Another Baby Drowns in a Swimming Pool

[Poolguy]

 

This was on the front page of the Depeche Du midiArticle paru le 25/08/2005GARD .

LES SYSTÈMES DE PROTECTION N'ONT PAS FONCTIONNÉ 

Encore un bébé noyé dans une PISCINE Un enfant de deux ans et six mois s'est noyé mardi soir dans la PISCINE d'ungîte
à Aigaliers dans le Gard où sa famille, originaire de Belgique, passaitses vacances. L'alarme sonore de la PISCINE qui
se réactive automatiquementaprès chaque baignade pour signaler toute chute dans l'eau ne s'était pasremise en route après
la baignade de son frère et de sa sœur. L'eau était eneffet encore agitée. Or le système ne fonctionne efficacement
que sur uneeau calme. L'enfant aurait glissé dans le bassin et coulé en quelquessecondes, se noyant avant l'intervention
de sa famille. Il suffit en effetde trois minutes dans l'eau pour que se produisent des lésions absolumentirréversibles.
Un drame identique s'était noué dans le Loiret le 14 août: un enfant de 3ans a trouvé la mort à Montargis dans une PISCINE
également équipée d'unsystème de détection. Là encore, les parents s'étaient baignés quelquesminutes plus tôt et la surface
de l'eau n'était pas redevenue parfaitementplane.Les associations de consommateurs ont dénoncé à plusieurs reprises lesdangers
liés à ces mécanismes de protection qui sonnent au moindre clapot ousignalent la chute de corps dans l'eau. Le ministère de la
Cohésion socialea publié début août un guide d'information pour mettre en garde le publicsur la sécurité des PISCINEs privées
afin d'éviter ce type d'accidents ,souvent mortels pour les enfants. En Europe du nord, où les PISCINEs sontsouvent couvertes,
les clôtures fermées par cadenas autour des bassinsprivés sont rendues obligatoires par les assurances. 
«Pour des raisonsd'esthétique et de confort, les particuliers en France privilégient lessystèmes de détection» indique un vendeur,
rappelant que les PISCINEsenterrées construites depuis fin 2003 sont toutes aux normes de sécurité etque les plus anciennes doivent
l'être en 2006 (la réglementation nes'applique pas pour les PISCINEs hors sol). Les médecins du Samu rappellentcependant qu'il
n'existe pas de meilleure protection que la surveillancepermanente des enfants.

This might put people off of alarms I should think.

Andrew

[Teamedup]

Another tragic tale. How could such a young child be left alone.

 

Also I was wondering if this had been a salt water pool could this child have been saved.

 

After all it takes a lot longer to drown in salt water than in fresh and surely every minute counts.

[Fantine<br><br><br><br>Susie]

[quote]Another tragic tale. How could such a young child be left alone. Also I was wondering if this had been a salt water pool could this child have been saved. After all it takes a lot longer to d...[/quote]

Is that true? Never heard it before.

I have an 'abri bas' over my pool. When my 7 year old asked to go in the other day I asked her to wait half an hour so I could finish a job I'd started. 10 minutes later I heard the kids in the pool (7, 11 and friend of 12). Naturally I was very angry with them for going in (via the sliding door - the abri was fully 'down') and reprimanded them accordingly. But then I realised it was my fault for not locking the sliding door - which I now do and hide the key. It's not just toddlers who are at danger - pools can be very dangerous places unsurveilled.

[Teamedup]

Is what true, drowning times?

Yes, fresh water is hypotonic and absorbs easily through the lungs,

so gets into the blood stream very  quickly. Salt water is hypertonic

and doesn't absorb into the lungs by any means as quickly. There is

certainly a time difference between how quickly one can drown in

fresh and salt water.

Ofcourse in long enough and anyone will drown, but one has better

buoyancy anyway in salt water too. And as the absorbtion takes

longer, it is possible to save someone who has been in salt water

 even after quite some time with cpr etc. Fresh water is high risk.

Hope I've explained that properly, it is basically right though. LOL

 only the hyper and hypo could be the wrong way round, as I always

 forget which is which.

Strangely the first pool I ever used as a young child was salt water,

I always liked it best as a child. My dad used to take me to different

 baths and although I was always a good swimmer, I was always

happiest in salt water, I never really understood the difference

between the two sorts of water until I was grown up though.

[Lori]

How tragic for everyone involved here.  I can never understand how anyone can let a child out of their sight for one second when there is a pool on the property.  I wouldn't be able to sleep at night if we had children here.  Alarm, fence or not ...  I would worry ALL THE TIME.  Hence no kids. 

I don't think there is any real way to protect a child from drowning in a pool - except not to take your child near one. 

Really sad.

[Poolguy]

Sadly another one

Former All Black's son drowns at French home

22 April 2006

Tragedy in France, All Black Randle's baby son drowning in the family swimming pool.

Luka Randle, 16 months, was the youngest of f

ormer All Black Roger Randle's

four children. It is understood Randle – who has been playing in France

for about a year – was away with his team when the accident happened.

His

former manager, Jim Fitzsimmons, said the death was a "horrendous

thing". The player and his wife Kelly were strong characters but would

struggle without the support of their extensive whanau in Flaxmere,

Hastings, NZ. Fitzsimmons managed Randle up to and through his

Hurricanes years. "It's

a shocking thing to happen. It will be a very dramatic situation for

them because they are so far from home and they have a very strong

Maori background." The family is expected to return to New Zealand in a

fortnight and a tangi will then be held in Hastings. They had been due

to return home shortly for a month-long off-season break. Randle was a

prolific try-scoring wing for the Hurricanes, Chiefs and Waikato

throughout his career in New Zealand.

It can happen to anyone.

Andrew

[Poolguy]

Well It’s out now.

 

And you can read whole text on http://www.securiteconso.org/article515.html

As

Expected the Committee, whilst being heavily critical of Alarms and their use,

stopped short of recommending their removal from the list. (I guess the

industry pressure was too much.)

Here below is a (rough) translation of

the recommendations.

The Commission recommends:

1. With the authorities To make coherent the law of
   January 3, 2003 and its decree of application so that: - in the future,
   the conformity of the safety devices to the regulations of the existing
   standards is, for the owners of swimming pools or the professionals to
   which they appeal, the only proof of the respect of the requirements of
   the regulation. - to publish the list of the standards having to be used
   pursuant to the law since those guarantee a respect of adequate and
   relevant requirements of safety. - to consider, for the past, like in
   conformity with the regulation, the installation that owners of swimming
   pools could carry out in good faith safety devices nonin conformity with
   the standards but which are in conformity with the requirements of safety
   defined in the decree of June 7, 2004. In waiting of the entry into force
   of the known texts mentioned, to make check that the professionals whose
   products assert conformity to a standard made all the provisions well to
   make sure that their products respect them strictly. Within the framework
   of the preparation of the report/ratio of application of the law to
   identify the number and the characteristics of the devices equipping the
   swimming pools in which drownings occurred.
2. With the authorities in load of standardization and
   the manufacturers of warning systems: To supplement the provisions of the
   standard as soon as possible and to modify the design of the products, in
   accordance with considering which precede, on the following points: - the
   automatic reactivation. - guarantee of the continuous operation of the
   system (emergency power supply for all the types of sources of energy). -
   the ergonomics of the products (good comprehension of the visual and/or
   sound signals). - the reliability of the system in the event of
   interaction of other safety equipments or not. - the definition of the
   characteristics of the basin of test.
3. With the consumers Those should never forget that,
   whatever the system of safety with which they equipped their swimming pool,
   the constant monitoring of the children is essential. The CSC will inform
   the consumers of the points on which they are invited to make particularly
   carry their vigilance as for the use of alarms to detection of immersion:
   - Taken into account of the one latency period existence of the system
   which requires an increased monitoring. - To make so that various factors
   cannot deteriorate, in an unexpected way, repeated or prolonged, the
   effectiveness of the device: water level lower than normal in period of
   dryness or probe out of water in winter, piles discharged, presence of
   another equipment which can deteriorate the effectiveness of detection,
   device badly adapted, badly placed or badly regulated, device stopped by a
   child. - In the event of provision of the swimming pool within the
   framework of a seasonal hiring, to provide to the tenants all the
   explanations necessary and essential documentation for the correct
   operation of the system in a language which they understand (information
   to be mentioned in the inventory of fixtures).

 

So I guess that those who own alarms as their sole level of security have been

given a reprieve for the time being. But I am sure that this will not be the

end of it and I still dissagree with their inclusion as complaint devices.

 

Andrew

[Kitty]

I'm a mother of four.  It's impossible to be with your children every minute of the day, even when they are toddlers.  Young children are curious and are fast when they see something.  Three minutes is not a very long time to realise that your child is missing.

My cousin's child was immersed in a swimming pool after wandering off.  She thought that he was with a family friend whilst the friend thought he was with his mother.  He survived after resusitation by paramedics and was in hospital for three days.

No one should blame the parents.  Bereavement is a hard enough thing without guilt so if there is guilt as well...

With each drowning/road accident etc - there but the grace of God go all of us.

[mitsi]

Last year when my daughter was only 3, she was in the pool with 

her sister and friends, with at least 5 adults in the pool area

watching. (i wasn't there) Suddenly they realised she wasn't visible.

She had come out of the pool for something, taken armbands off,

forgotten to put them back on, gone into the pool and had sunk to the

bottom. The worse thing was she wasn't struggling, just lying there.

She was promptly retreived, and after a splutter, none the worse for

wear (thank goodness). A few weeks later, she did the same thing - only

then was I told of the first incident. Fortunately both times she was

ok. What it has taught me is it doesn't matter if you have an alarm or

Fence it can still happen in a split second.Vigilence is key. Also the

fact that she didn't struggle and barely a splash made- would it even

set an alarm off?

[Judith]

Whilst not disagreeing with the previous posts - nor with the use of pool security - what is really needed is teaching a respect for water at as early an age as possible.  My sisters and I were taught to swim at an early age, but with a father who was a pilot life saver that was perhaps not surprising - it is <any> water which can be dangerous, baths, rivers, pools etc.  No-one in any of these posts has suggested teaching respect for and learning to swim at the same time.  And I accept that even swimmers can get into difficulties before anyone shouts - but - rather than allowing babies and toddlers to explore water as a fun game - use it to teach them how to behave in it etc. I know my limitations as a swimmer (not got my father's talents there!) but I also respect the pool and never go out of my depth.  Incidentally, you are never too old either to learn to swim -  my mother learnt when she was over 60. 

[mitsi]

You're right Judith, trying to encourage children from an early age to

respect the water is a must. In fact we are surrounded by a lake, river

and pool. So I have always tried to reinforce safety at all times. My

eldest went to swimming classes from an early age in UK (6 months) but

I haven't been able to do the same with the 4 year old, though I do try

to use the same techniques such as swimming to the sides and teaching

them to get in and out safely. My husband can't swim and shows no

inclination either! I don't allow him to supervise swimming, he just

has to fetch the drinks and do the loo runs!

[saddie]

I would love to be able to swim. I scared myself at an early age and consequentley I am scared of water. We have a pool which came with the house and I would love to be able to make use of it. Are there any general swimming lessons in France (Correze) or would I have to find someone private?

[Deby]

Whilst I love the pool, it is my biggest fear/dread. I have a 7 year old who can swim and a boisterous 4 year old who cant but thinks he can!  My 7 year old could open the gate and my 4 year old could wander in!!!  I have even seen guests impede the gate, it is the only time I completely loose it with guests, has happened twice, I'm afraid - the inflateable is the culprit!!  I then forbid inflatables for the rest of their holiday.  They understand to my face, but I do not care what they say behind my back!  I do not ban inflatables for the next set of guests but warn them of the dangers.  I have even seen 12 year olds swimming alone. Forbidden again or even two under 14 year olds.  I am not even thinking of my own legal stance, but just the sheer lack of parental responsibility.  Most people are responsible, but when people go on holiday, there is a sense of relaxation which is understandable. 

 My son too was in the pool surrounded by me and other adults and he took his armbands off and went in without them, I turned my back for a few seconds to see that he was clearly underwater not making a sound!  I calmly retrieved him and later wept alone.  We cannot stop these things in there entirity as it is part of life and growing up, but pools are hazardous and must be respected.  Alarming pools is not sufficient, you need a fence/wall as well and certainly a retracting gate.  If you cannot afford a compliant one, buy one that at least acts as a barrier, but invest in a suitable gate. We spent thousands on ours, but equated it to the value of a life.  I would resent living next to someone that did not adequately secure their pool. Equally I would not have or live near a pond or river. 

Deby

Deby