Car Accident - advice please

[crabtree]

Recently my wife and I were involved in a car accident. Unfortunately my wife has broken 3 fingers on her right hand, and the car is written off.

Briefly, we were the only car on a quiet country road. As we were exiting a sharp right hand bend the rear of the car swerved violently (lack of grip) to the right and I had no control. I managed to turn the steering wheel and the car swerved violently in the opposite direction, heading towards an embankment. I turned away but again the rear swerved violently, and now the car was going towards a 5 foot ditch and eventually flipped forwards over the front and then rolled and eventually finished on it's roof.

A passer by stopped to help, and informed us that the road had just been relaid and there was a lot of loose chippings. This appears likely to have been the cause of the car swerving violently and the reason for the accident. There were no signs warning of the loose chippings, although since the accident they have been put in place! Gendarmes and pompiers called. Evening spent at hospital!

That briefly covers the accident.

I have two questions:

1. Can my wife make any sort of claim for her injuries.
2. Can we claim against the road laying company.

If the answer is yes to either of these questions, what are the options?

Thank you all in advance.

[woolybanana]

Assuming this is in France and under French insurance, I would contact your insurance company and ask to make a claim on your behalf. They will want a load of details but they do grind very fine and if at all possible will get you something.

[NormanH]

Your car insurance may include assistance juridique who could give you advice..

[idun]

I doubt that you can claim compensation in France, as you were driving.

The insurance companies take the attitude that you chose to drive or

whatever other activity they cover and you are in some way responsible

if something happens. With driving, driving in a manner to suit road

conditions.

Over the years I have had my surprises with the way french insurers work, and ours would pay up when things were not our fault and the other person had insurance, but their insurance company was never contacted, and never any compensation.

I notice that you say recently, did you advise your insurance company within the proper time frame? It is usually quite quick.

[crabtree]

Thanks for your replies. Yes, this was in France, French car, French insurance.

My insurance company have all the details, and have taken action as regards the car (awaiting payout!).

I have suggested they might make a complaint against the road surface company, but they have not yet responded.

I should have added that the gendarmes have suggested the (newly laid) road was the cause of the accident.

Here are the relevant clauses in my insurance contract:

Responsabilité Civile

Dommages corporels illimités

Dommages matériels et immatériels limités à 100 millions d’euros

Sans franchise

Défense Pénale et Recours Suite à Accident A concurrence de 18.600€. Se reporter systématiquement aux Conditions Générales

Sans franchise

Garantie Corporelle du Conducteur Dans la limite de 600.000 € à partir d’un taux d’IP supérieur à 15%

[allanb]

I agree with Norman's suggestion: your best source of advice is your insurance company, and it may even be free. Nevertheless, for what it's worth, here's what I think.

In answer to your first question: your wife is an injured third party (un tiers) and might have a claim against you, which would be settled by your insurers – but it's not clear what she could sue you for. Compensation for pain and suffering, maybe, but that's difficult to value; medical expenses (if not reimbursed); loss of earnings (if any). Obviously nobody wants to go to court in this situation, and your insurers might agree to some settlement.

You write: "My insurance company have all the details, and have taken action as regards the car (awaiting payout!)" If this means that your insurers have agreed to pay for the damage to the car, then I don't think you can expect to recover that from anyone else. Your insurers, having compensated you for the damage, would have the right to take over any claim that you might have against the road laying company.

If there is anything else that you might hope to recover from that company, they would probably claim that you were driving too fast for the conditions, and a court might agree (in spite of what the gendarmes said). Sorry if this sounds negative, but I think it's realistic.

As for any other insurance claim: apart from the first four items in your list, which refer to compulsory third-party insurance, the other clauses that you mentioned are (a) legal costs resulting from an accident (I think this means your defence if you are sued or prosecuted) and (b) compensation for you if you suffer permanent disability judged to be more than 15% (IP = invalidité permanente). You didn't mention either of those.

[AnOther]

Playing devils advocate and on the same lines allanb has alluded to assuming that yours was not the only car to travel that road +/- that time, but was the only one to fail to safely negotiate that bend, certain conclusions might be drawn.

[crabtree]

Thanks to all for your replies.

I have asked my insurance company about my wife's situation. I await their response.

Regarding the road - at bends I am always conscience of other drivers misjudging the bend. So on a right hand bend I hug the nearside, and on a left hand bend I stay as wide as possible (this also gives the earliest possible view of oncoming traffic). Unfortunately on this occasion being wide on the bend put me in the loose stuff, had I not been so wide I reckon the accident would not have happened.

Just to add that excess speed was not involved here. According to the gendarmes had I been doing over 40kph, one or both of us may well not be around to tell the tale!

[EuroTrash]

"Unfortunately on this occasion being wide on the bend put me in the loose stuff, had I not been so wide I reckon the accident would not have happened."

Again, playing devil's advocate - could you not see the 'loose stuff''? Anyone who has ever ridden a motorbike would instinctively avoid putting a wheel onto the loose stuff at any cost. Your reasons for staying wide on left handers are good ones on normal road surfaces but you have to be prepared to adapt, and risking a skid in order to see potential oncoming traffic a micro-second sooner can't be a good decision.

That said, long ago I worked for a civil engineering company and I was disgusted by their cavalier attitude to leaving loose chippings after they'd resurfaced a road - they reckoned that it was cheaper to let the traffic scatter the chippings and for them to pay out a dozen or so insurance claims from motorists whose windscreens had been broken and paintwork had been damaged by flying chips, than to keep the roadworks in place and employ a roadsweeper and crew for an extra day to sweep up them up. So that's what they did.

[idun]

I have noticed that since this post it has made me very aware of the speed I corner at especially sharp bends, or go around smallish

roundabouts at too. And I know that I am usually in 2nd and going well

under 20mph which is about 32kph. I know how to drive faster, and have driven faster. Find it a smoother ride for me and my passengers, and/or any bottles I have in the car, or children, come to think.

I would hope that my preferred speed would save me from skidding on loose gravel. I hope that I never end up having to find out.

[crabtree]

[quote user="EuroTrash"]"Unfortunately on this occasion being wide on the bend put me in the loose stuff, had I not been so wide I reckon the accident would not have happened."

Again, playing devil's advocate - could you not see the 'loose stuff''? Anyone who has ever ridden a motorbike would instinctively avoid putting a wheel onto the loose stuff at any cost. Your reasons for staying wide on left handers are good ones on normal road surfaces but you have to be prepared to adapt, and risking a skid in order to see potential oncoming traffic a micro-second sooner can't be a good decision.

That said, long ago I worked for a civil engineering company and I was disgusted by their cavalier attitude to leaving loose chippings after they'd resurfaced a road - they reckoned that it was cheaper to let the traffic scatter the chippings and for them to pay out a dozen or so insurance claims from motorists whose windscreens had been broken and paintwork had been damaged by flying chips, than to keep the roadworks in place and employ a roadsweeper and crew for an extra day to sweep up them up. So that's what they did.[/quote]

I have driven over loose chippings many times, and you always get that noise when they come up into the wheel arches, so you know all about them being there. On this occasion there was no noise, no loose chippings visible and no signs put up.

Funny enough, the gendarme told me when we were at his 'office' making a statement, that they nearly had the same thing happen to them when they drove off from the scene!!!

[suein56]

[quote user="crabtree"]

Funny enough, the gendarme told me when we were at his 'office' making a statement, that they nearly had the same thing happen to them when they drove off from the scene!!! [/quote]

I hope you asked him to put that in writing and sign it !

Sue

[sid]

These chippings really are nuisance, I hate them. In the car you can feel the sort of "uneasiness" transmitted back through the supsnesion. On a motorbike it's a nightmare.

The council (DDE ? - it's rarely a company that puts down chippings on local roads) rely on the passing traffic to roll the surface stones into the underlying tar. I'm surprised that there were no "gravillons" warning signs, and 40kph (25mph) is a very low speed to get into a 2-directional skid; are you sure about the speed? The question will be asked again, I'm sure.

 

 

 

[crabtree]

[quote user="sid"]I'm surprised that there were no "gravillons" warning signs, and 40kph (25mph) is a very low speed to get into a 2-directional skid; are you sure about the speed? The question will be asked again, I'm sure. [/quote]

It is a road I use often, so know the bend well, and always take it at around 40kph. I was already at a low speed before the bend, so there was no braking involved, just very gentle acceleration through the bend (as this is how a bend should be taken).