Question for the boys - purchase of a new car

[Gemonimo]

My ageing but faithful Fiat Bravo is cruising to a dignified end.  My cute local Peugeot garageist has proposed a new 5 door206hdi Urban (recommended retail price €13750) for the sum of €10,590.  This figure was arrived at by adding in €400 for peinture metallise, and €380 for the radio and deducting €1000 from the government, €700 for something else (can't remember what) and €2,430 'commercial' reduction.  My question, boys, is...... (a) is the 206hdi a good buy, and (b) is the price correct or should I go back with someone who knows about cars and negotiate from a position of strength[Www]

[Anton Redman]

Little naughty not a problem but the car has been replaced by the 207. The 206 car has probably already been built and may have been sitting arround doing nothing for 12 months (one of the worst things you can do to a car) . Not sure how old the Bravo is - suspect over ten years ?  Against that I bought in the UK an ex demo 306 HDI a couple of four years before we moved to France. The car now has 200,000 miles up and only two many trips to the builders merchant, market garden and dump, which have taken their toll on the interior caused us to buy a a high day and holidays newer car but I still find it a reasonable drive.

I would have a trip round a few other local Peugeot dealers and see what they propose as the price to change. One phrase from the 'Arthur Dailey school of negotiation' - 'That is so much more that that my husband was quoted but I would like to buy from you.' once you have a couple of prices to change you can then talk to your garagist from a position of strength. Link below when I searched Uk site for 206

http://www.peugeot.co.uk/vehicles/peugeot-car-range/peugeot-207-3door-hatchback/?campaignid=PPC_NCS&advertiserid=google&bannerid=peugeot_206

 

[Gemonimo]

It's interesting that you mention the car may already have been built and sitting around as I did ask.  They said, no, it wouldn't be built until beginning of September for delivery in mid to late October.  The model in question is a 206+ and it is the new 207 design but I will go back and ask about the difference between the 206+ and the 207. But I certainly will contact a dealership to get a better idea.   Thanks for your input Anton.

[AnOther]

Not totally on topic but in the Which 2009 car survey consisting of reports from 77,000 owners with 84,000 vehicles aged from 1999 to 2009, 6 out of 10 of the worst cars were French (covering all 3 major French manufacturers) whilst not one French car appeared in the list of the 10 best.

Out of 38 manufacturers listed under reliability Citroen comes in at 27th, Peugeot, 30th, and Renault 37th, Land Rover was last !

Just saying................................[Www]

But would I buy a French car, not on your life [+o(]

[Gemonimo]

But would I buy a French car, not on your life

 

Perhaps I should throw a six and start again?  One of the major reasons I'm interested in a French car is that there are Peugeot, Citroen, Renault garages everywhere and it's easy to get parts, etc.  Being a lone female, thus easily taken advantage of [:$] (in the automobile sense, bien sur), my local Peugeot garageist who knows me well, has an interest in getting me a good deal and maintaining my car correctly.  I don't think I'm explaining myself very well, but a new car is a bundle of €€€€€'s and I don't know who to trust. 

[AnOther]

[quote user="Gemonimo"]One of the major reasons I'm interested in a French car is that there are Peugeot, Citroen, Renault garages everywhere and it's easy to get parts, etc.  Being a lone female, thus easily taken advantage of [:$] (in the automobile sense, bien sur), my local Peugeot garageist who knows me well, has an interest in getting me a good deal and maintaining my car correctly. I don't think I'm explaining myself very well, but a new car is a bundle of €€€€€'s and I don't know who to trust.  [/quote]You've explained yourself perfectly Gemonimo and I do understand and sympathise with your position. Your logic is sound enough and it's difficult to see what other route is open to you - but I still wouldn't personally buy a French car [:'(]

I'm sure you'll be OK though [:)]

Bonne chance.

[Théière]

Can't disagree..........but this tempted me into a dealer

http://www.fuelfugitives.co.uk/?campaignid=HDi&advertiserid=Redirection#/intro/

[Gemonimo]

OK, let's look at this from a different angle. If you had between 10 and 11 euros to spend on a new car (reductions included), what would you buy?  Perhaps then I can make a comparison.  M**de... this is getting more and more complicated.

[AnOther]

Entirely your choice of course but is there any particular reason that you want to buy a new car as opposed to say a one or 2 year old ?

Something else I would never do BTW, buy new that is [;-)]

 

[Gemonimo]

Actually, AnO, the reason that I'm thinking of buying new is that I am interested in all the 'deals' ofered by the government and the salesmen.  This totals €4130 off the price of a new car which should, in theory, leave me worry free for the next two to three years and although there are good second hand buys out there, as a 'pensioner' (who?... me?) I don't need the aggravation of buying a 'pup', albeit in good faith. I know all this is a bit daft, pink and fluffy, but what I want is SECURITY.

[mint]

[quote user="Gemonimo"]OK, let's look at this from a different angle. If you had between 10 and 11 euros to spend on a new car (reductions included), what would you buy?  Perhaps then I can make a comparison.  M**de... this is getting more and more complicated.[/quote]

Er........a dinky toy one?

Seriously, Jen, you have my sympathy.  Your problem might also be mine as my old car has gone off to some cowboy repairer (can't afford a proper garageist) to see if bonnet, bumper, etc, etc can be fixed at reasonable cost.

But, I agree about not buying French.  In fact, I was going to go back to the UK to buy a "bargain".

Will let you know if I need to buy a new (occasion) car.  Then, we can compare notes.

[Gemonimo]

Sweets, if you go the the UK to buy a 'bargain', how do you know it will remain a 'bargain' once in France?  And won't you have to go through the hassle of registering it (more €€€'s) and in addition it will be a right hand drive car.  I must admit that the €4,130 falling out of the sky was an incentive to buy new, even if it ends up being a 'voiture sans permis'[:-))]

[mint]

Yes, need to do the sums:  cost of new headlamps (depends on the car), cost of carte grise, cost of trip over and cost of bringing it back.

Still cheaper in the UK.

And yes, I'd prefer LHD but beggars can't be choosers.  Why do bills, including income tax bill, come all at the same time?

What immutable law makes that happen? 

[Benjamin]

[quote user="Gemonimo"] I know all this is a bit daft, pink and fluffy, but what I want is SECURITY.[/quote]

It's not all pink and fluffy when you're trying to make decisions on things that you don't know a lot about whereas people like Ernie/Another are always taking cars to pieces and are quite happy buying second hand. We buy new because we don't know a lot about cars but at the end of the day that new car becomes older so make sure you buy a reliable make in the first place.

I certainly wouldn't buy a car on the basis that there are plenty of dealers locally. We have to travel 20 kms to our nearest dealer but when we need the annual service I book it in for a specific time , normally first thing in the morning, and wait the hour and a half or so whilst they complete the service. I would not buy from a garage that operates on the old UK system of drop it in in the morning and 'phone at 5 pm to see if it's ready. If I can make timed appointments elsewhere then I expect the garage to be the same. In owning the same non-French make in France (and earlier in the UK) for many years I've never been disappointed with the levels of service I have received.

Finally, if it's a 307 spec then why not call it one? I suspect, irrespective of what they say, that they're trying to shift older stock.

Best of luck.

[Théière]

Can you still buy cars cheaper in Belgium? Years ago I was going to buy and import into the UK a scooby because it was around £4000 less than a dealer in the UK and you could request either a left or right hand drive.

[Anton Redman]

Peugeot, and therefore Citroen, both had problems with was structured wiring. The only non scheduled replacement part I had in 200,000 miles was the fuel pump at 190,000.

 

[RicandJo]

A couple of years ago I hired a 206Hdi to get me from Zurich to Milan.  Although it was the 3 door not the 5 I have to say I loved it.  Nippy, handled brilliantly, comfortable seats, VERY economical.  I'm not a Pug fan but I would have bought one if I was in the market for a new car.

Last weekend I rented a car to go from London to Cheshire to see my mum - I was given a 5 door 207.  Probably the worst car I have ever driven.  Absolutely awful.  Had 6,000 miles on the clock but felt like 60,000 - horrible engine and road noise, rubbish suspension, rubbish handling.

SO......if it's the 'oldstock' 206, buy it if you like it.  If it really is a newer 207, don't go near it!!!!

[Gemonimo]

[quote user="RicandJo"]

 

SO......if it's the 'oldstock' 206, buy it if you like it.  If it really is a newer 207, don't go near it!!!!

[/quote]

Well that's comforting! Thanks so much!

[Stan Streason]

[quote user="Gemonimo"]OK, let's look at this from a different angle. If you had between 10 and 11 euros to spend on a new car (reductions included), what would you buy?  Perhaps then I can make a comparison.  M**de... this is getting more and more complicated.[/quote]

2 points.  My son who knows about such things (he is an automotive engineer) was recently in the same position.  After all his research he plumped for a new Fiesta.

I was selling one of my cars recently and the prospective purchaser sent someone to survey it.  He drives for a living doing over 100k miles a year and carries out long term tests for manufacturers.  He said the Fiesta he was in at the time was one of the best cars he had ever driven almost irrespective of price.

I have no link with Fords or any Ford dealer.

[Pierre ZFP]

That's funny because I was going to suggest a Fiesta.

Just seen an advert for the Fiesta Eco-something

Claims 3.7l/100km or if you like, 98g CO2 per km

Price?  €9000 ish (including the gov payback)

[Stan Streason]

The problems with Fords are that there are about a million variants.  What are your main criteria? Economy - Comfort - Eco friendly - Performance, Price etc etc?  A local runaround or a motorway tourer?

Will ask my son which variant he would have had given your choices.

[Gemonimo]

Thanks, Stan.  My criteria are (and not in any particular order),  price, economy and reliability.  Although most of my driving is local (extra-urbaine), I do drive to Ikea in Bordeaux from time to time[:-))] and now that I am child-free and can please myself (YES!!!!!) I plan on visiting friends in Montenegro, Spain and Poland - bank account permitting, bien sur. I have heard that Ford Fiestas are good value and a friend of mine recently exchanged hers for a Toyota something or other.  All advice much appreciated.

[Stan Streason]

I suppose the biggest question is petrol or diesel?  At the lower price end (Fiesta Studio) the Diesel car is roughly £1500 more expensive than the petrol but gets 67mpg rather than 51 on the same cycle.  Is it worth the extra?  Depends on your mileage and the relative price of petrol/diesel in your area.

Ford UK has a "configure your own car" section which is quite fun.  I presume Ford France would have the same.  I would work out exactly what you want (a list of must haves and nice to haves) then go shopping for prices sounding you know what you are talking about.  (although this goes for any car you want).

[AnOther]

[quote user="Gemonimo"]I plan on visiting friends in Montenegro, Spain and Poland[/quote]I think you've just at least partly sunk your own argument for wanting a French car.

If you are contemplating such trips then how many Citroen/Renault/Peugeot garages do you think there might be in those places. IMO you'd be better off with something less colloquial, something from the VW stable perhaps, i.e. Skoda, Seat etc., or a Ford Fiesta, or possibly go Japanese.

Haven't really looked up prices but I would suggest that a diesel VW Polo, Skoda Fabia, or Ford Fiesta, might be just the ticket for you [;-)]

[Benjamin]

The WhatCar website is a good place to look for cars as well as reading reader reviews. Don't compare UK and French prices as models and specs can vary.

http://www.whatcar.com/car-reviews