interested.

However, I did find it peculiar that the villian spent €190 in Leeds and bought 3 tickets to a cinema in West London. I wonder if it's an up-cock on Mastercards part, charginf transactions to the wrong account.

Unfortunately, I'm liable for the first €150, as I didn't subscribe to the extra service the banks offer to cover this sort of thing.

I would concur that Sian is very helpful.    

 

[booboo]

[quote user="Kevinmc"]

Unfortunately, I'm liable for the first €150, as I didn't subscribe to the extra service the banks offer to cover this sort of thing.  

 

[/quote]

Hi Kevin,

Was your card actually stolen or not??

If it was stolen, then you are liable for the first 150 euros before putting  a stop on the card (then this can be refunded if yes, you have their insurance 'compte service')

But if the card has not been stolen but 'cloned' then you are not liable at all for any amount, so you'll be fully refunded, even without their extra insurance.

It does take time, as with the original post, the time for the fraud dept to deal with it which is nnoying, especially if you need the dosh!

 

[Kevinmc]

Cheers booboo,

 

No the card wasn't stolen, but allegedly cloned. When I've done everything they've asked of me - which is now providing the written police report - I'll pursue recovery of as much as possible. Maybe that's why they wanted the card back, to be sure I hadn't lost it.

[booboo]

Sounds good then; let us know how you get on.

[JohnH]

Thanks everyone!

Yes, Kevin, Sian was very helpful to me. She responded whenever she said she would and kept me up to date with what was (or was not) happening. Good luck in getting your problem sorted.