Patf Posted February 15, 2012 Share Posted February 15, 2012 The lady on the fish counter at Intermarché likes to correct my french pronunciation. Today I commented that the "truite" looked "très fraiche".I pronounced très as in english, with the "e" as in "set" and sounding the "s". So she corrected me to say "tray". And truite she pronounced "truit- u". Is that normal or is it a dialect thing? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pachapapa Posted February 15, 2012 Share Posted February 15, 2012 Everybody does it, sounds like an acute accent, gives more emphasis.[;-)]http://www.forvo.com/word/tr%C3%A8s_tr%C3%A8s_chic/#frhttp://www.forvo.com/search/tr%C3%A8s/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Patf Posted February 15, 2012 Author Share Posted February 15, 2012 Thanks for that - sounds like halfway between "e" and "ay." But definitely no "s" on the end. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NormanH Posted February 15, 2012 Share Posted February 15, 2012 s at the end of most words is silent, unless another word beginning with a vowel follows, and then you here it in a 'liaison'tri (with the i as in 'it'... a very short sound) for trèsbut triz before a word like 'amusant'triz_amusantthe 'e' at the end of word is especially marked in the Southtruite = trrrweeet_uh Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
idun Posted February 15, 2012 Share Posted February 15, 2012 I would have said 'tray' and as NH said 'trrrweeet - uh'. 'Trez' would be before a vowel. In my neck of the woods, certainly 'trez' and not 'triz'. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NormanH Posted February 15, 2012 Share Posted February 15, 2012 You are right idun [:$]I was forgetting that tri is the southern accent [:)]I even saw one of my colleagues write "trés bien" because that very short i sound is how it is said here.Of course in standard French it should be like trea in "tread"I avoid writing 'tray' because that can give the typical British fault of turning into a diphthong 'tray..ee..uh' Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
idun Posted February 15, 2012 Share Posted February 15, 2012 I reckon that I would have picked up a pretty decent southern accent, but a 'normal' french one is illusive. I just love the the 'sink' for cinq etc. I remember once being asked if I could understand those from the south, and much to their surprise I said I could. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loiseau Posted February 15, 2012 Share Posted February 15, 2012 Patf, as said above, "tray" is a pretty good approximation of the real pronounciation of tres; you would only pronounce the "s" on the end if you wanted to say "tres ennuyeux" (sorry, can't do accents on here!), or something else where the following word began with a vowel.The fact that she said "trweet-uh" was just to show you that there was a letter "e" at the end of the word truite. You would never say it like that really. Just "trweet".Angela Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mint Posted February 15, 2012 Share Posted February 15, 2012 [quote user="Loiseau"]The fact that she said "trweet-uh" was just to show you that there was a letter "e" at the end of the word truite. You would never say it like that really. Just "trweet".Angela[/quote]Au contraire, Angela, here in the south-west, people quite often say every syllable. Thus, trueet-uh, quarant-uh, feey-uh.(fille), côt-uh du Rhone, and so on.I used to think that they just do it to me feel "foreign" especially the woman at the post office who used to correct me when I asked for dix timbres à soixante (oh the days when stamps pour Angleterre were only 60 cents!) by saying soixant-uh!Of course now, my neighbour, with whom I go to excercise class twice a week and we are on "tu" terms and are good companionable friends, says bonn-uh nuit to me.So, I guess that, although not in any of the pronunciation books, in the south west, it's fine to sound every syllable! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
idun Posted February 15, 2012 Share Posted February 15, 2012 Loiseau, how do you get that 'te' sound over at the end of truite then? I find with my mouth in french mode if I don't '-uh', even a tadge, I cannot get the 'te' sound in and it is just about silent. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NormanH Posted February 15, 2012 Share Posted February 15, 2012 This well-loved old classic shows the way the 'e' at the end of certain words is pronounced as 'uh' http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q24qnmpbdOUif you scroll down on the video you can follow the text [:D]or: Elle était jeune filleSortait tout droit de son couventInnocente et gentilleQui n'avait pas seize ansLe jeudi, jour de visite,Elle venait chez ma mèreEt elle nous jouait la TruiteLa Truite de Schubert Un soir de grand orageElle dut coucher à la maisonOr malgré son jeune âgeElle avait de l'obstinationEt pendant trois heures de suiteAu milieu des éclairsElle nous a joué la TruiteLa Truite de Schubert On lui donna ma chambreMoi je couchai dans le salonMais je crus bien comprendreQue ça ne serait pas longEn effet elle revint bien vitePieds nus, dans les courants d'airPour me chanter la TruiteLa Truite de Schubert Ce fut un beau solfègePizzicattis coquinsAccords, trémolos et arpègesFantaisie à quatre mainsMais à l'instant tout s'agiteSous l'ardent aiguillon de la chairElle, elle fredonnait la TruiteLa Truite de Schubert Je lui dis: GabrielleVoyons, comprenez mon émoiIl faut être fidèleCe sera Schubert ou moiC'est alors que je compris bien viteEn lisant dans ses yeux perversQu'elle me réclamait la suiteLa suite du concert Six mois après l'orageNous fûmes dans une situationTelle que le mariageÉtait la seule solutionMais avec un air insoliteAu lieu de dire oui au maireElle lui a chanté la TruiteLa Truite de Schubert C'est fou ce que nous fîmesContre cette obsessionOn mit Gabrielle au régimeLui supprimant le poissonMais par une journée mauditeDans le vent, l'orage et les éclairsElle mit au monde une truiteQu'elle baptisa Schubert. A présent je vis seulTout seul dans ma demeureGabrielle est partie et n'a plus sa raisonDans sa chambre au Touquet elle reste des heuresAuprès d'un grand bocal où frétille un poissonEt moi j'ai dit à MargueriteQui est ma vieille cuisinièreNe me faites plus jamais de truiteÇa me donne de l'urticaire. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chancer Posted February 15, 2012 Share Posted February 15, 2012 [quote user="sweet 17"][quote user="Loiseau"] [/quote]Of course now, my neighbour, with whom I go to excercise class twice a week and we are on "tu" terms and are good companionable friends, says bonn-uh nuit to me.[/quote]Isnt that because its a feminine noun?I always emphasise the bonn_uh (bonne) on a feminine noun to differentiate it from bon.Tray bon is about the limit of the vocabulary of most Brits around here and it really grates with me when I hear très pronounced as tray.Of course if I understood phonetic spelling there would be no need to misinterpret tray or tri.Adding an uh to the end of a word is just affected speech in my opinion, a bit like an enthusiatic bingo or darts caller, - "Cinquant-uh huit-uh!!The one that I simply cannot stand and seems to be 95% of the vocabulary of the people around here is the interminable "euuhh', it drives me potty as with the Picard accent they just sound like morons that cannot string two words together, come to think of it...................... [;-)]Do you remember the adverts for Cadburys fingers, the one where the older brother is supposed to be sharing the treat with his younger brother but cons him? The little boy whom I am sure was picked because he was a halfwit said, - "Deuuhh I wish I was as clever as you Brian!" Henceforth amongts my pals anyone a few bricks short of a load was known as a "DeuuhhBrian", from the way they speak and that includes the radio presenters who are by far the worst, they are all DeuuhhBrians around here.Sometimes I watch people on the telly and try to repeat every euuhh, I honestly cannot keep up with them sometimes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mint Posted February 15, 2012 Share Posted February 15, 2012 Très drôle, Norman, but how am I going to be able to listen to the trout quintet again without giggling? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Patf Posted February 15, 2012 Author Share Posted February 15, 2012 I enjoyed that Norman [:D]So next time I buy some fish I'll definitely say "la truit-UH." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mint Posted February 15, 2012 Share Posted February 15, 2012 [quote user="Chancer"]Isnt that because its a feminine noun?I always emphasise the bonn_uh (bonne) on a feminine noun to differentiate it from bon. [/quote]I don't think that's the reason, DeuuhChance!After all, "bon" sounds NOTHING like "bonne"!And then they say Charl-uh de Gaull-uh........and HE's definitely not a feminine noun? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chancer Posted February 15, 2012 Share Posted February 15, 2012 Charles is an odd one, I always want to make a liason and say CharlessAsnavour but its pronounced Charle Aznavour.Bon sounds exactly like bonne when it comes from the mouth of an Anglais [:P] Its one that I constantly have to practice hence my emphasis.Je te souhaite une bonnuh nuit et euhhh.............., bon dodo [;-)] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
idun Posted February 15, 2012 Share Posted February 15, 2012 But you can say 'tray' with a french accent, or at least the best french accent a person can really really, or was that really really really try to do[Www].If I can say it, I do try and roll my 'r's'.I have pm'd you Chancer Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loiseau Posted February 16, 2012 Share Posted February 16, 2012 I know what you mean about the euhhhhhhhhhhhh, Chancer! I think it's a way of hanging on to control of the conversation while the speaker does some thinking.Here in the Vendee, what drives me mad is the way many people say "hein?" at the end of every sentence! Sometimes dropping a few into the middle, too."C'etait difficile, hein?" "C'est bon, hein?"Angela Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chancer Posted February 16, 2012 Share Posted February 16, 2012 I think you could be correct as I am constantly interrupted.What about "Quoi!" as in "you know!" or "innit!" that has become quite prevalent but at least they dont say "like" all the time and still use the past tense, in the UK all I hear is "and i'm like whoah! and he's like so what!" to describe a past event. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loiseau Posted February 16, 2012 Share Posted February 16, 2012 Better start polishing up those "euhhhhhh"s then Chancer!Yes, of course the "hein?" and "quoi?" are "innit?" !! I hadn't thought of that! [:D]Loved The Trout, by the way Norman! [;-)] Thanks. Angela Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pachapapa Posted February 16, 2012 Share Posted February 16, 2012 [quote user="Patf"]Thanks for that - sounds like halfway between "e" and "ay." But definitely no "s" on the end.[/quote]There is a "trayzamoosant" in the list.[:P] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mint Posted February 16, 2012 Share Posted February 16, 2012 What I want to know is, does "hein" tagged on at the end of a sentence invite agreement or dissent?[:)]It's a serious question because I'm trying to work out whether it is the equivalent of "pardi".This is an example from a sud-ouest journal:Que faire pour éviter ces coupures (d'électricité)?Consommer moins d'électricité, pardi!As most self-evident truths, this one, as they say is a no-brainer [:D] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
allanb Posted February 16, 2012 Share Posted February 16, 2012 The trouble with this sort of discussion is that we don't know which region the writer comes from.The English word "tray" as pronounced by someone from the south of England, or the Midlands, is not much like the French très; as Norman said, the vowel is a diphthong, rhyming (more or less) with French soleil or bouteille.But I think Norman was wrong to say "typically British." In most of northern England, and in Scotland, the vowel in "tray" is not a diphthong. Most Scots pronounce it as the French would pronounce tré, if there was such a word. And in Cumbria or Lancashire, "tray" sounds quite like the standard French très - apart from the "r" sound, which is a different topic. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mint Posted February 17, 2012 Share Posted February 17, 2012 Strangely enough, allanb, OH and I were on a longish car journey today and we were talking about the diphthong and très!!!Him being Welsh, he doesn't do a diphthong with this word and I, knowing better, don't either.But then, he claims that I say "now" as a diphthong and that he doesn't!Of course, "now" is a diphthong.....me, what do I know? Neither English nor French is my first language after all! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
water rat Posted February 18, 2012 Share Posted February 18, 2012 I am a cockney, so my french accent is abysmal. If I can put a y in anywhere ,I will. A french friend asked me the english names of trees and I heard " maypull' coming back at me. Tres has got to be traie in my world of the glottl stop!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Please sign in to comment
You will be able to leave a comment after signing in
Sign In Now