Alps or Pyrenees?

[Shaun]

Hi this Is my first post so I really hope you can help? We would live to buy in France and are now able to afford to. We love to ski and we love summer mountain pursuits but cannot decide between the Alps or the Pyrenees. The latter seems more affordable. We will be spending much of our holiday time looking for property but we don't want spend a huge amount of time I once place only to find that we should have been looking elsewhere. Does anyone have first hand experience of the pros and cons of both? All thoughts will be hugely welcomed.

[HoneySuckleDreams]

are you retired, or do you need to work ?

If the former, then I can say that a lot of french are buying in the Pyrenees because they have been priced out of the Alps. If it is the later, then may I suggest another country? One that has opportunities.

[NormanH]

You will get far more property for your money in the Pyrénées, especially in the middle (Ariège etc), but there is a reason for that. It tends to be much less developed.

[Val_2]

My son skis in the Pyrenees and many families from our village go there as its much cheaper and closer than the alps with just as good facilities.

[Pierre ZFP]

[quote user="NormanH"]You will get far more property for your money in the Pyrénées, especially in the middle (Ariège etc), but there is a reason for that. It tends to be much less developed.

[/quote]

That sounds like a definite plus point to me!   Unless you are looking for gainful employment of course.

[Quillan]

[quote user="Pierre ZFP"][quote user="NormanH"]You will get far more property for your money in the Pyrénées, especially in the middle (Ariège etc), but there is a reason for that. It tends to be much less developed.
[/quote]

That sounds like a definite plus point to me!   Unless you are looking for gainful employment of course.
[/quote]

We live 'next door' in Aude. Twenty minutes or so gets us up there. I say up because much of it is above 600m and snow up to 1m plus in winter is not unheard of. Most big shopping places tend to be round the edge so you have a way to go to visit big supermarkets. The D118 that crosses it can be blocked for sure for a couple of weeks in winter at the Quillan end when there is a lot of snow. Also a lot of people from Perpignan )and norhtern France) have second homes there.

If it were me I would rent for a year in the rough area of where you are thinking to get a feel for the pace before actually buying be it the Alps, Pyrenees or where ever.

[Gardengirl]

A sound idea from Quillan about renting for a time in an area you think might be right for you, although some find just the right property for them immediately. Others find the right property for a time, but find as they get older that they need facilies much nearer.

I don't know the Pyrenees at all, but there are areas of the Alps that I know very well; only in summer, but I have close friends who we visited each year who lived there all year round for many years. Of course, it depends what you mean by the Alps; one area I know well is around Bourg D'Oisans, along to La Berarde, Venosc, Les Deux Alpes and Alpe D'Huez. Good skiing facilities and just lovely in summer with great walking in the Ecrins national park. We find that much of the area is reasonably priced near town and in some villages, with pockets much more expensive; bikers, skiers and climbers are keen to own second homes in the area.

The road up beyond Bourg D'Arud/Venosc has the problem Quillan mentions of being blocked by snow in winter, with most people leaving La Berarde and St Christophe in winter. Bourg D'Oisans is a busy little town with all facilities open all year round.

This link to one of the local campsite might be useful, as it has a lot of info on the local area:

http://www.champ-du-moulin.com/en/welcome.html

Some idea of property prices in the area:

http://www.frenchpropertylinks.com/buying.asp?ville=LeBourgDOisans38

[Sprogster]

Property in the Pyrenees is cheaper for a reason and that is because there is much less international demand than the Alps, which ranks as one of the most desirable places in the world to have a second home. Therefore, although the Alps is more expensive it should be the better investment.

The other consideration is year round accessibility and if you are looking at a second home then there is a much more extensive choice of flights to the Alps Gateway cities from the UK in winter, as the Pyrenees has never really caught the imagination of Brit skiers.

Last but not least, try before you buy is excellent advice, in that you should definitely spend time in each location before committing to buy. Especially, in the current depressed French housing market, as if you factor in the high purchase and sale costs attributable to French property, and you decided after a year or two that you had bought in the wrong area it is likely you would lose a considerable amount of money in selling up and buying elsewhere.

[Quillan]

The Pyrenees is accessible from either Carcassonne or Perpignan airports both of which have Ryan Air flights to various parts of the UK. Depending where in the Pyrenees you are the drive can be from between one and a half to two and a half hours to the ski slopes. For information on skiing have a lok at the following.

http://www.epyrenees.com/

http://midipyreneessouth.angloinfo.com/information/lifestyle/sports-leisure/ski-resorts/

and this in the Guardian

http://www.guardian.co.uk/travel/2013/mar/08/france-skiing-pyrenees-affordable-holidays

 

[idun]

I have never been to the Pyrenees. I lived in the Alpes for many years. I agree that the Alpes are usually expensive and if you find anywhere cheaper in the Alpes, then there is usually a good reason for it and personally I'd steer clear.

Depends on what you want from a place, work, retiring and possibly to resell later.

[Daft Doctor]

Having just completed a full year living in Haute Savoie in the Alps I can highly recommend it for a great all-year outdoor life, as long as you pick a 'proper' town, rather than a purpose built ski resort.   As for employment, well that may be a different matter, though having said that we've been offered work several times looking after second homes.  No doubt that type of roll the sleeves up work would be available in the Pyrenees too.  The only downside to the Alps is that everything is expensive, so that may need to come into your equation.  If you'd like any more info or have any questions, feel free to PM me.   [:)]

[Gardengirl]

Well, Idun, the area I posted about is a lovely area; I know quite a number of people who live in various parts of it, some retired, some working with families. You obviously know some areas extremely well as you lived there, but there must be many parts you don't know. If I didn't have problems coping with very cold weather for extended periods we might well have bought in that area ourselves, as we love it dearly. Not that where we bought doesn't get a share of cold weather!

It does indeed depend on the circumstances the Op is in - whether retiring, hoping to work etc. Finding work would be very difficult in most areas of France, not just the Alps or Pyrenees , but of course a lot of people can work from home these days wherever that happens to be.

I neglected to mention when posting about the Bourg D'Oisans area that as well as flights to Lyon, Ryanair flies to Grenoble, making the area very easy to reach.

[Patf]

We looked at a few places in the Pyrenees when we first came. We were looking for an alternative to the Scottish Highlands, for scenery, walking skiing etc.

There were many "bargains" to be had, picturesque log cabins up on the mountainside with fantastic views. But most had problems like no vehicular access, no mains water, no power lines. Too primitive for me, so we ended up in the Gers, about an hour's drive away.

I've never been to the Alps, so can't comment on that.

[Sprogster]

With the Alps you are less Ryanair dependent as you have a much larger choice of low cost carriers including Flybe, Easyjet, Jet2. Also of course you have BA out of Gatwick, where it adopts a low cost model. I also thought being further north the Alps were more reliable for snow, as there have been some winters where the Pyrenees resorts were somewhat lacking in the white stuff.

[HoneySuckleDreams]

[quote user="Sprogster"]as there have been some winters where the Pyrenees resorts were somewhat lacking in the white stuff.[/quote]

Not for the last few years, and this year was exceptional, however the resorts aren't open as long as the Alps.

The OP hasn't really given a lot of information really, other than a vague "'we would like to live in the mountains".

 There are some quite important questions to answer:

1. level of french - which leads on to point 2
2. is a job/income required
3. age (retirees?)
4. general health as that will have an overall cost of health "running"costs
5. kids? any/none/flown the coop? - education may be important ( do you want your kids to learn Occitan?)
6. amount to invest in property - if there is a couple of million € in the property bank then there probably is no point in any of us commenting

[Quillan]

Beat me to it HoneySuckleDreams. As far as I know and I am no skier (other than from the bar when I take my daughter skiing) all the Pyrenees resorts have snow cannons as well. She tells me that there are more 'black' runs in the Pyrenees resorts than the Alps and she now prefers it here than there. In fairness that's probably because she has a chauffeur here. [;-)]

I agree there is not enough information really to give specific advice.

[Julien]

Hi Shaun;

I have been living in the Alps for quite a while now (5 years in Grenoble).
I also know the Pyrenees pretty well because my uncle lives there.
Both are very different!

Pyrenees are much quiter, maybe more genuine since there are less tourists there.
However Pyrenees are really in the middle of nowhere (while the Alps are closed to Lyon, Genève, Marseille...).
Pyrenees are also very much linked to the spanish culture (you can go to San Sebastian very easily).

On the other hand if you are fond of skiing and you need to be in touch with "real life" - for your work for example - I recommand you choose the Alps. In my opinion this is the ideal place for working while taking advantage of the mountain :-)


If you need more advice feel free.

Regards;

Julien

[idun]

Julien, I have kept reading your post and kept reading it, and feel that you have not quite portrayed, the Alpes as they are.

Grenoble and Chambery are not full or tourists, there are some in summer, but not that many, and in winter it is usually passing trade for  those who are on their way to actually ski resorts. Annecy and Aix les Bains are definitely more touristy in summer than either of the previously mentioned, but even they are not that touristy all the year round. They are cities where people, in fact I would say usually french people, live and work.

And I suppose that I keep reading your post as you make it sound as if people from the region are disingenuous, are you saying unfriendly? I do not know the Pyrenees, but I do know all the places I have mentioned along with a lot of ski resorts and made some wonderful wonderful friends over my many years there. And I have just got back from visiting them.

It will depend on how the OP needs to make a living as to where they choose. Even in the Alpes there are some arm pits of places and usually as I said, they are cheaper than the rest of the region, and for good reason. And just looking respectable does not necessarily mean that they are good places to live.

[Pickles]

[quote user="idun"]Julien, I have kept reading your post and kept reading it, and feel that you have not quite portrayed, the Alpes as they are.

[/quote]

I have a sneaking suspicion that the only reason for "julien" posting was to advertise: the post does not really add anything to what has previously been said in the thread. I have suggested that the links be deleted.

[Quillan]

I thought I had removed them earlier but it does not appear to have 'taken'.

He may know the Alps but he does not know the Pyrenees which is obvious by his comments. In short both are different and depend on what an individual needs from their move.

The Pyrenees is not so developed as the Alps, they didn't have multi resort ski passes until a few years ago. Skiing is cheap in the Pyrenees, I went once and it cost 26 Euros for a days skiing with all the equipment and insurance. Won't do it again as I kept falling over but that's another story. You can ski in the morning and be on the beach in the after noon and in the summer there is excellent walking to be had with well marked paths. Judging by the cars that pass us on their way to the ski slopes it is very popular with the French and especially families with kids. Of course there are Spanish here, it's the nearest ski resort (along with Andorra) to them. This however creates two further benefits if you live here, tax free shopping in Andorra and cheap shopping in Spain, both of which can be reached in well under a couple of hours worse case.

As I said each area has it's own good and bad points and it depends what you want. Which ever you fancy, as always, try renting first.

[Julien]

Hi Idun;

I do not know the Pyrénées much. I went there several times all the same and especially to Foix area.

My feeling is that by and large Pyrénées are less crowded and you feel really far from urban civilization there. In the Alps this is also the case in some valleys and especially around Les Ecrins but I would say that the Alps are more connected to the rest of the world.

My goal was not to say that some are more friendly than others. I am just saying it is two different culture.

If you are looking for a real alpine culture in the Alps you have to go very far into the mountain and not stay close to Grenoble, Chambéry, Aix les bains, Annecy, Thonon...

The Alps are not "full of tourists" of course but there are quite a few there and much more than in the Pyrénées ;-)

This is not a drawback to me anyway !

My comment was rather a feeling than an in-depth comparison between both (I wouldn't be able to do so).

[Wilko]

I have skied extensively in the Alps and three times in the Pyrenees, Aix, Baq/Beret and Andorra. There is no comparison, the Alps are just superior in every way though far more expensive.

"She tells me that there are more 'black' runs in the Pyrenees resorts than the Alps" Quillan I had to laugh at this, I would think there are more black runs in Les Trois Vallee than in the whole of the Pyrenees.

W