CPAM Again, Bless Em

[Gardian]

After living here for over 2 years, we finally our Carte Vitales some 6 months ago -  we had Attestations, but getting the real thing was a major step forward.  I was so proud of mine, I used to put it under my pillow each night to keep it close and safe.

The need to pay cotisations had begun (our E106's having expired in Jan) and all that duly happened. However, we both recently reached 60 and my wife's E121 duly arrived, together with a 'piggyback' one for me.  Duly sent off to CPAM.

And then it started ...........  So far, we're up to 10 letters in less than 3 weeks.

• One to each of us, asking for the return of our Carte Vitales (because our SS No changes)
• One to me telling me that I'm now out of the CMU
• A new Attestation for OH
• One to OH asking for the return of our Carte Vitales (again - they'd been sent)
• One to me (this time from the URSSAF) telling me again that I'm out of the CMU
• Another one from URSSAF (same date as the one above) telling me that they'll refund my cotisations
• One to OH asking for a photo to be used for her new Carte Vitale
• One to me asking for a certified copy of my Birth Certificate
• One to me enclosing a CMU application form

I keep on reading that some of us are drinking to excess and that it's bad for us. Well, I badly need my first large glass of CdR of the evening - it won't be the last!

 

[woolybanana]

Now you know why France is up the umbala creek without a paddle or a cat in hell's chance or a wing and a poem.

[Gardian]

Well WB, I wouldn't put it as strong as that (maybe).

When you've lived here for a little while, you get used to some of it.  You even get to laugh about it and simply take it as another challenge in life's 'rich tapestry'.

But there is a point to this thread, apart from my personal torture.  Of course there has to be validation of any applicant's bona fides, and of course there has to be a certain amount of form-filling and return of appropriate docs. 

However, I can visualise an army of fonctionnaires passing our dossier from to the other (I've counted 5 different names just in this 3 wk spate of correspondence) and there being no real join-up in what they require of you and what happens next.  I haven't detailed it, but there are contradictions in what the letters ask of the 'client'.

Many viewing here (as I), will have had experience of  business processes and their hopeful simplification. All this, beggars belief.  I just hope that M. Sarkozy gets someone to sort it out, because it's not about expats like me who get crusty, it's about the cost to the State of all this malarkey.

[Will]

As you say after a while you get used to it.

The French have lived with it all their lives, to them 'c'est normal'.

Which is why the Sarko reforms are seen as cutting jobs and reducing services rather than a move to reduce costs through increased efficiency, and people are predicting a lot of unrest, soon, when work restarts after the holidays.

Anyway, Sarko-style reforms can often actually increase the bureaucracy, because it introduces yet another tier, to oversee and monitor (and, dare I say, massage) what is being achieved through the cuts. The NHS is a good example to which most people will be able to relate.

[opas]

Oh joy! Its not just me then.

We have lived here since 2003 and it also took us some time to get our prized Carte vitales, then you think you can sit back and relax a bit, untill you decide to do something different, like register a car or apply for planning permission and all the parperwrk that comes with that.

Not me , I get a "little" job, under Cheques emploi, and suddenly I get letters from CPAM stating that my SS number is invalid (funny that ) I used it to get the 3 girls of the family new glasses, all of us have had dental treatment including one hospital admitance for extraction of wisdom teeth, various scans and one member of the family having numerous referals and hospital visits as ALD 100%.

Just to show what a functionaires paradise it all is, yesterday I had to go to EDF offices in Perpignan, wait for it, it took 3 people in the same room to make one phone call......one with the receiver in his hand, the other to sort out the number and a 3rd joined in by pressing to speaker mode , whilst myself and Mr O sat there trying not to laugh!

[jamesg]

Oh come on, they have to spend your taxes somehow.[;-)]

[Gardian]

Another letter today, this time asking for confirmation of our droits regarding the submission two months ago of a Consultant Neurologist's bill for €41. We've had an ALD Attestation virtually since we arrived here and this is the sixth invoice of this nature that we've submitted - hardly new and completely bona fide.

So, photocopies of every relevant piece of paper I could lay my hands on and it'll go in to the post tomorrow, together with:

Envelope 2: containing copies of birth certs for me and OH, duly translated and attested by an official translator (and costing us €50!) and required for confirmation of our E121. The translations, by the way, contain the staggering information to any non bi-lingual fonctionnaire that my date of birth was "le seize juin 1947", translated from "16th June 1947" and born in "Carshalton, comte de Surrey", ......... I won't go on.

Envelope 3: containing copies of every other doc I could lay my hands on in response to 'that dreaded letter'.  Yes, we are now E121'd, but I rang the CPAM Call Centre to ask whether I really needed to provide all that stuff since our status had changed and the guy said that I should do as I had been told and watch my p's and q's. I had the feeling that mine was the umpteenth Brit call he'd dealt with today.

As said before, this is by far the most unjoined-up organisation I've ever had dealings with. I think, by virtue of the fact that we now have E121 cover, that we're OK, but I feel so sorry for those who are being compromised by an unannounced, sudden and financially dramatic policy change.        

[Gardian]

Hooray!!   My wife's new Carte Vitale arrived in the post this morning, with me named as her 'subsidiary' (although my CV form-to-put-your-photo-on, hasn't turned up yet).  And yes, they seem to have reimbursed the Neurlogist's fee (so they seem to accept that OH has a 100% ALD).

But ............... they told me at the pharmacie on Saturday that CPAM had 'bounced' their last submission for reimbursement for the (v expensive) drug that OH takes. When our SS No changed, the ALD wasn't transferred to the new number (again!). I mean, just a simple and straightforward transaction - what's on the previous details, gets trsfrd.  The Pharmacy owner said that she was very sorry and she knew that it was all OK and that she had phoned CPAM to tell them to sort themselves out, but ............ sorry, you've got to turn up in person and get them to fix it. She said she'll wait for her money till it gets fixed - kind, because it's c.€1k.

So, another bloody trip to Nimes (not that bad, because it's a nice town, but still an unnecessary pain) and another face-to-face 'When did you last see your father' discussion to get it sorted out.

Two points:

• The E121 process seems to be OK still and this very recent experience should be reassuring for those concerned in the current environment (although there are still some bits and bobs to be squared away for us personally)
• Forecast - this 'five year' business will produce a myriad of bureaucratic 'opportunities' for our CPAM fonctionnaires.  The mind boggles, however there's still a lot of water to go under the proverbial bridge on this one.

Notwithstanding us seeming to be OK with our E121's, we'll still be lobbying through the proposed channels.  There but for the age of OH would we be.

 

 

 

 

[mint]

Gardian

So, you won't be trading her in for a newer model then?  Apologies if you don't like the joke but I think now is the time for us all to lighten up a bit as the worries and problems are real enough!

Hope all goes well for you and your OH.  All my very best wishes.

[Gastines]

We have found the best way to deal with any queries at CPAM or HDI etc etc is to take ALL required documents,not copies, and go to the office. Each time we have done this the problem/query has been dealt with on the spot. Most seem to have visiting facilities in nearby towns with office times given. The same as posting paperwork to any Dept in UK, they always want something else,the original or they haven't received it.

Regards.

[Gardian]

[quote user="sweet 17"]

Gardian

So, you won't be trading her in for a newer model then?  Apologies if you don't like the joke but I think now is the time for us all to lighten up a bit as the worries and problems are real enough!

Hope all goes well for you and your OH.  All my very best wishes.

[/quote]

SW17 ..............

Absolutely not !  Quite apart from the customary vice-like grip on me, both of us would be up 'merdre creek' if she hadn't hit the big six-oh, so all my regular threats of going for that newer model are now ....... well just threats!

[mint]

Have you considered, Gardian, that SHE might trade YOU in for a newer model? I mean, after all, she is now in a position to include him in her E121?

[cooperlola]

Oh, there's a scam for you - marry some single person who's got an E121 - a new item for e-bay?

[5-element]

... or marry a French national, which I have already suggested...after all, it's been done for yonks, by would-be immigrants needing their green card in the US, and by those who, until recently, used to be considered the "real" immigrants in Europe. Who would ever have thought that a Brit might have to marry a French person to get into the healthcare system?

[Gardian]

Oh no!

Never thought of that.  Wouldn't happen though.  I mean, there's no opportunity.

Having said that, she was furtling around on the PC this pm while I was grafting away (unrewarded)outside.  What do you reckon the going rate is for a 'named party' on an E121?  Early days in the market, I suppose.

No: she wouldn't do it.    Would she?

[Gardian]

[quote user="5-element"]... or marry a French national, which I have already suggested...after all, it's been done for yonks, by would-be immigrants needing their green card in the US, and by those who, until recently, used to be considered the "real" immigrants in Europe. Who would ever have thought that a Brit might have to marry a French person to get into the healthcare system?[/quote]

If I get 'stuck', I might have a word with herself in the boulangerie - she always keeps a pain au raisin back for me every day and says that she's keen to learn English.  One door closes and another opens!