Helping others with medical things

[Patf]

Teamedup - in theory what you have just said is correct and logical. But in practice people don't work like this. We have weaknesses and are imperfect. And when feeling vunerable we need compassion and what is currently known as a forgiving attitude. Then in our turn we will be happy to be "used" by others. I speak french well, and normally can cope on the phone. Husband tries, and understands but has a form of dyslexia which makes it impossible for him to reproduce sounds. He's tone deaf. Talking on the phone in a medical emergency is difficult even when it's in your own language. I  once worked in a voluntary capacity as an operator for an emergency first aid service in UK and it was usually difficult to get a coherent message. Was I a "mug" to do this for free every Sunday for 5+ years? I don't think so. Pat.

[Teamedup]

Patf, Your husband is unlucky to have this problem, but there is no excuse for the majority, shall we say 99 % of the other people who don't learn.

I have often said on here that I volunteer, the first time I remember doing it was when I was 11 and it has continued throughout my life. It still doesn't give me any rights to 'make' other people volunteer to help me out because of my thoughtlessness.

You weren't a mug and I'm not a mug for volunteering, but volunteering has to be what it is, and that is willing service.

 

 

[Loiseau]

There's a very useful series of leaflets to download from the department of health website, in many languages.  I am sure I must have first read about it on here!

If you print out the English version, and then the French (or other) version, you have quite a lot of vocabulary and possible questions and answers.

Maybe all of you who are plagued with helpless ex-pats should just dish them out...

Angela

[Judyc]

Pat

There is an international telephone number - 112 - which you can ring in case of emergency and speak English. 

I, too, have a husband who is unable to speak more than a few words of french.  Without hearing aids he is virtually deaf, and however much he tried to learn,  he just does not 'hear' the words in quite the same way as I do and he has struggled to learn more than the very basics. 

After having the tragedy of a friend having a heart attack and dying whilst staying with us, I realised how very difficult communicating with the pompiers on the phone is when in a foreign language in an emergency situation.  Under normal circumstances, I speak good french but in the panic of the moment it was difficult to keep calm and think logically, let alone translate.  I feared that if I was the one involved in an accident or medical emergency of some sort that my husband would be totally incapable of calling for help for me until he had rung round looking for a friend to do so.  He has had the International number drummed into him, and we have provided cards with the number on for guests in our gites.

Has anyone experienced using this number?  I assume they link immediately through to your local emergency service, but I don't think I should be ringing just to ask them that!

 

 

 

 

 

[Loiseau]

That's interesting. 

I hadn't realised that 112 was multilingual.  I imagined it was just set up in the interests of having the same emergency number for all EU countries (112 is also on-stream in the UK, I think), so people don't hesitate in an emergency whether they should call 999, 15, or whatever others exist.  And also so you don't have to think: "Er, do I want pompiers, police etc, and which number is which?")

I had also understood that 112 was the one to use from mobiles, as then the signal from your phone meant that the operator could see instantly where you were - often you don't know yourself, when you are in an unfamiliar place.

Angela

 

[Patf]

Judy - The 112 number is worth knowing. I hope none of us ever needs it or the other ideas. Pat.

[hoverfrog]

this thread has got me thinking.

I'm usually OK with french, have had to help others with mairie, utility companies, visits to orthodontist and uro-genital surgeons, etc;, but I do know that when in a panic my french deserts me - even though it's deep rooted (we spoke french at home when I grew up)

I'm therefore putting at the top of my "to-do" list a list of numbers to call next to the phone.

[Dick Smith]

Very important - as I said in another post, when I fell downstairs I was concussed and Julie was too worried about me to think clearly - it must always be the same in emergencies.

Double-very important if you have visitors staying, as well.

[Quillan]

Well I think the French system should have everything for emergencies in different languages, down here it should be Belgian, English, Spanish, Arabic and Italian. Hospitals should also supply translators for all these languages free of charge. I mean the UK lead the way supplying these services and more. In Newham (my old local hospital) they greet you in something like 28 different languages and their council generated documents are also multilingual.

I don't think it's fair to imply that people from the UK moving here need to speak better than 'A' level French and anyone who doesn't shouldn't come. I didn't speak a word when I arrived, now I speak two (joke) but whilst I can get by saying my neck/foot hurts the use of 'technical terms' are a different matter and some of us are worried we might get the wrong treatment. I had to ask for some cream for thrush the other day, why should I know the French for thrush.

However using English friends is not always such a good idea. If you don't speak much French yourself how do you know just how good they are plus the ones round here gossip as they have nothing better to do. I usually pay for a proper translator if I am that worried or seek out an English speaking specialist. If you can afford the top end specialists then nearly all speak good English as much of the ‘research papers’ written about their subject are printed in English.

If a fellow Brit asks you to call for help tell them to call 112 which is multi lingual.

 

[cooperlola]

Well Quillan, I find this amusing.  My blacksmith's daughter lives in the UK as her husband has a two year contract there.  I asked him if she was learning English and he said, "She has no choice.  Nobody speaks any French at all, and if she didn't learn she would not be able to cope." Hospitals may have multi-lingual facillities but do GP's, chemists, physio's etc in the UK? I don't think so.

Can I also ask why one wouldn't look up the word for thrush before one went to a chemist's to buy the product?  Would you expect every chemist in the UK to know it if you were French?

[Quillan]

[quote user="cooperlola"]

Well Quillan, I find this amusing.  My blacksmith's daughter lives in the UK as her husband has a two year contract there.  I asked him if she was learning English and he said, "She has no choice.  Nobody speaks any French at all, and if she didn't learn she would not be able to cope." Hospitals may have multi-lingual facillities but do GP's, chemists, physio's etc in the UK? I don't think so.

Can I also ask why one wouldn't look up the word for thrush before one went to a chemist's to buy the product?  Would you expect every chemist in the UK to know it if you were French?

[/quote]

The NHS has loads of money, the government keep saying how much extra they are giving them so to spend a few bob on translators for GP's shouldn't be a problem. In some areas they supply them on demand if you ask. In other areas people take friends or family members to the doctors and chemists. Hope your blacksmiths daughters husband is not pinching all the decent jobs by he way. Perhaps she should complain about them not speaking French, I mean it's really not very good if they do it for other languages and not hers.

Thrush, well my dictionary only has "grive" which is probably why they directed me to the nearest pet shop. Don't suppose you know the correct word (no Joke) or if there is a product called (I think) Cannistan (cream) or an equivalent?

PS. OK hands up I was only joking about the hospitals in the UK. I do think they should charge for translators there. When I have needed one in a French hospital I have had to pay which I don't mind. Well it's my problem I don't speak French that well but it’s my problem not theirs.

Back on track, I can understand why some are reluctant to help to start with and after a while ask themselves why they should continue. I personally try to ask for help as little as possible, it’s very embarrassing having lived here now for 5 years that my French is not better than it is, I feel that I should be almost fluent by now and have a guilt complex about the matter. The problem is running such an insular business really, I think it is better if you work for or with a native French speaker.

I can deal with day to day stuff even hold a conversation with neighbours to a reasonable degree. I am lucky that my vet for instance speaks excellent English otherwise I would have to sit and work out what to say or even get a translator. There’s then also that element of doubt that you might have it wrong which is what frightens me the most. I find it easier to say to people when they ask for help with the language that I can hardly speak it myself and would be terrified of making a mistake.

I have watched those with problems and once a person helps them they ‘latch on’ to them and rather than try to help themselves or get professional help they keep going back again and again. It’s not really fair but then there is always ‘users’ in life.

[Weedon]

I agree it's important to know the difference between Grive, Muguet and Draine. 

All I have posted to say is that just sometimes events overtake you and illness can strike before you get the chance to be word perfect.  Going to the Brico and getting placo is much different to getting medical attention for something life threatening.

You find that when phoning the emergency services you are lucky if you get any words out let alone the correct tense.

[cooperlola]

The farrier's son-in-law works for a French company, Q![:D] I don't think she felt she should complain at all - I think she expected to have to learn the language of the country she was living in that's all.  Given how many different tongues there are in the world, I can imagine the tax payers' wrath at having to pay for a translator for all of them.  "Why don't they learn to integrate?"  Is the kind of response I would expect from the Daily Mail at least.  I agree that in emergency situations, casualty departments and the like, this would be nice - to know that a translator could be called for - but is it truly realistic?  Perhaps in the Brit enclaves, yes, but not where they are few and far between.  Although I can see that this would provide protection for both the patient and the medical staff.  I just cannot imagine the native French reaction to the increased costs in their healthcare which would result if these facilities were automatically available to incomers, can you?  Maybe there's a case for companies doing top-up healthcare for immigrants, to offer translation facilities at an extra cost on premiums?

ps See

http://www.doctissimo.fr/html/dossiers/mycoses/articles/14-infections-vaginales-mycoses.htm

[Teamedup]

Well you wouldn't think it fair would you Quillan. I seem to remember that you earned an awful lot of money......... and then you say that we, who could never imagine earning so much, should be paying towards things that are for FREE. Perhaps you have not realised but translators are not 'free'. AND our local hospitals are already understaffed and from what I can gather from from friends and neighbours who work there, underfunded too. What a waste of money it would be to pay non medical staff to translate for immigrants, who moved to France through choice.

Saying that, everywhere will have to make an exception for tourists who don't speak the language. I can accept that.

Planned movers, well, even I went to some lessons before I came and we moved here 'just like that'. I have no time for the dream house brigade who don't have enough sense to think that they will have a life to live when they are in their dream house, and life has it's ups and downs and ill health is part of life.

Champignons     =           thrush. For those of you that didn't know.

 

[Quillan]

[quote user="cooperlola"]The farrier's son-in-law works for a French company, Q![:D] I don't think she felt she should complain at all - I think she expected to have to learn the language of the country she was living in that's all.  Given how many different tongues there are in the world, I can imagine the tax payers' wrath at having to pay for a translator for all of them.  "Why don't they learn to integrate?"  Is the kind of response I would expect from the Daily Mail at least.  I agree that in emergency situations, casualty departments and the like, this would be nice - to know that a translator could be called for - but is it truly realistic?  Perhaps in the Brit enclaves, yes, but not where they are few and far between.  Although I can see that this would provide protection for both the patient and the medical staff.  I just cannot imagine the native French reaction to the increased costs in their healthcare which would result if these facilities were automatically available to incomers, can you?  Maybe there's a case for companies doing top-up healthcare for immigrants, to offer translation facilities at an extra cost on premiums?[/quote]

In Carcassonne you can ask for a translator and one will be supplied for you BUT at a cost to you which is fair comment. I don't know how this would work in A and E, I assume they supply one and sort it out later. I rather think, personally, that the UK should go the same route. As a subscriber to the French health service myself I would be a bit upset if they started giving free translation services. I find letter easy to deal with, I either sit and read them with a dictionary in my hand or if they are long I simply scan them in and un them through any of the translation programs availabl on the web. It's really not that difficult if you are prepaired to make an effort.

As I said before for those that are worried try phoning 112 (instead of the normal emergency numbers) which should have a person who can speak English.

[Quillan]

[quote user="Teamedup"]

Well you wouldn't think it fair would you Quillan. I seem to remember that you earned an awful lot of money......... and then you say that we, who could never imagine earning so much, should be paying towards things that are for FREE. Perhaps you have not realised but translators are not 'free'. AND our local hospitals are already understaffed and from what I can gather from from friends and neighbours who work there, underfunded too. What a waste of money it would be to pay non medical staff to translate for immigrants, who moved to France through choice.

Saying that, everywhere will have to make an exception for tourists who don't speak the language. I can accept that.

Planned movers, well, even I went to some lessons before I came and we moved here 'just like that'. I have no time for the dream house brigade who don't have enough sense to think that they will have a life to live when they are in their dream house, and life has it's ups and downs and ill health is part of life.

Champignons     =           thrush. For those of you that didn't know.

[/quote]

Actually I did say, if you read it.

"PS. OK hands up I was only joking about the hospitals in the UK. I do think they should charge for translators there. When I have needed one in a French hospital I have had to pay which I don't mind. Well it's my problem I don't speak French that well but it’s my problem not theirs."

and as I said I also pay in to the system here as well so it's my money just as much as it is yours and anyone else who pays in.

I didn't understand as my dictionary only says that Champignons are mushrooms or is it just my dictionary thats wrong, anyone else can give me the correct name? Somebody said muguet, is that correct?

[hoverfrog]

grive = song thrush i.e. a bird

muguet = lily of the valley and also: Terme de médecine. Inflammation avec production pseudo-membraneuse, par petites plaques, assez fréquente chez les nouveau-nés, et le plus ordinairement contagieuse ; ainsi dite parce qu'elle est blanche comme la fleur du muguet ; les plaques en sont formées en grande partie par un végétal parasite. i.e. the thrush that babies get...

champignons = 1. (botanique - culinaire) mushroom

2. (botanique) mushroom; fungus. Terme de vétérinaire. Squirre du cordon testiculaire après la castration du cheval par casseaux. Maladie à laquelle les chiens sont sujets.

well that's all from MDict...

still not sure which I would use in a pharmacie though! Probably muguet, falling back to chapignons when of course they don't understand :)

Although if Teamdup says champignons I'm inclined to believe her!

[Teamedup]

Well if you had said it was your mouth and not where thrush I suspect is most common then I would have said muguet. However it is still champignon dans la bouche too. In both bodily regions it is a form of mycose.

[Weedon]

Maybe I shall refrain from asking staff on the veggie counter at Carrefour for any advice on champignons!

[Weedon]

Having done a google on thrush/grive/muguet/mushrooms/lily of the valley and candida, I am now of the opinion that if fluent French speakers fail to agree on the correct terminology, I am better off in the dark being fed on b**l  s**t.  I should then get a good crop of champignons.

[cooperlola]

See my link above, Quillan, in my previous post.  It also includes a list of creams etc for "champignons" in the medicaments link at the bottom.  For "champignons" read "fungus" then it makes sense.

[Teamedup]

Weedon, everyone calls it Muguet or Champignons dans la bouche for the thing that babies usually get.  And champignons for genital thrush. Your doctor, your pharmacist will understand, so why keep looking up words and complicating things. These myscose are fungal infections,  I have heard them called fungal infections or yeast infections in english. They are not mushrooms.

I used to have to go all round the houses describing things because I didn't know what they were called, and one gets there in the end anyway. It isn't 'bouse'ing' it is just the way one learns or one ignores and doesn't.

[Patf]

If you look on the TF Forum, under Health and Social Welfare there's a sticky called "Urgent - heart attack" which has some translations, phone numbers, messages etc. The main thing is that heart attack isn't mal au coeur, but crise cardiaque. Pat.

[Teamedup]

[:)] Patf, I used to go to gym classes in our village with some of the older gals. In fact they were all older gals. We had been doing some excersizes one day and one of them started catching her breath and making a gasping sound as she put her hands to her chest. All I could hear was a rasping 'mal au coeur'  and I just could not believe how disinterested everyone else was. A few of the women told her to just go outside in tone that was not pleasant and I was getting hysterical saying 'mais elle a mal au coeur'. To be met with shrugs.

And she took herself off and came in a few minutes later saying that she was feeling better.

I had not got a clue as to what was going on. A friend explained later what mal au coeur was. I still don't understand why that is the expression, but it is.

[5-element]

If you want to get immediate attention because you (or someone else) look like  having a heart attack, what you have to say is:

 "Je fais un malaise"... or "Il/elle fait un malaise"... then the possibility of "malaise cardiaque" will be assumed it's probably worth learning this expression, as you never know when you might need it. If you just said that when calling the pompiers, or SAMU on the phone, you can be sure to be taken seriously.