Karrie Posted January 3, 2013 Share Posted January 3, 2013 I contacted Orange today who are our internet provider because I noticed that the last 5 months worth of bills were 20 euros more than they should have been. We are a second home owner and therefore it's not something I usually check as to my belief it was a standard agreed price. The answer I got from Orange who were very helpful and polite was surprising to say the least. Apparently when we were at the house in August we accessed a website, which then took it upon itself to charge us 5 euros every week, via Orange. The Help desk are fully aware of the practise. They have now blocked the site and are going to refund us 65 euros but we have to contact the company to refund us the remainder! I was told that several internet companies practise in this way. I've yet to investigate who the company is or what they offer; my French isn't good enough to wrangle with them so I will have to ask someone to phone on my behalf. I can only think that there must be some collusion with Orange, because the 5 euros a week is automatically going through onto the Internet bill. So all of you out there with internet - check your bills! Update - the bill has come from a company called MONIKU.com who appear to offer a service to mobile phone users such as ring tones. For the privilege of taking our money we apparently get 5 'free' accesses to their services. I'm still reeling from the shock that this can happen. We have never heard of the site before. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clair Posted January 3, 2013 Share Posted January 3, 2013 It's no consolation I suspect, but there are many, many people complaining about them for the same reason. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Martin963 Posted January 3, 2013 Share Posted January 3, 2013 What a scam!!!! Just looked at moniku's website. I can only assume there ARE complete mugs who would voluntarily pay 5 euros a week to be able to download some ringtones. Otherwise how do they stay in business.... oh, of course that's stupid of me, they discovered a scam to stay in business...I suddenly feel very old and out of touch....(As a PS to feeling old and out of touch, a friend who is a mother of 32 with a 2 year old was telling me that where she lives in Totnes she is the only mum in the park who stops her child trying to stamp on the pigeons. Most of the other parents actually encourage it because the pigeons are "vermin". Having compared notes with a teacher apparently this is far from uncommon....So that's twice this week I feel in utter despair at the way the world is going.....) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AnOther Posted January 3, 2013 Share Posted January 3, 2013 Even with the 'paiement en ligne avec internet+' and 'paiement en ligne avec Contact+' subscription services in the Livebox turned on I am at a loss to understand how you could possibly have subscribed to that service unknowingly. This from their T&C's.7.1 Registration for subscription services through Internet + BoxThis option is available only if your service provider offers Internet subscription option + Internet Box. (the paiement services mentioned above)Step 1: You enter your phone number on the page.Step 2: If your ISP provides Internet subscription +, you are invited to your order, confirming your acceptance of the terms and conditions of Moniku (which appear on the page).Step 3: You will see a page with your password to use your credits on the site and you will receive an SMS with the download link clickable inside.A 3 stage process requiring your mobile phone number to be entered meaning that it's simply not possible for it to have happened by accident.Did you have any brats (sorry little darlings) in the house and using your internet about the time the charges started or is it possible somebody gained access to your WiFi without permission ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Karrie Posted January 3, 2013 Author Share Posted January 3, 2013 Anyone who entered their mobile phone number would have needed a French phone number wouldn't they? The only people in the house at the time when all this started were guests who had English phones, so not sure how this could have come about. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AnOther Posted January 3, 2013 Share Posted January 3, 2013 Good point but I still maintain that it must be near impossible to sign up by accident.It's also stretching credibility to believe that a company which Orange have an agreement with to process automatic payments via their customers Liveboxes and eventually their monthly Orange bill would deliberately abuse it and con and cheat like that, especially for such a relatively petty reward. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Martin963 Posted January 4, 2013 Share Posted January 4, 2013 Whatever the exact mechanism, I've followed the advice in one of Clair's links and disabled the third party payment system in the Orange Services menus.I'm minded to believe that this should be how they are set up as a default - but that would be too easy wouldn't it....??!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clair Posted January 4, 2013 Share Posted January 4, 2013 [quote user="Martin963"]Whatever the exact mechanism, I've followed the advice in one of Clair's links and disabled the third party payment system in the Orange Services menus.I'm minded to believe that this should be how they are set up as a default - but that would be too easy wouldn't it....??!![/quote]It wouldn't surprise me at all if this was indeed the default with Orange.Last year, I helped my neighbour set up her first-ever internet connection with Orange who are her land-line and mobile operator, and I was astounded when she came to me a month later with an Orange bill 60€ over the expected amount, and which included several items listed under "Accès Minitel".When I looked into it, it turned out she had visited a couple of sites which charged her for access to information. She didn't know about such costs and and didn't realise what she was agreeing to by clicking 'Continuer". Being with SFR, I didn't know until I accessed her Orange account that third-party payment was set to YES by default. The customer has to untick a box to avoid such charges.She complained to Orange and they refunded some of the charges. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vette Posted January 4, 2013 Share Posted January 4, 2013 I had the same problem last year. In my case, Orange had sent me an e-mail. If I didn't respond to said e-mail, I would be subscribed automatically for ringtones and games.As I don't normally use their e-mail service, I prefer Hotmail, I didn't read it for 4 months. After seeing it I went to the Orange office in Mayenne and kicked up a stink saying that they had no right to take money without my express permission. I duly received a refund in the form of a reduction in my next bill.I do check my Orange e-mail now and again just to make sure that no new dirty tricks are afoot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AnOther Posted January 4, 2013 Share Posted January 4, 2013 To the best of my knowledge Clair all those services are switched OFF as default, they certainly were for me.It would appear that by some bizarre mechanism, more or less coincident with the recent disbanding of the Minitel service, some Orange clients had the service turned on and incurred charges which were refunded.I wonder how many even know what Minitel was let alone deliberately opted to enable it and then actually used it for something ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clair Posted January 4, 2013 Share Posted January 4, 2013 My French neighbour does know what Minitel is/was, though neither of us knew Orange was using a Minitel simulator which was ON by default under their Internet+ and Contact+ services.The facts are as I described them. My neighbour was a complete internet/computer novice when I showed her how to use her brand-new laptop. She went to an Orange shop to find out which fixed-price package to sign for and the internet connection was done following phone instructions from an Orange customer service assistant. The very first invoice had a list of extra charges, which she queried with Orange. Someone explained how the charges had been incurred and advised her to disable the service. I did a quick search and sent her the link explaining how to do it, and that was it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AnOther Posted January 4, 2013 Share Posted January 4, 2013 I meant here on the fourm amongst the Brit immigrant community Clair, clearly the French know what it is or, would be expected to.Seemingly then the enabling of these services is on a purely random basis ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Danny Posted January 5, 2013 Share Posted January 5, 2013 I don't know why your settings were different but they are enabled by default for new accounts. That's why so many people have fallen foul of this little scam.Imagine out of more than 8 million ADSL customers for Orange, how many are ordinary families with one mail account and probably all the kids using the computer too.Many people have complained to Orange about this for years but they have decided to stick with the default setting. Along with automatic direct debit every month, this will generate quite an income for Orange. For me, it is clearly enabled by default for this reason.Danny Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NormanH Posted January 5, 2013 Share Posted January 5, 2013 Yet another reason to avoid Orange (France Télécom as was) SPIT if at all possible. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Danny Posted January 5, 2013 Share Posted January 5, 2013 Norman, it is used by all the main ISPs....even Free! [:)]http://internetplus.fr/utilisateurs/http://www.freebox-forum.net/forum/internet-par-la-freebox/internet-comment-le-desactiver-t7159455.htmlDanny Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NormanH Posted January 5, 2013 Share Posted January 5, 2013 But I don't think the default setting on Free is to allow Internet + purchases. I think you have to opt in, whereas Orange as you say make it the norm which you have to opt out of... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Danny Posted January 5, 2013 Share Posted January 5, 2013 I am not with Free but according to this Freenaute, it is activated by default...although I have a feeling one must accept the terms and conditions to use this 'service'http://www.ariase.com/fr/forum/arret-internet-ftopic22103.htmland another freenaute having some funhttp://forum.universfreebox.com/viewtopic.php?p=170311#170125and anotherhttp://www.aduf.org/viewtopic.php?t=207072Same with SFR too http://assistance.sfr.fr/internet_offre-services/paiement-facture/internet-plus-service-de-micropaiement/fc-3115-70045"Vos droits d'achats sont activés par défaut"Danny Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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