Too many immigrants?

[jon]

Tegwini....this proves...more or less what I have been saying since I came to this forum a few months ago.

Everyone goes/moves to where they feel they can make things work for them.

I have brought my money here to France and purchased a property...employing French artisans.

Offering my life style exsperiences and culinary skills to those who venture from other countries to enjoy a week or a few days away from their hecting life.People like birds miagrate.

[Quillan]

[quote user="tegwini"]

Thanks to Quillan & others for pointing out that loads of French are now in the UK - recently I read of 400,000.   All to make money & presumably re-patriate it.  Even a few in my small village in southern Wiltshire & some I know at school; one even with a UK grant re-qualifying to teach here- no jobs for her in Normandy.

We Brits bring money into France, employ French artisans, spend our money on house removations, etc & etc

THAT, post must be wind-up, can't possibly be serious!

Tegwini

[/quote]

It probably is a windup.

I think you will find there are nearly double the amount of French living and working in the UK (in general). The thing is you don't hear many English back home going 'Bloody French, come over hear stealing our jobs, buying our houses, earning shed loads of money and then buggering off home with it'. We might do it with the Poles though but then every one does. [;-)]  I think this stems from the fact that unlike the French we are NOT (oops) such a chauvinistic or racist country. [:D]

[raindog]

Yes, I think we've been had with this thread. groslard never turned up yesterday - he was probably rocking with laughter in front of his computer. [:D]

Quillan, you've slipped past the Naughty Word Software with b*ggering - how?

edit: ah, I see now - you're a mod [:D]

[Will]

"...unlike the French we are such a chauvinistic or racist country"

I can't believe you really meant that. Chauvin was a Frenchman of course and although 'racist' is a bit strong, I think few would dispute the fact that the French can be highly xenophopic towards certain foreigners, in a way that would not be tolerated in Britain.

[raindog]

Nobody does chauvinism as well as the French imo.....

[Quillan]

Ooops two mistakes, didn't realise that the b*ggered word would come out, it's nothing to do with being a mod I can assure you.

I omitted the word NOT by accident.

Sorry about that folks.

[raindog]

LOL don't worry quillan - it's a good laugh [:D]

I've been trying to beat the software since last october....

[groslard]

No it wasn't a "wind up."  It's a collection of some of the reasons I have seen on the various fora for leaving the UK.

I wanted to make the point that here the British are the immigrants, and that the similarity of their patterns of behaviour here to those seen by other nationalities in the UK should make people pause and think.

[Panda]

[quote user="groslard"] I wanted to make the point that here the British are the immigrants, and that the similarity of their patterns of behaviour here to those seen by other nationalities in the UK should make people pause and think.

[/quote]

Lucky we have you bfb to point this out to us otherwise where would we be!

[Frederick]

Quillan........My observation is re the Poles taking jobs in the UK  is that the jobs were there for the taking and no body else seemed to be willing to take them.....My wifes old firm is situated on an Industrial Estate where cars with Polish plates can be seen driving round and the occupants get out go into companies  receptions and ASK if there are any jobs going.....The result was my wifes firm had taken on Polish  people from their own door step...Southampton town  buses are now driven by Poles many of them because they could not get locals to work unsocial hours for 26 grand a year !  Personally if I was waiting for  bus I would be delighted to see it come along driven by a Pole or anybody else rather than have it taken off due to no driver ...We have loads of people sitting at home being paid too much in various benefits that are unwilling to re train ......and before I get shot down in flames for saying that ...I take many of them to rehabilliation units for such training ...if they are out of bed in time to go ....and listen to their  moans and dodges on how to get out of going and what a waste of time they think it is ....a job is the last thing they want many of them .

[Just Katie]

Frederick, I for one would never shout you down for that comment.  In my town, you see them donning a surgical collar when they are due for their board on a Friday, then jiving with the wife down the social club the very same evening. [:D].  I think there are far more bogus claimants than geniune which, unfortunately gives the latter a bad name.

I have always found the Poles to be very hard working and polite people. More than can be said about other nationalities in my town.  Now there's a big statement to kick me down over!!

[Tresco]

[quote user="LisaJ"]For a country that is as secular as Groslard is trying to have us believe, there seem to be a remarkable number of Saints days and religious holidays...[/quote]

It seems Pentecost is being reinstated as a holiday. [:D]

So much for fraternite. I loved SNCFs cunning wheeze though.

http://www.forbes.com/markets/feeds/afx/2008/01/29/afx4585050.html

[Quillan]

[quote user="groslard"]No it wasn't a "wind up."  It's a collection of some of the reasons I have seen on the various fora for leaving the UK.
I wanted to make the point that here the British are the immigrants, and that the similarity of their patterns of behaviour here to those seen by other nationalities in the UK should make people pause and think.

[/quote]

OK so lets answer your original post but we have to break it down a little. We also have to assume that your comments are aimed at the Brits because if they are not then you need to CLEARLY SAY SO and apologize.

"Excessive immigration into France by people who have no wish to integrate, who don't bother to learn the language before they arrive, and who set up ghettos where they mix only with others who speak their language."

Although France has the highest immigrant population in Europe is has shown a steady decrease (according to French census data) and is the only EU country to do so (1) with an average decrease of 9% pa since 1990.

Unfortunately statistics are only publicly available from France in 10 year cycles (so the resource sites I used state) and the last set were in 1999. In 1999 there were 3,263.186 immigrants in France and out of these only 75,250 were from the UK which equates to about 2.3% of the total immigrants(2). Just like as in the UK France has had a lot of immigrants from its old dependencies, many of whom speak French from birth. Speaking in a different language does make you 'stick out' from others and even Brits that speak very good French are easily spotted. Thats why we are an easy target for this sort of crap.

On the whole many people want, almost to the point of desperation, to integrate. Admittedly some do better than most but then in the first couple of years they are either renovating a pile of debris (which should have been knocked down really but some cunning French chap has made a few bob on flogging it to some gullible Brit) or getting a business started.

There are some areas of France that the Brits like more than others because of many things like countryside, house prices, cheap ways of getting back to the UK etc. Very few actually pick an area because there are Brits living there, on the contrary many will go elsewhere if they think there is a Brit in the house next door. After all if we wanted to live amongst Brits we would have stayed at home. That's not good for the French economy because its the immigrants that are helping it by driving up economic activity by 2% in 2007 and forecast 2.3% in 2008. Couple that with the decrease of 9% and 8% in jobs over the same periods and the need to reduce wages and manufacturing costs its clear that the immigrants (mainly us spending money in Brico Depot 'renovating' that pile of rubbish you sold us) are playing an important part in helping the French economy (3). I would love to be able to give some hard figures but I think you will find that the extra income from Brits to local councils via Tax Habitation and helped towns out a lot. I can think of a new car park in Limoux and the promenade in Quillan where both mayors have said they could not have built them without the income from the tax's raised from the localk Brits.

Ghetto's, any Brits out there live in any, I would love to know because I have not come across any British Ghetto's.

When English people get together of course we speak English, are you fool. Do you really think the thousands of French in the UK speak English when they meet up, of course not, get a grip. One thing I can tell you that in general the English are better mannered in France as they will always speak French, even amongst themselves, when in the company of French people like playing boules, dinner parties or down the bar after rugby. Quite the opposite with the French in London that I met.

"A refusal to accept the French principal of laïcité, and attempts to impose an alien religion and observances on their communities in their own language."

One can only assume you are talking about other nationalities because there are very few English churches in France, under 20 but unfortunately the list has gone from the Embassy website in Paris. I have yet to see the Church of England hanging out on street corners trying to blag a Frenchman to join. As far as many Brits are concerned I think you will find they are in favour of the French principle of laïcité. Personally it's something I would like to see in the UK.

"Attempts at the destruction of the French identity by people who don't know about French history, don't understand how things are done here, and try to insist that it would be better if it were more like in the country of their origin."

I don't think any Brit is trying to change France, we like France as it is, that's what attracts us to it. Although we are not taught French history to the same depth as a French person I think you would be surprised at just how much French history the age group of Brits coming to France past and present do know.

This is one bit, to be fare the only bit, where I find myself agreeing a little with you although not in such a negative way. No we don't know, when we arrive, how things are done in France. However, if you think any attempts by the Brits to change things have worked I am afraid you are misinformed. In fact the biggest problem France has in Europe is its inability to change hence it's about 30 years behind.

Of course people will say "you wouldn't do that in UK or whatever country you come from" it's natural but it does not mean they want to change things. Again, I am sure the many french that live in the UK say this especially when they are told it costs nothing for their medical treatment [6] .

"Excessive house prices caused by excessive immigration, meaning that young French people can no longer buy houses in their own communities."

Well I think we have covered that in other posts. It ain't our problem mate, its the French for being greedy.

Sorry this is a bit long but it's very important to put some of your myths away else people will start to believe them.

Sources

1 - http://www.brookings.edu/articles/2002/0101france_guiraudon.aspx

2 - http://www.migrationinformation.org/datahub/countrydata/data.cfm

3 - http://www.britishembassy.gov.uk/servlet/Front?pagename=OpenMarket/Xcelerate/ShowPage&c=Page&cid=1068720042861

 

[Quillan]

[quote user="Just Katie"]

Frederick, I for one would never shout you down for that comment.  In my town, you see them donning a surgical collar when they are due for their board on a Friday, then jiving with the wife down the social club the very same evening. [:D].  I think there are far more bogus claimants than geniune which, unfortunately gives the latter a bad name.

I have always found the Poles to be very hard working and polite people. More than can be said about other nationalities in my town.  Now there's a big statement to kick me down over!!

[/quote]

Sorry it was a bit tongue in cheek (the pole comment) just to show how stupid and stereotyping the OP was hence the Smiley at the end.

[Just Katie]

[quote user="Quillan"][quote user="Just Katie"]

Frederick, I for one would never shout you down for that comment.  In my town, you see them donning a surgical collar when they are due for their board on a Friday, then jiving with the wife down the social club the very same evening. [:D].  I think there are far more bogus claimants than geniune which, unfortunately gives the latter a bad name.

I have always found the Poles to be very hard working and polite people. More than can be said about other nationalities in my town.  Now there's a big statement to kick me down over!!

[/quote]

Sorry it was a bit tongue in cheek (the pole comment) just to show how stupid and stereotyping the OP was hence the Smiley at the end.

[/quote]

No, I did not mean the poles were social security scroungers.  Not at all, they all seem to be very hard working in my town and, very nice people too.  The scroungers in my town are mainly people who were born and bred here and, never did a days work in their lives.  Hence, there are plentiful jobs for the Poles to take.