Electricity bills again.

[Mr Tivoli Blue]

Forgive me for resurrecting the electricity prices again but as things are gettiing tighter and tighter with price rises etc the time has come round to review my electricity bill.

I have owned my property in France for 8 years. When we took over the house we were on one tarif. ( triphase installation) I soon had it altered to a dual tarif meter. 9 Kva. The only reason we left the installation 3 phase was due to obtaining a free 3 phase 200 litre water heater. The little ascot thing in the kitchen often removed your eyebrows[blink]

We usually occupy the house for four to five weeks split into one week stints from April to November with the occasional Christmas.

I have been fortunate to take meter readings after every visit so know how much electricity has been used on each occasion. I have done this for water as well ( sad)[geek]

I have taken a look at the water heater and it can be very easily

converted to single phase with a few wire changes. This would give an

output of 2.4 Kw 220 volts as opposed to the 2.4 Kw spread across 3

phases So if it's favourable to go for a single phase option the that

can be done. As for the consumer unit again it's just a case of

changing the three busbars to one single busbar.( I'm a qualified electrician)[:$]

We have seen the bills steadily rise over the years. So i now want to look and see whether i can reduce the costs.

I have a brochure from the supplier showing the different tarifs. BUT as my French is very limited to my disgust i am unable to fully understand the tarifs.

There are 3 options

1 Option base which is one tarif

2. option Heures Creuses  dual tarif which i believe is the one i have from old.

3. option Tempo days at different rates

The option tempo states 22 days at a high rate which appears to be from November to March. Can these days be selected or are they fixed 22 days ie weekends. Because this would suit me as i am not there.

So from the wise knowledge of the many who live in France i am asking which option would suit my living style? Please.

[NormanH]

The days which are at the high tariff on Tempo are selected by  EDF, but in any case I don't think this option is still available.

Do you really need 9Kva? I have 6 and it is ample. The standing charge is lower too.

[suein56]

[quote user="Mr Tivoli Blue"]

There are 3 options

2. option Heures Creuses  dual tarif which i believe is the one i have from old.

... of the many who live in France i am asking which option would suit my living style? [/quote]

If you have 'heures creuses' and are only living in your house for approx 5 weeks a year then this is really your worst option. We live here all year round and are all-electric - bar a gas hob - and we only manage to break even on 'heures creuses'. The standing charges for this option are very high. We would change  the tarif if only it was our house, but we are renting ...

Sue

[Mr Tivoli Blue]

[quote user="NormanH"]The days which are at the high tariff on Tempo are selected by  EDF, but in any case I don't think this option is still available.

Do you really need 9Kva? I have 6 and it is ample. The standing charge is lower too.

[/quote]

The 9 Kva is legacy from the previous owner. The house is all elecrtric heating with convector heaters four in total. Which we do not use as we have a wood burner installed  Are you suggesting staying 3 phase on single tarif option base or going single phase on option base?

  6 Kva would probably be sufficient 30A single phase 10A each triphase. Only got a few lights, 2 fridges (one beer) microwave, washing machine, diswasher, and water heater, not all on at once. 

[NormanH]

I don't really understand about phases, but I am sure that for what you describe 6 Kva is ample.

I have that for two flats, and we  have  2 fridges 1 washing machine water heater and 4 convector heater, between us  as well as the usual domestic small appliances

I have a tenant  in another house who has fridge, washing machine, water heater microwave/grill and lights electric kettle coffee machine etc...and he gets away with 3Kva

[Anton Redman]

22 Red dsays between 1 st November and 31st March - Saturdays Sudays and Bank Holidays are never red are there are never more than 5 red days consequtively)

43 White days can be selected all year lon but never on a Sunday

Broadly they tend to be in winter when the weather is worst and highest demand is expected - Except if there has beena warm year there is a rush of reddays just before 31st March.

I believe that if you opt for tempo Meter shows current status and next days status but do not have tempo myself.

L'option Tempo se caracterise donc par 3 couleurs réparties tout au long de l'année : 

22 jours rouges du 1er novembre au 31 mars du lundi au vendredi (les samedis, dimanches et jours fériés ne sont jamais rouges et il ne peut y avoir plus de 5 jours rouges consécutifs),

43 jours blancs répartis tout au long de l'année mais jamais le dimanche,

300 jours bleus tout le reste de l'année (tous les dimanches sont bleus).

[NormanH]

But as I said above I don't think it is available to new subscribers..

[Clair]

Forget Tempo, it is not available to new susbscribers as Norman says.

Your only choice is the basic tariff or the HP/HC tariff.

The HP/HC tariff is only worth having if you can take advantage of the low rate to run your washing-machine, tumble dryer, DIY equipment, etc...

As you are not at the house full-time, you will be paying a high standing charge for a service which you cannot make full use of.

Go for the 6kVa basic tariff (or the 3kVa although it might be too low).

[KathyF]

We have had a second home in France for 6 years and now spend all summer there. We are still on a 3 KW supply, though we have to be careful not to use two or more higher-powered machines at the same time. [:)] On our more occasional out-of-season visits we still manage with the wood-burner and an electric convector heater, but being hardy souls we're not worried about having very warm bedrooms.  If you are you'll need a bigger supply for all those heaters.

[Mr Tivoli Blue]

Many thanks for your information and advice. I think i will make a few calculations based on what we used last year on a basic tarif and see how it works out. I think it's looks  favourable to have the single tarif. As for single or three phase i'm not too sure on that one but i believe that i will pay more in standing charge for 3 phase than single. if that is the case it will be single phase 6 kva to start with. I can monitor my consumption ( borrowed equipment) so if i find i'm within the limits and don't keep tripping the RCD then  i can the after a year reduce further to possibly 3 Kva.

Many thanks but please still keep adding your advice and comments.

[Mr Tivoli Blue]

Having now had a little fiddle with the calculator it seems that it would benefit me to go on to the standard single tarif as opposed to Pleine and Creuse. The only thing that is bothering me is do i pay the same standing charge whether i have triphase or single phase. According to the leaflet i picked up from the local edf  or Seolis place there is no mention of this. Dropping to the 6 kva will help out as well.

The leaflet has prices from August 2009 so it's current ( no pun intended)[:D]

[NormanH]

That's why I said I didn't know about the phases.

Certainly your answer seems 6 va simple .

[Mr Tivoli Blue]

[quote user="NormanH"]That's why I said I didn't know about the phases.

Certainly your answer seems 6 va simple .

[/quote]

If i changed to 6 Kva 3 phase i would  effectively get 3 lots of 6 Kva ie 3 lots of 30A at 220volts between live and neutral. so 60amps in total. If i had 6 Kva monophase i would only get 1 lot of 30A. However having triphase means you can run equipment on 3 phases 415volts between phases eg Pumps, Chauffe eau etc. But it's not common to run such devices unless your some kind of commercial venture. All this is the same for bigger supplies eie 9 Kva 45A per phase total 135A. As i only have a few appliances and they all won't be on at the same time i can probably get away with the monophase 6Kva supply. The problem with triphase is the danger of having 415 volts kicking around and if the wiring has has been mucked around with there is the potential of having this high voltage present in possibly a 2 gang light switch or junction box. It gives a nasty and potentially fatal electric shock. [:-))]

All i am asking is do i pay more standing charge for 3 phase as opposed to single phase because as you can see above you get 3 times more electricity on 3 phase than single phase. for the same charge. I think they don't give it away. somehow. Actually that's not strictly true cos the meter will tick over what's used from all three phases. So i guess the charge would be the same. silly me[:)] Anyway i hope the three phase bit is clear now.