Silly question?

[JohnRoss]

Well it might be but here goes. With two 5 month old kittens and one mature cat we get through quite a lot of cat litter, these are house cats and don't go out. In the past I have dug a big hole and deposited used litter there but there has got to be a better way of getting rid of it, getting too creaky to go on digging big holes, so what do you do? ......................JR

[Tancrède]

[quote user="JohnRoss"]these are house cats and don't go out. [/quote]

If by 'house cats' you mean that you are deliberately depriving them of a breath of fresh air, the experience of the warmth of the sun on their backs, and the entertaining possibility of catching a mouse, then yes, the question is a silly one. 

Cats, permitted a decent minimum of freedom, are perfectly capable of digging their own holes, and of disposing efficiently of their own excrement without human intervention.

[JohnRoss]

Anyone that lets 5 month old kittens outside who are becoming sexually active, castration at 6 months, is irresponsible in my opinion. Other factors include our nearest neighbours who not only shoot at anything that moves, including cats, and also puts down large quantities of poison. Be assured that those that know have indicated that an indoor cat can have a long and happy life providing certain needs are met. You have to think like a cat and not a human. We have had many cats as house guests over the years and all were happy and content and most lived to a ripe old age!........................JR

[Tancrède]

[quote user="JohnRoss"]Anyone that lets 5 month old kittens outside who are becoming sexually active, castration at 6 months, is irresponsible in my opinion. Other factors include our nearest neighbours who not only shoot at anything that moves, including cats, and also puts down large quantities of poison.[/quote]

I am sorry if my view is inconvenient, and I cannot but express my surprise that you should have undertaken to keep essentially outdoor animals under the discouraging circumstances that you describe.

[JohnRoss]

Your view is your view but your surprise might be less if you do some research into this subject as we have done!.......JR

PS Still hoping for some helpful answers and this outlines some thoughts that I would go along with. http://cat-care.suite101.com/article.cfm/can_indoor_cats_be_happy

[Chrissie]

Do you use the "clumping" style of litter?  I found this meant that only the soiled portion could be easily lifted away, reducing the amount to be disposed of.  In my view the best value for this type was the Auchan own make in a sort of purple box.

Chrissie (81) 

[JohnRoss]

Yes we have but they like to rearrange the tray contents a bit and so it tends to get mixed so we sift out the solids twice a day and accept frequent changing is necessary. With three cats we have two trays on the go in different locations. Diet, wet food versus dry food, tends to modify how much water they drink. I am not happy with feeding them large amounts of dry food but a little helps to clean their teeth and dry food often has a drinking stimulant added. In the main they prefer wet food in sachets rather than tins. So how do you dispose of waste litter? I don't think it should go out with the household rubbish which is why I have buried it in the past. Must be a real problem for those in town without large gardens or a field as in our case. I would have thought that Fuller's earth would soon block up the fosse pipes!................JR

[cooperlola]

Mix it with your compost?

I must admit that I put it in bags and tie them up and put it out with the rubbish as I cannot believe it's a bad thing to put in landfill - unlike a lot of the stuff that goes out with the household rubbish.  Sift the solids with a litter scoop and put them down the loo (or better still directly into the fosse if you can - ours in the UK had a lid you could open - so that the loo doesn't get blocked), then put the soggy wet stuff in a bag for the bin men.  As long as it's properly sealed I cannot see the rubbish collectors coming to any harm through handling it (if indeed they ever come into contact with it) as it's just the urine soaked stuff.

We used to have house cats in the UK (we lived in the country but on a fast main road and after the sixth cat got squashed we severely limited their outdoor excursions) - they too led long happy lives.  Yes, our current cats have a better life but I still don't think we were cruel to our cats in England.  Before they came to us they were in danger of being put down so I think on balance a life as a house cat was better than that.[:)]

[Chrissie]

Cats are fastidious creatures.  You might find that a third litter tray would result in them eventually using one each and feeling less need to scratch and churn the stuff about.  (I know the received wisdom in the USA is to have TWO trays per cat, one for pee and one for poo, but really ........!  I also found that the deeper the litter, the less covering-up activity followed, and the less seeping through to the actual trays, so tended to maintain a good 2-3 inches depth.  Also a covered litter tray helped (looks a bit like a travelling carrier but with one side open) presumably going back to the privacy issue.

I decided it was better to stick the stuff bagged-up in the household waste and go to landfill, than risk clogging our fosse or creating a huge pit in the garden. As avid recyclers, we didn't otherwise have a lot of "black bag" contents so it wasn't too bad.

Chrissie (81)

[Megan le Fey]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m3PsI48Klj0

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G46kV73rzt4&NR=1

Sorry, using Google Chrome and can't make links live. You will have to copy & paste.

[Jo]

Have always put ours in with the household waste, as instructed by our local council when asked if there was a greener option. Just as an aside, nothing wrong with keeping indoor cats if you are prepared to put in the work. Having lost the MOST beautiful tom cat to poisoning,  in some ways wish I had.............[:(]

[Swissie]

Personally I feel it is very important for cats to have access to nature- I just wouldn't keep cats if that was not possible. Having said that, we know many people who have house cats- although (maybe just a coincidence) they are all totally neurotic! As they are rescue cats, they are used to a litter tray. As from next year all our litter will be weighed and paid for (credit card style gadget to open council bin) - we sift poos and bag into normal bin - and all the rest goes in thin layers in compost bins - as we have 6 bins on the go- its no problem - it is layered with grass cuttings,  household veg waste, scrunched up newspaper and torn wet cardboard. Our household waste is practically nil.

[cooperlola]

[quote user="Swissie"]they are all totally neurotic!

[/quote]The people or the cats? 

I prefer my cats to have the life they have here but back in the UK I think they were better off than being put down which was their potential fate if we hadn't taken them on.  And rescue cats can be selected according to their former lifestyle - I would not, for example, want to put a cat who was used to being outside all its life, into a home where they were kept in.  But when they've been used to it, I really think it's a different matter.

[Swissie]

Of course, I fully understand what you mean. Cats however were not 'designed' for life indoors - and perhaps they have a tendency to be a bit neurotic if kept inside. Sometimes as you said it is unavoidable, but personally would not wish for any cat to live indoors if it could be helped.

[JohnRoss]

Well thanks to all for the interesting replies. One would seem to be in a no win situation as regards used cat litter. Some sites suggest not in the compost as some bacteria, dangerous ones, will not be broken down and could be a danger when put on the garden. Others are against burying in the garden as nasties could get into the water table and thence to streams. Landfill the same problem. Councils would seem to vary in their reaction to putting it in the rubbish so I must find out what our local authority has to say about it. Some sites condemn the use of clay type litter saying that there is a risk to the cat from agents inhaled from the litter and only support the use of wood based litter so no clear cut advice or opinion about any of this! 

The debate about indoor cats versus outdoor cats will continue I suspect. All the cats we have taken on over the years were from rescue centres and had a life with us that they might not have had otherwise. They were never neurotic and most lived long lives, i.e. between 15 and 17+ years. Only one died after only 11 years and that was due to feline leukemia and nothing to do with environment. Our current three like to sit in the verandah in the sun now that Summer has at last arrived. I am going to rebuild the outside run for them this year and they have plenty of places to hide in the house with elevated places where they can sit and wait for their imagined prey, often us or each other! They have various games and toys to keep them occupied and we make a point of engaging with them several times a day. Yes we would like them to have free access to outside but if they did they would be soon dead cats and not happy ones!.........................................JR

PS See http://www.stuffweuse.com/Lungwash.html

[Swissie]

Well done for giving them such a good home - perhaps the neurotic indoor cats I know are a bit 'funny' because they are pure breed very expensive posh cats!

We are lucky to have enough space to have lots of compost bins, and therefore the proportion of cat litter is very small and in thin layers, and without solid matter.

Bonne chance. Here when the pay as you use litter bins come into action next year - it is going to be a real problem for cat owners, especially in towns.

[cooperlola]

Well, the point surely is that if they were outdoor cats they'd just use the flower beds anyway so a bit of time to break the stuff down and mixing it with other compost can't be very different and is possibly better.  The Fuller's Earth itself surely cannot harm the soil - just the stuff that's added by the cats....

[JohnRoss]

Unless the compost process the mild heat produced causes the dangerous bacteria to multiply. The point about Fuller's Earth was the possible danger of inhaled particles of aluminium and silica related chemicals in provoking or adding to lung problems in both cat and man.................................................................JR

[cooperlola]

[quote user="JohnRoss"]Unless the compost process the mild heat produced causes the dangerous bacteria to multiply. ................................................................JR[/quote]If you put the sh1* down the loo (or directly into the cess pit) then presumably that is less of a problem? 

Interesting about the Fuller's Earth.  Sawdust or just good old fashioned earth might be an alternative then (if your cats will use them). 

[JohnRoss]

Well yes we put most of the poo down the loo but there is always some when I empty the tray down the hole. This article makes worrying reading. Our last cat had urinary problems and lung problems before he died. I often wonder if my asthma like symptoms could be due to years of handling this stuff! Think we will try the wood pellets type again. Tried it some years ago but the cats did not like it, maybe it was pine based wood? Have found some web sites that suggest that pine has its own dangers for both cats and humans and causes similar problems to the clay type of litter. In fairness most cited pine wood shavings used for bedding for rats as the culprit for breathing problems............................JR

http://cats.about.com/cs/litterbox/a/clumpingclay_2.htm